briandrinkwine

Hey there, We're hosting this year's Nashville Western Division Tournament for middle school wrestling & I'm looking for someone to act as tournament director using trackwrestling. Know anyone who might be interested? The date is February 4th at HG Hill Middle School in Nashville. Coach Drinkwine HG Hill Wrestling

No, I agree that quantity does not equal quality. However, it does necessitate it. You can't build a strong wrestling contingent without growing numbers. Take a look at the top wrestling teams in the state and I'd be willing to bet that they have a significantly higher number of participants than the lower teams. Numbers do no equal greatness, but there's no such thing as a great program without any wrestlers. In the same way, participation rates DO have a direct effect on the overall quality of wrestling in the state.

I would also add that wrestling has declined significantly over the past 2 decades in the United States, so even if there are the same amount of programs in TN, this would be an accomplishment for our state considering the national trend.

On a side-note, I'm not sure about the assumption that D-I coaches were "for" the split. I know almost nobody that thought it was a good idea. The reality is that this was a sad consequence of people making poor ethical choices. We must keep in mind that while coaches and wrestlers were at the center of the controversy looming around the split in the late 90s, nobody really wanted it. Most people just wanted to see things done more equitably. Pointing fingers and calling people weak is hardly helpful.

This is actually a very good question. I have wondered before if the splitting up of divisions has given rise to more smaller schools creating and/or growing their programs. In middle school wrestling, this actually does have a positive effect. Basically, smaller ponds make it more motivating for coaches to grow full lineups, compete in the offseason, etc. Granted, it doesn't make for as spectacular of an end-of-year championship, but the overall effect on participation is a positive one. I'm curious to know how many programs we have in the state of TN right now. The year of the split, there were 95 programs in D-I and 15 in D-II. What about now? The TSSAA website doesn't make it easy to figure this out.

Thanks Thadd. Yes, the seasons are a little offset. Metro is starting its season halfway through Williamson's, which makes alignment very difficult. Our season ends at the same time as the high school season's Region Tournaments, usually the first weekend in February.

I think something like that would be totally doable. I could see it being easier for metro teams to participate in a post-season tourney hosted by another organization than to have other teams come participate in theirs. I know we do see other school's teams come to tournaments. Last year there were a couple teams from outside metro at a dual tournament. But they weren't club teams.

The only thing about competing against clubs is that I see no way around it. That would be something that would have to be an exception for wrestling, because no other sport allows it, even in most other counties (i.e. when does a high school soccer team ever compete vs a U-18 AAU team?). It's great to say to compete against the best, but it's hard to see a school district allowing school-based teams to compete against club teams, most likely because the club teams would have to be willing to undergo the same liability constraints as the school system's requirements, something that they aren't designed to do.

Getting 6th grade added was a huge step forward.

True. We got 6th grade added last year. Until that, it was only 7th-8th.

Dude, I feel ya on MLK & Hume Fogg. And to think that MLK doesn't even have a middle school program now. Really stinks. They're great schools. The family is doing well. Hope to see you at State!

I agree. One of the challenges is the lack of off-season programs in the urban core. Maybe some of our coaches can collaborate to create such a thing, but it's going to take some effort. I'm excited that there might be some coaches in our area that could spark something like that, but we'll just have to wait and see.

Hey Sean! Metro HAS begun allowing non-faculty coaches. I'm one of them. They also recently moved to a different stipend system that pays coaches a lot more. Hopefully that will help attract higher quality coaches. I understand the broader issue of school quality also. Many schools can't keep kids because parents are too concerned for their kids' well being, and I just can't argue with that. That said, there ARE some very good schools in Metro, but they aren't celebrated highly. Some schools in Metro are way better than their ratings suggest, because most ratings center on community perception and test scores, neither of which measure teacher quality as much as the student population zoned for that particular school. There are some amazing studies that have been done revealing how many of our suburban schools excel not because of quality teachers and administrators, but because of a higher percentage of invested students. In that case, we measure the quality of the students more than the quality of the school itself, and it masks what's really going on. I know that, for myself, I would definitely put my kids in some of the schools here, but that also depends on if I can get my kids into the schools I want. I know that's not for everyone and, as a parent, you have to make decisions for your kids based on your vision for them and I would never want to advocate for a situation that is detrimental to your kids' future. It's good to hear from you man. I hope you and your family are doing well. You're great people!

Great thoughts Jerome. I actually grew up in Antioch and always wanted to see AHS grow a strong program. I bet you can! The feeder schools thing is definitely a problem and we've advocated for coaches to be placed in at least one of the schools that feeds into Antioch, but without success. Thanks for pushing and keep it up.

So, I've been wondering about this for a while and wanted to get your thoughts. The wrestling here has been seriously hurting for a while as programs get cut and parents take their kids to the suburbs where wrestling is valued more. I really want to see it change, so I did the only thing I knew to do: I became a middle school wrestling coach. I went to middle school because, interestingly, I don't think becoming a high school coach would have helped since the problems start much earlier. I figured with 25 years of experience, I can do something. But, wow, the challenges! Where I coach At the school where I'm coaching (HG Hill Middle School), it seemed when I arrived last year that wrestling was such a lower sport that getting kids to come out was like pulling teeth. I started walking the cafeteria during lunch time to get kids to come out, but many of them literally laughed at me. As an adult, wow was that humbling! But things changed. We got a small core of kids who fell in love with the sport and, in only one year, it has changed dramatically, as we've quadrupled the amount of kids coming out for the team. But that's only one program. Thinking Broadly I began to talk to a couple other coaches last season who want to see the sport grow again in our area. We began thinking of ways we could affect change on a broader level. So I made 5 proposals to Metro Nashville Schools asking for a series of changes, including adding a 75 lbs weight class, adding a dual tournament, etc. Some were approved and some weren't. Then we went and found coaches for dying/canceled programs and we've gone from 17 programs to 23 since last season. It's not a total transformation, but it's definitely a win, and it's evidence that some of our steps are working. Multiple problems The issues with Metro Nashville wrestling are significant. The sport receives very little funding, so most programs are still using outdated equipment and apparel, and most coaches have little to no experience. I have been supplying some of the coaches with technique videos and methods to get higher turnout, but there's only so much you can do. I have also talked to some coaches about starting kids clubs, but most of them are so burned out by the perception that investing is pointless if the kids move to the suburbs or get snatched up by other schools as soon as their talent is spotted. I used to roll my eyes by that, thinking it was just an excuse, but I think many of these coaches really do want to see something big happen, but they're also exhausted. Thinking Different One of the things I want to do is challenge coaches, parents, administrators, and athletes in the area to resist the urge to think of our area as a lost cause, but to see it as a new beginning, an opportunity rather than a burden. There are some coaches in our area that are way ahead of me on this and, quite honestly, are the ones leading the charge. But I feel like we need more than a few good coaches and more money (though, to be quite honest, without those things it's quite an uphill battle). We need a total culture shift. We need the perception of wrestling to radically change in our area. Next Steps In only a couple short years, we're seeing metro wrestling take a big leap forward at the middle school level. But what's next? That's why I came on here. I wanted to ask you, as many of you have watched Nashville wrestling over the past 20 years or so, you may see things from the outside that I cannot see (my "blind spot"). What other things could we do in our area to elevate wrestling in an urban context?