Ineligible player costs Bolton football team

[Pantherbert]

I have numerous conflicting thoughts about this:

 

Bolton should be complimented for self-reporting this. When they did, though, they should have realized that it would result in the forfeiture of 9 games. It sounds as though they expected something different when there is no other option. Still, they did the right thing and should do it next time because that is the right thing to do. We don't applaud that kind of behavior enough any more.

 

After ten weeks, what caused Bolton to decide to investigate this kid? IF someone came forward and reported it then they did the right thing, too, but about ten weeks too late IF they knew about it all along. Too many of us, myself included, have known of suspicious circumstances that should have been reported and turned in (meaning athletes who claim they have moved but you see them every week or so in the same old town/neighborhood). Sometimes it is the "if they don't want to play for us, we don't want them anyway" attitude but that can end up really costing an innocent school, like it did Bolton. We need to report this immediately and quit turning our heads, refusing to get involved. I bet that someone, from Bolton or Craigmont, knew about this and could have reported it early and saved the Bolton team from this.

 

When Bolton decided to check this out, how did they do it? Did they confront the kid or what? It would appear that schools need to inverstigate every transfer thoroughly and it would be interesting, and educational, to know how Bolton managed to find the truth.

 

 

Of course you're right Coacht but I have got to be honest. All what Ronnie did today says that doing the right thing only gets you punished no matter what the cirmustance while the real recruiters get away with it. Even if you're going to punish Bolton I still just don't understand why Bartlett has to suffer with them. Carter doesn't even care and that's what really angers me.

[CoachT]

Of course you're right Coacht but I have got to be honest. All what Ronnie did today says that doing the right thing only gets you punished no matter what the cirmustance while the real recruiters get away with it. Even if you're going to punish Bolton I still just don't understand why Bartlett has to suffer with them. Carter doesn't even care and that's what really angers me.

 

The only ruling available in this case is the one that the TSSAA rendered. If the rules were changed to mirror the college rules then it would be different but that is not the case. You must follow the rules. The fact that it hurt Bartlett is unfortunate but I don't think you can arbitrarily rule any differently. Then Ridgeway would have a valid complaint.

[Pantherbert]

The only ruling available in this case is the one that the TSSAA rendered. If the rules were changed to mirror the college rules then it would be different but that is not the case. You must follow the rules. The fact that it hurt Bartlett is unfortunate but I don't think you can arbitrarily rule any differently. Then Ridgeway would have a valid complaint.

 

 

Coach, first of all you know that above all on this site, your opinion is respected. Without question.

 

 

They really wouldn't though. The frustration is born in that Bartlett earned it independent of the situation, even with the loss to Ridgeway. Likewise, Ridgeway, even with victory over Bartlett, wouldn't have made the playoffs. It's more than "unfortunate". It's wrong.

 

The rules should be changed or at least the wording of the rules to avoid this from happening.

 

 

( and why even bother insulting everyone and taking up time to blow smoke with a hearing if it wasn't going to be taken seriously) I'm just flat out angry right now.

[Opperman]

Perhaps a better title of this thread would be "Ineligible Bolton player costs Bartlett football team".

[Spartansfan]

Spartansfan, I would argue that it's not that easy to be pumped up for game 10 when you know there's a game 11. I know when I was in high school, I would have been looking ahead to the playoffs already. Add what pbert said about resting starters, etc., and it's worse.

 

 

Hi Opperman,

What you're pointing out may well be the case. And certainly, when you plan on resting starters, then at the last minute have to reverse that plan, it would affect the teams performance.

 

There's no way to justify any of this to the players or fans/parents of Bartlett. But I simply feel that a team that had the playoffs locked up regardless of winning or losing their last game (as was the case prior to Bolton's issue) should put their best foot foward and be trying to go into the playoffs with a victory and momentum from that. Obviously the coach opted to avoid the risk of injury by resting starters, and was as concerned about getting that last win, until the Bolton problem was revealed.

 

There's no doubt that some rules need to be changed to protect schools in these situations.

[Pantherbert]

Hi Opperman,

What you're pointing out may well be the case. And certainly, when you plan on resting starters, then at the last minute have to reverse that plan, it would affect the teams performance.

 

There's no way to justify any of this to the players or fans/parents of Bartlett. But I simply feel that a team that had the playoffs locked up regardless of winning or losing their last game (as was the case prior to Bolton's issue) should put their best foot foward and be trying to go into the playoffs with a victory and momentum from that. Obviously the coach opted to avoid the risk of injury by resting starters, and was as concerned about getting that last win, until the Bolton problem was revealed.

 

There's no doubt that some rules need to be changed to protect schools in these situations.

 

 

 

There you have it. There isn't one.

 

It's just not right any way you slice it.

[Rob_M]

No Disrepect Guys, But It would have been One and Done for the Panthers anyway. There is no possible way they would win their playoff game. This isn't basketball where David routinely beats Goliath. This rendition of the Bartlett football Panthers isn't a REAL playoff caliber team. I have a feeling that sooner before later that Coach Armbruster will have his Panthers to the point that the Playoffs is a routine destination.

 

Coach Whitfiled and her Lady Panthers are about to hit the floor for another season of Lady Panther Basketball. With three of her starting five returning they should be a real contender in the Region again this year. In additon, There has to be optimism with the Boy's Basketball Coaching Change. No Offense to Coach Deaton, but He did NOT carry on the Hubby Smith legacy of Success. Maybe the new coach can re-kindle those old flames.

[oknative]

A family deceives Bolton high school by supplying false documents, having the coaches drop the player off at the false address after practice, etc. It isn't discovered until a number of days ago so the school does the right thing reports it themselves and the TSSAA pulls the trigger. I was irrate at Bolton at first but now knowing the facts of the case I just have to say.......... This is amazing. Just amazing. The TSSAA had better get this fixed. They've really outdone themselves this time folks, managing to cheat not one but two teams ( Bolton and Bartlett, that were locked in ) out of the playoffs.3 people do wrong and over 100 take the fall. Great call from the boys in Nashville.

But just because Bolton self-reported themselves doesn't necessarily give them a "get out of jail free". I don't like the fact that the family apparently went to great lengths to deceive Bolton, but they may not escape without penalty.The NCAA did the exact same thing to Oklahoma Sooners face NCAA sanctions last year when they self reported violations. Many praised the diligence of its own self investigation and self reporting to the NCAA, but the NCAA still forfeited all of their wins from the 2005 season and took scholarships. I know that this isn't college football or the NCAA, but ...

[Opperman]

No Disrepect Guys, But It would have been One and Done for the Panthers anyway. There is no possible way they would win their playoff game. This isn't basketball where David routinely beats Goliath. This rendition of the Bartlett football Panthers isn't a REAL playoff caliber team. I have a feeling that sooner before later that Coach Armbruster will have his Panthers to the point that the Playoffs is a routine destination.

 

 

I won't dispute that this year's Bartlett team wouldn't have been likely to advance, but it's not out of the question.

 

But tio say that this team wasn't a real playoff caliber team is *preposterous*. On the field, they were the #3 team in the region and beat the #2 head to head. Millington was out of everybody's league this year, that's fine. But only Bolton played Millington closer in the region than Bartlett did.

 

It's bad enough for Bolton to be punished because they self-reported unknowingly playing an ineligible player rather than sitting on the knowledge for a couple more weeks and just forfeiting after the fact.

 

But for Bartlett to get left out of the playoffs because of a *BOLTON* issue...that's just unbelievable.

[rick7425]

Pantherbert, your frustration is understandable, but your anger at TSSAA is misdirected. As CoachT said, the rule is clear -- even the "accidental" use of an ineligible player results in forfeiture. There is no authorization in the rule for exceptions. There are sensible reasons for this sort of rule (e.g., deterring school officials from looking the other way when eligibility concerns should be investigated; keeping the responsibility for eligibility verification at the school level where it belongs; avoiding the subjectivity and arbitrariness of trying to hypothetically reconstruct what outcomes in games would have been if the ineligible player had not participated). But whether you accept that the rule makes sense or not, it is the rule that the member schools of TSSAA have adopted for themselves. The TSSAA member schools have a process for changing rules they don't like. But until they do, it is the job of Ronnie Carter and the Board of Control to enforce the rules as they are written. To say that Ronnie Carter didn't care is presumptuous and, I dare say, wrong. To criticize the Board of Control for an appeal that supposedly wasn't taken seriously is wrong as well -- it was the school's right to appeal, the school made that choice, and five members of the Board assembled on short notice to hear whatever Bolton wanted to present. Those Board members are school principals. They know that this sort of situation could just as easily occur at their schools. They assuredly took the Bolton officials seriously.

 

This is an unfortunate situation for both Bolton and Bartlett, but not one for which TSSAA officials are to blame. The schools choose the rules by which they will regulate their competition, and the TSSAA officials have simply enforced those rules. That is their job. I'm sure they all feel badly about it, but they were not free to ignore the unambiguous rule that the schools have adopted for themselves.

[ridge]

Colonel Jessep in Nashville ordering the Code Red.

 

 

Pantherbert, DO YOU WANT ANSWERS ?

[kwc]

You're correct about looking ahead. A lot can happen( shoot, just look at this thread /roflol.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":roflol:" border="0" alt="roflol.gif" /> ) but White Station and Millington are the 2 best teams in this area. It's a game I'd love to go see.

 

 

Whitehaven is just as good as both Millington and White Station. Assuming that Millington beats Whitehaven is very dangerous. I for one think that Whitehaven will go to Millington and win should they make it to the second round.