Tennessee Coach's Poll-28 November 2016

[ghouse]

I'm not lobbying for Arlington, I'm only using them as an example.  Truth be told, I'd say Arlington would prefer to go unmentioned. 

 

But to your point, doing "homework" would require a little more than looking at the scoreboard and saying Team A beat Team B.  You must consider other factors, as you also stated in your last comment.  This is not about predicting who will win matches in the 1st week of the season, its predicting where teams will finish.  To many, early season dual scores are irrelevant, other than a little pride, especially with non-district, nothing is really lost.  So, are YOU suggesting that NW and Bartlett should be included in the rankings ahead of Arlington based on a week one match?

 

Ah and now I think we come to the crux of the discussion.  It is always an interesting discussion when you try to distinguish between rankings and predictions.  Rankings are typically "earned" based on tangible results.  Early in the year that might need to be based on last years results.  Predictions would be based on what someone thinks will happen.  

 

I don't vote in the poll and therefore my opinion matters little and I don't know what instruction the coaches are given regarding rankings versus predictions.

 

However, I would prefer it represent a ranking rather than a prediction.  I don't think in any way, shape, or form that this should be based on predictions.  That said, yes I would say any of those teams that have currently beaten Arlington should be slotted ahead of them.  I don't know that Bartlett or Clarksville Northwest deserve to be receiving votes as a top 12 team in the state yet but MBA and Father Ryan probably should.  Were I making predictions about where teams will end, then I think a full strength Arlington team is likely better than some of the teams they have lost to... but that is why you wrestle the matches.

 

If you keep it as a rankings based poll then teams can move up, down, in, or out based on results throughout the season as all of the variables of high school wrestling come into play.  If you are talking about predictions then many might make a prediction and just not change it at all!

 

Were I making predictions about where teams will end, then I think a full strength Arlington team is likely better than some of the teams they have lost to... but that is why you wrestle the matches.

[ArtusCimber]

Well, the best teams don't always make it to the duals, especially in that region. Cleveland finished third in the region behind the first and second place teams.  We couldn't have beaten them in a dual meet, so I had no problem at all voting them above us. That was definitely based on homework centered around looking at how we matched up with them.

 

Last year Bradley was far and away the best, and things got fuzzy after that. Tennessee High lost to us for the conference championship but beat us twice after that. The state duals semis was by a handful of points.  After the bears there were probably a dozen teams that, if brought into a gym on five different weekends, would have seen five completely different results.

 

Our poll is still the most objective one in the state. 

 

I'll pass your comments on to my people, and I'd ask in return that you temper your disparagement of them a little. These people are really experienced and objective.

[mosport]

I appreciate the fact that you expect your teams to earn their way into the rankings but since you mentioned last year, I must also discuss. 

 

Voting on "legacy" teams is real.  Lets take last years coaches poll, following state duals they had Cleveland listed 3rd in AAA!  Yes that's right, Cleveland, a team that didn't even qualify for State Duals.  So unfortunately I must again say, your poll lacks in validity.  You can surmise all you want but Cleveland DID NOT earn that ranking! 

 

Are these the same people still being polled?  Maybe you should suggest everyone in your poll group should have similar standards as your own. 

 

Didn't Cleveland have to face Bradley and Soddy to get out of their region?

[ArtusCimber]

They did. But they were arguably third best dual team in the state in DI.

[mosport]

They did. But they were arguably third best dual team in the state in DI.

agreed.  That region is just too strong, there will always be tears for some excellent teams

[ObserverW]

They did. But they were arguably third best dual team in the state in DI.

Legacy team. Paper champion with no hardware.

[sda4vols]

4 out of the top 12 plus 3 more that received votes will be at Pat Welsh Day of Duals.  Wrestling starts at 10am at Tullahoma High School this Saturday, 3 Dec.

Teams will be: Baylor, Cleveland, Cookeville, Oakland, Ravenwood, Stewarts Creek, Soddy Daisy, Tullahoma, Walker Valley, and Wilson Central.

[WrestlingGod]

Legacy team. Paper champion with no hardware.

Surely you're trolling and don't actually believe this.

Edited November 29, 2016 by WrestlingGod

[ObserverW]

Surely you're trolling and don't actually believe this.

 

Not only do I believe it, it is fact.  The Kansas City Chiefs don't get to claim that they were the 2nd best team in the NFL last year, it was just unlucky that they happened to be in the same division as Denver.  That's not the way it works.  No matter how many people wanted KC or Cleveland to be there, the fact is, they didn't make it.  They should not be ranked there, maybe its not fair but such is life. 

[texas23]

clearly, someone does not understand how the dual championship really works.

[WrestlingGod]

Not only do I believe it, it is fact.  The Kansas City Chiefs don't get to claim that they were the 2nd best team in the NFL last year, it was just unlucky that they happened to be in the same division as Denver.  That's not the way it works.  No matter how many people wanted KC or Cleveland to be there, the fact is, they didn't make it.  They should not be ranked there, maybe its not fair but such is life. 

Well they lost in the second round of the playoffs so that argument doesn't really make any sense. I get what youre saying though. However, its already been said that the rankings is not a prediction of where each team will end up at the end of the year. Its a list to show the strongest teams in the state.

[cbwrestler10]

Not only do I believe it, it is fact. The Kansas City Chiefs don't get to claim that they were the 2nd best team in the NFL last year, it was just unlucky that they happened to be in the same division as Denver. That's not the way it works. No matter how many people wanted KC or Cleveland to be there, the fact is, they didn't make it. They should not be ranked there, maybe its not fair but such is life.

Opinion - "Cleveland should not be ranked 3rd in the state poll"

 

Fact - Cleveland finished tied for 3rd place two weeks later in the State Individual tournament. Compared to the chaos we have seen in this years college football ranking, I would say the voters were pretty spot on.

 

Say what you want about the team "earning" a ranking at the dual tournament, but Cleveland earned their finish at the individual tournament. If you want to get more into opinions, some might say they could have performed even better if they came from a region where they could qualify more wrestlers

 

 

ObserverW, I would advise you to just stop now