160AAA

[werazzlin]

Another weight class of Unknowns. 

Fowler (blackman) is highest finisher from last season. Rippy (Beech) will be here as well. Diehl (Science Hill), Graham (Rhea County), Quinn (MtJuliet) if he is at this weight. Gonzales (Rossview) could be here as well. Miller (West Creek)???

Too many unknowns as to who is here so i can just give these names.

Edited October 4, 2017 by werazzlin

[salterjd]

This is just a personal guess,, but I think Jay Graham will be at 152. Looking at this frame (last year), and the fact he has been 152 the last two years. I would think he can get there again. Not to mention, he would have a much better shot of making the finals at 152 with all these other guys at 160.

[KingGreene]

To go along with what Salter was saying, I think Quinn will go the other way to 170. He seemed like a big 160 last season. But that's also just a complete guess. Chase was kind of a small 160, so everyone looked big compared to him. Regardless, Quinn will be a high medalist wherever he is. That kid is good. Chase squeaked out 2 OT matches against him last year (one being the blood round at State).

Also, to continue what Salter mentioned in the 170 thread: If Fowler, Rippy, and Diehl do all end up in this weight (and assuming they all win Region), an interesting question is how would that be seeded? Roberts and I were discussing this a while back and weren't 100% sure on the answer. Here are the facts: 

Fowler has the highest finish in 2017 (2nd at 152) and also a state medal from A-AA his 8th grade year in 2015 (5th at 132). 

Rippy has the highest finish and most medals of all the three including 1st place 2016 and a pair of 3rd place finishes in 2015 and 2017. 

Diehl only has 1 medal but finished the same place as Rippy last season (3rd) at a higher weight class which is typically a seeding tie breaker from my understanding.

 

If they go solely by last year's performances I assume it will be: 

1- Fowler 

2- Diehl 

3- Rippy 

However, it seems silly to ignore the fact that Rippy is a previous state champion and drop him all the way to 3rd. I'm not sure how TSSAA would handle that. Anyone have a better understanding of the seeding criteria in this situation? 

[salterjd]

30 minutes ago, KingGreene said:

However, it seems silly to ignore the fact that Rippy is a previous state champion and drop him all the way to 3rd. I'm not sure how TSSAA would handle that. Anyone have a better understanding of the seeding criteria in this situation? 

I didn't think about that, and i do not know how that would shake out.  Here is the written rule. Its interesting how it reads. One could argue, Rippy would fall into criteria 4, which says apply criteria two from two years prior. However, I could also argue he meets criteria 2.

IV. STATE TOURNAMENT (Division I)
A. The draw for the state tournament shall be made by the state office and shall be released after the completion of all regional wrestling tournaments.
B. Wrestlers who meet the qualification shall be placed in each weight division in the state tournament. In order to be placed, a wrestler must be a regional champion and must have been a state place finisher during his high school career. The criteria for placing shall be as follows:
1. Separate all state champions (includes state champions from other states).
2. The following criteria shall be used to separate state champions: (a) state champion at same weight, (b) state champion at higher weight, (c) state champion at lower weight. (If there are two state champions at the same weight the state champion from Tennessee will receive the higher seed.)
3. Follow the same procedure as #2 above for 2nd place from previous year, 3rd place from previous year,
4. Items #2 and #3 shall be applied in order to wrestlers who placed in the state tournament two years prior.
5. Blind draw.

Edited October 4, 2017 by salterjd

[werazzlin]

56 minutes ago, salterjd said:

I didn't think about that, and i do not know how that would shake out.  Here is the written rule. Its interesting how it reads. One could argue, Rippy would fall into criteria 4, which says apply criteria two from two years prior. However, I could also argue he meets criteria 2.

IV. STATE TOURNAMENT (Division I)
A. The draw for the state tournament shall be made by the state office and shall be released after the completion of all regional wrestling tournaments.
B. Wrestlers who meet the qualification shall be placed in each weight division in the state tournament. In order to be placed, a wrestler must be a regional champion and must have been a state place finisher during his high school career. The criteria for placing shall be as follows:
1. Separate all state champions (includes state champions from other states).
2. The following criteria shall be used to separate state champions: (a) state champion at same weight, (b) state champion at higher weight, (c) state champion at lower weight. (If there are two state champions at the same weight the state champion from Tennessee will receive the higher seed.)
3. Follow the same procedure as #2 above for 2nd place from previous year, 3rd place from previous year,
4. Items #2 and #3 shall be applied in order to wrestlers who placed in the state tournament two years prior.
5. Blind draw.

 

I think Rippy falls in to number 2. c state champ at lower weight. rule does not say state champ last year... says state champ. But, who knows??

[salterjd]

25 minutes ago, werazzlin said:

i think Rippy falls in to number 2. c state champ at lower weight. rule does not say state champ last year... says state champ. But, who knows??

I agree, but still confusing. So for example wrestler finish 1st in 2015 and 6th in 2016 would get credit for first place finish as priority. However, wrestler who finished 2nd in 2015 and 6th in 2016, would not get credit for the 2nd place finish. That seems odd, but like you said who knows.

[cbg]

Does it really matter where a state champion is seeded at the state tournament?  So they have a tough semi-final match that is on Friday evening, they have until Saturday evening to recuperate.  It's not like the old day's where the semi-finals were wrestled at 10:00am on Saturday and the finals were at 7:00pm on Saturday.  But I am not sure any of this matters as in most instances the cream will rise to the top and the best wrestler will be standing on top of the podium.

[werazzlin]

26 minutes ago, cbg said:

Does it really matter where a state champion is seeded at the state tournament?  So they have a tough semi-final match that is on Friday evening, they have until Saturday evening to recuperate.  It's not like the old day's where the semi-finals were wrestled at 10:00am on Saturday and the finals were at 7:00pm on Saturday.  But I am not sure any of this matters as in most instances the cream will rise to the top and the best wrestler will be standing on top of the podium.

I agree with you cbg just that this is a discussion board.... so we are discussing

[topperpride11]

1 hour ago, cbg said:

Does it really matter where a state champion is seeded at the state tournament?  So they have a tough semi-final match that is on Friday evening, they have until Saturday evening to recuperate.  It's not like the old day's where the semi-finals were wrestled at 10:00am on Saturday and the finals were at 7:00pm on Saturday.  But I am not sure any of this matters as in most instances the cream will rise to the top and the best wrestler will be standing on top of the podium.

It matters if two former state champs end up on the same side of the bracket and none on the other side and one is eliminated from the finals.  

[cbg]

1 hour ago, topperpride11 said:

It matters if two former state champs end up on the same side of the bracket and none on the other side and one is eliminated from the finals.  

Why?  Who cares if you are 2nd in the state.  Believe me when I say that for two returning state champions the only thing that matters is winning another state championship.  Ask the most successful wrestling coach in Tennessee if he cares about anything other than the state championship trophy.  

[mat73557]

I never did buy into that business that the bracket doesn't matter at all. Of course it does! Look at the state tournament.   The strategy is to win one tournament. There's been plenty of number one wrestlers who were defeated at the state tournament partly because one side of the bracket didn't favor them as much as it did the other wrestler.  Just my two cents. And looking at all this, I have no idea how they would be seeded. But I certainly think that Rippy and Fowler are the top two of the listed wrestlers in that class once again

[KingGreene]

7 hours ago, cbg said:

Does it really matter where a state champion is seeded at the state tournament?  So they have a tough semi-final match that is on Friday evening, they have until Saturday evening to recuperate.  It's not like the old day's where the semi-finals were wrestled at 10:00am on Saturday and the finals were at 7:00pm on Saturday.  But I am not sure any of this matters as in most instances the cream will rise to the top and the best wrestler will be standing on top of the podium.

It definitely matters for the guy who has to wrestle that state champ. Getting to wrestle in the finals at the big stage with everyone watching and finishing 2nd is much better than finishing 3rd at the end of the day where very few people are still around to watch. Brackets absolutely matter. Everyone ultimately WANTS to win, but it can't happen for everyone. So if you can't have 1st, you want the next best thing and a lot of times the bracket helps decide that.

For instance, last season Chase Diehl ended up on the same side of the bracket as Sells (the eventual champ) and Gregory (who put Chase in the consolations, and then lost to Chase for 3rd). The person who came through the other side of the bracket was Adkins (who Chase had beaten twice) defeating Garrett in the semis who Chase had also beaten. So yeah, it would have been nice to be on that other side with guys we had already beaten. Not that we would have definitely been able to win those matches again. But if we were able to come through that side and get our shot against Sells and then be able to say he was a state FINALIST as a sophomore in a class full of seniors instead of a 3rd place finisher. That slight change of words makes a world of difference to guys who can't win state every single year. 1st place isn't the only place that matters. 

So it'll be interesting to see how this plays out and which two end up in the semis together to find out which one will not be able to make the finals and have to settle for third at best!