Webb forfeit win? Someone please explain this to me

[RedRobin1]

Webb's enrollment is 425.

In the interest of accuracy, the following is from the web site of The Webb School:

 

Current Student Enrollment

School enrollment for the 2013-2014 academic year is 1,032 students.

• Lower School (Grades K-5) – 266 students

• Middle School (Grades 6-8) – 297 students

• Upper School (Grades 9-12) – 469 students

 

For purposes of comparison, the enrollment of the district schools that Webb played/plays during the 2013 regular season (per TSSAA web site) is as follows:

 

Friendship Christian: 217

DCA: 237

BGA: 324

Ezell-Harding: 230

King's Academy: 168

 

Webb was also scheduled to play a district game against Mt. Juliet Christian Academy (enrollment: 123); MJCA chose to forfeit rather than subject themselves to a beatdown.

 

For purposes of comparison to schools that are, imho, much more similar to Webb, Ensworth's high school enrollment (again, per TSSAA.org) is 422 while BA's is 473.

[ExSpartan]

Robin... thanks for the correction. I missed it by 45.

 

Since you trot Ensworth and BA out there for comparison sake... I'd be curious to know the per year average percentage of male upper school students who participate in football at those schools compared to Webb. I would also like to know the percentage of players on each schools' roster who receive need-based financial aid.

 

When you come back with those facts, as you are very adept at investigating facts like this, I'd like to hear your opinion on what you found.

[RedRobin1]

Robin... thanks for the correction. I missed it by 45.

 

Since you trot Ensworth and BA out there for comparison sake... I'd be curious to know the per year average percentage of male upper school students who participate in football at those schools compared to Webb. I would also like to know the percentage of players on each schools' roster who receive need-based financial aid.

 

When you come back with those facts, as you are very adept at investigating facts like this, I'd like to hear your opinion on what you found.

You're welcome - you missed it by about ten percent.

 

Per the respective schools' web sites, Webb has 168 students who receive need-based financial aid, Ensworth has 132 students who receive need-based financial aid. I can find no information regarding BA. Per a recent article in the Tennessean, Ensworth has a total of 45 football and boys and girls basketball players who receive some financial aid; BA has 74 football and boys and girls basketball players who receive such aid. MBA has 31 football and boys basketball players who receive financial aid (they obviously have no girls basketball players). I have no idea what Webb's numbers are; my guess is that they are comparable, since the raw financial aid numbers are comparable. More importantly, and more in keeping with the theme of this thread, what do you think the numbers are for Webb's "rivals", such as Mount Juliet Christian Academy, King's Academy, Ezell-Harding, Friendship Christian, etc.???

[BlahBlah1]

Webb's enrollment is 425.

That's a pretty good number. I know a lot of the DIIA teams in Nashville are much smaller than that.

[buchunter]

DII-A is becoming more competitive every year. Instead of voicing this complaint, other schools in the classification should work to emulate Webb's success. The Spartans are a better fit for this division than they are DII-AA, but they aren't a great fit for either.

So if I understand what you say:   the schools in DII A need to suck it up, quit complaining & get competitive with a school with double their enrollment, where as on the other hand the Green team should not have to do the same with schools with similar enrollments? Why do you say Webb is better fit for DIIA when their enrollment #s are more in line with the DII AA. Should they not try (as you say the other schools should do) "work to emulate (insert school)'s success"

[buchunter]

Webb just doesn't have the participation rate of the 200 or so boys in school to provide enough depth to play up and compete at the AA level. A roster of 35 kids, including freshman, will not get it done in AA.

So you had rather play against competition that has about 1/2 as many boys in the school & the vast majority do not choose to play football.  Also, so that your school can have a 5 or 6 TD lead at halftime each game  to determine your district?  The TSSAA should go to 3 divisions in DII, 0-199, 200 - 299, 400 & above. 

[ExSpartan]

Per the respective schools' web sites, Webb has 168 students who receive need-based financial aid

 

More importantly, and more in keeping with the theme of this thread, what do you think the numbers are for Webb's "rivals", such as Mount Juliet Christian Academy, King's Academy, Ezell-Harding, Friendship Christian, etc.???

Of the 168 students at Webb receiving need-based financial aid, I will go on record and say that no more than 7 on the football roster of 35 receive it. Add to that boys/girls basketball is around the same combined. The vast majority of Webb's student body who receive aid are not athletes.

 

Those schools you mentioned are not Webb's rivals by any means. Knoxville Catholic and CAK are what I consider to be their rivals.

 

At any rate, I do agree that Webb should play a much more competitive schedule. Quite frankly, their division games, for the most part, have been lopsided and prove nothing really. Candidly I'm sure David Meske would rather have a more challenging schedule in D2 but not to the extent that they would have to play in D2AA.

 

They are left with two divisions to choose from... a non-competitive regular season and challenging semi-final/final in D2A -or- a brutal regular season and no-chance at the playoffs in D2AA. What would you do?

[WesVLT]

So if I understand what you say: the schools in DII A need to suck it up, quit complaining & get competitive with a school with double their enrollment, where as on the other hand the Green team should not have to do the same with schools with similar enrollments? Why do you say Webb is better fit for DIIA when their enrollment #s are more in line with the DII AA. Should they not try (as you say the other schools should do) "work to emulate (insert school)'s success"

I'm saying Webb is in its legal classification and it's a waste of time to complain about it. That energy would be better spent lobbying the TSSAA for new classification boundaries or -- even better -- figuring out how to beat a team who is simply following the league classification model. Edited October 31, 2013 by WesVLT

[ExSpartan]

The TSSAA should go to 3 divisions in DII, 0-199, 200 - 299, 400 & above. 

 

Actually think that is a real possibility... and if it happens Webb will continue to run their program the same way they do now. The schools' President won't all of the sudden decide to make football a priority and seek to admit more athletes and offer aid so they can build a deeper team with more talent. I wish he would but it will never happen as long as he's there.

[RedRobin1]

Of the 168 students at Webb receiving need-based financial aid, I will go on record and say that no more than 7 on the football roster of 35 receive it. Add to that boys/girls basketball is around the same combined. The vast majority of Webb's student body who receive aid are not athletes.

Please provide your source for the above-stated "facts". Can you somehow tell who is on financial aid just by looking at them, or what? I do not think that your numbers are even close to accurate, but I would be glad to change that opinion if you come up with a legitimate source.

[owlbooster]

So you had rather play against competition that has about 1/2 as many boys in the school & the vast majority do not choose to play football.  Also, so that your school can have a 5 or 6 TD lead at halftime each game  to determine your district?  The TSSAA should go to 3 divisions in DII, 0-199, 200 - 299, 400 & above. 

This (3 divisions) was done for a few years and there is merit to it.  What's one more game on Blue Cross Thursday....no big deal.  They do 3 games on Friday & Saturday.

 

ECS is the Memphis area equivalent of Webb and I believe has the largest enrollment in D2A.

I look at their schedule, and the scores, and I am glad I'm not a fan.  It would bore me to tears.

And it's not too challenging for their players either.

 

But they're ranked #2 in the Memphis CA "Dandy Dozen" and #3 in the AP Division II poll ahead of Brentwood Academy (this joke has already been discussed) so they have something to cheer about I guess....

[ExSpartan]

Please provide your source for the above-stated "facts". Can you somehow tell who is on financial aid just by looking at them, or what?

 

Looks like we'll just have to agree to disagree. I've been very close to Webb School and all of their athletic programs for almost the past 10 years. Of course, I have no documentation or published source that will prove my numbers.

 

It's my opinion... an opinion based on the "fact" that I personally know a LOT more about Webb school and its recent history of fielding athletic teams than you. I know the families involved and their long history of success in the Knoxville area who have kids who have attended Webb School over the years and participated in multiple sports. Do you really believe I would base my educated opinion knowing what I know by looking at someone who is on a team roster at Webb? C'mon...

 

My opinion is the vast number of aid students at Webb are not participating in the big three sports. Also... it is my opinion, Webb has far fewer aid athletes on their football roster than the majority of D2AA schools.

 

I would much prefer the TSSAA create 3 divisions in D2, but until they do, I'm pretty sure Webb School will continue to play in the division they are assigned and choose not to play up. It makes no sense for them to do so based on what I have said previously.

 

I don't like the fact that Webb's divisional schedule is so weak either. It makes for boring football games and gets old week after week with no disrespect to those schools. I'd like to see Webb challeneged more week-to-week but playing in D2AA would be suicide going up against the likes of Ensworth, BA, MBA, MUS etc.