Alcoa vs Pearl Cohn 3A Championship

[workinprogress]

I'm not an Alcoa or Rankin fan. However, it's hard to not respect what either has done. How many state championships did Riverdale have before/after Rankin? I know Alcoa had won several but how many since Rankin took over? Results are results. 

Just my opinion but from the outside Rankin appears to be a very smart coach. He goes where there is some amount of talent, goes where the community and administration supports athletics, and he surrounds himself with great assistants. 

[32hammer]

3 hours ago, CoachingFromTheStands said:

A very true statement many won't say. Rankin is a good coach, but how many times has he been forced to really out coach other coaches to win? Could he have beaten this years Alcoa team had he coached at Austin East, Kingston, Pearl Cohn, Loudon, GP, or any of the other schools? Did he leave Riverdale because he knew what was coming with the other schools? Could he have turned the Cleveland program around? This isn't a knock on Rankin because he does have his wins and championships, but some only see wins and act like Alcoa isn't always loaded.

So you're saying that out of the 400 plus wins Coach Rankin has never had to "Out Coach" another HC? That's not a logical statement. I believe some of Coach Rankins strengths as a coach is the off season prep, the consistency of developing a program, the discipline and efficiency of practice and the high standards that the staff set for even minor details. So yes, he does outcoach other  coaches at least 90% of the time but the key is he does it year round and year to year.

He has an outstanding supporting vast of assistants, a community that supports the program which allows them to have great facilities. Winning and good facilities really help bring in transfers. That is true

"Alcoa has won four straight state championships, and I’m ready to get one because I’m tired of losing,” Would you want a kid to move in and play on your team that did not want to win a state championship or one that was not tired of losing

 

Now I don't think Rankin is the one going out convincing kids to play for Alcoa the program and championships sell itself. True

 

However the people talking to others about their kids would be people not directly involved with the program. I have worked with and talked with numerous parents who have had conversations about jobs and cheaper housing if they want to be in the area and the kids play ball. Never Believe it.

The TSSAA would never investigate or penalize Alcoa. That would ruin their image and show their lack of competence to regulate and manage a system properly. The chance to showcase a coach or program with so many wins across the country would really look bad if he was found guilty. Or they aren't investigated because they are not guilty of anything

Now for those Tornadoes that will get defensive, I apologize if this hit a sensitive spot. I am just looking at this without blinders on. Not sensitive, but it does come across as trying to devalue the years of  hard work the kids put into being as successful as they are. Everyone wants an excuse for the reason Alcoa has been as successful as they have been and its easier to make unfounded accusations than accept the truth.

 

This is not the only program in the area to take advantage of transfers. True. Alcoa has had Middle school players that transferred to other schools and ended up being all state players for that school

 

Like I stated before, Alcoa offers a lot more than other schools which helps it sell itself. With open enrollment as well, unless TSSAA makes major changes to the system, Alcoa will continue to win.

Most schools in Tn are open enrollment

 

Once Rankin is gone, Nix will take over and his energy and ability to see the game and make adjustments will only continue the trend. 

This is all just opinions and observations. I understand my opinion will change nothing and this whole piece was probably a waste of time. Still fun to have discussions, even if I don't post often. Nothing wrong with open minded, polite discussions.

I'll end with these facts. RIverdale hasn't won a title since he left and didn't win before he got there.

Since 1991 every kid that played four years for coach Rankin earned a state champion ring- That's 30 years!

Rankin has won 11 state championships in 14 yrs at Alcoa and is 10 points away from 14 straight.

Alcoa won 7 state championships without Rankin in 35 yrs, yet have won 11 more in the 14 years he has been coaching there.

 

How is that not great coaching?

 

 

 

Edited December 11, 2019 by 32hammer
spelling

[pepvol]

3 hours ago, CoachingFromTheStands said:

 

"Alcoa has won four straight state championships, and I’m ready to get one because I’m tired of losing,”

And that transfer is an outstanding play maker.

Now I don't think Rankin is the one going out convincing kids to play for Alcoa the program and championships sell itself. However the people talking to others about their kids would be people not directly involved with the program. I have worked with and talked with numerous parents who have had conversations about jobs and cheaper housing if they want to be in the area and the kids play ball. 

The TSSAA would never investigate or penalize Alcoa. That would ruin their image and show their lack of competence to regulate and manage a system properly. The chance to showcase a coach or program with so many wins across the country would really look bad if he was found guilty.

Now for those Tornadoes that will get defensive, I apologize if this hit a sensitive spot. I am just looking at this without blinders on. This is not the only program in the area to take advantage of transfer

What a load of Crapola ! 

Edited December 11, 2019 by pepvol

[Throwdeslant]

17 minutes ago, pepvol said:

What a load of Crapola ! 

Well said Pep! 

[rebelwoman87]

21 minutes ago, pepvol said:

What a load of Crapola ! 

 

3 minutes ago, Throwdeslant said:

Well said Pep! 

Same song different year. And for the “5Star blue chips” has Alcoa had any 5stars of late? I don’t recall Maryville having any. I know Dylan Jackson wasn’t rated a 5. Aaron Douglass might have been. 

[CoachingFromTheStands]

2 hours ago, 32hammer said:

A very true statement many won't say. Rankin is a good coach, but how many times has he been forced to really out coach other coaches to win? Could he have beaten this years Alcoa team had he coached at Austin East, Kingston, Pearl Cohn, Loudon, GP, or any of the other schools? Did he leave Riverdale because he knew what was coming with the other schools? Could he have turned the Cleveland program around? This isn't a knock on Rankin because he does have his wins and championships, but some only see wins and act like Alcoa isn't always loaded.

So you're saying that out of the 400 plus wins Coach Rankin has never had to "Out Coach" another HC? That's not a logical statement. I believe some of Coach Rankins strengths as a coach is the off season prep, the consistency of developing a program, the discipline and efficiency of practice and the high standards that the staff set for even minor details. So yes, he does outcoach other  coaches at least 90% of the time but the key is he does it year round and year to year.

Has he out coached some? I'm sure he has. There are plenty of programs that work hard in the off season and even if they were to work twice as hard as Alcoa would never be able to compete. That being said, in the last 10 years Or even 15 years can you think of any games he has really had to out coach a team? One where people are like Alcoa is about to get beat by double digits. I can not. The true test is usually Maryville. Even when Alcoa has the athletes on paper, Maryville usually finds a way to win the ball game. The discipline and coaching is just that good at Maryville. Now I agree planning and preparing kids has a lot to do with it and having Nix on staff is truly a blessing to the program and the kids. That man has a gift. 

 

He has an outstanding supporting vast of assistants, a community that supports the program which allows them to have great facilities. Winning and good facilities really help bring in transfers. That is true

"Alcoa has won four straight state championships, and I’m ready to get one because I’m tired of losing,” Would you want a kid to move in and play on your team that did not want to win a state championship or one that was not tired of losing

Everyone wants athletes to play for them. Things sometimes just seem a little strange, such as people getting jobs and positions just opening up at the perfect time. Could be coincidence who knows. 

 

Now I don't think Rankin is the one going out convincing kids to play for Alcoa the program and championships sell itself. True

 

However the people talking to others about their kids would be people not directly involved with the program. I have worked with and talked with numerous parents who have had conversations about jobs and cheaper housing if they want to be in the area and the kids play ball. Never Believe it. 

That is perfectly fine for you not to believe. It was all word of mouth, and that means it could all be false or have some truth to it. 

The TSSAA would never investigate or penalize Alcoa. That would ruin their image and show their lack of competence to regulate and manage a system properly. The chance to showcase a coach or program with so many wins across the country would really look bad if he was found guilty. Or they aren't investigated because they are not guilty of anything

Now for those Tornadoes that will get defensive, I apologize if this hit a sensitive spot. I am just looking at this without blinders on. Not sensitive, but it does come across as trying to devalue the years of  hard work the kids put into being as successful as they are. Everyone wants an excuse for the reason Alcoa has been as successful as they have been and its easier to make unfounded accusations than accept the truth.

Devalue not at all. Without a doubt them young men work hard. You could see it this year by how #1 was able to move people at his leisure. This isn't an excuse why they are successful. When you have the best players on the field regardless of how they ended up at the school, they work hard, and have good coaches they will win. 

 

This is not the only program in the area to take advantage of transfers. True. Alcoa has had Middle school players that transferred to other schools and ended up being all state players for that school

 

Like I stated before, Alcoa offers a lot more than other schools which helps it sell itself. With open enrollment as well, unless TSSAA makes major changes to the system, Alcoa will continue to win.

Most schools in Tn are open enrollment

 

Once Rankin is gone, Nix will take over and his energy and ability to see the game and make adjustments will only continue the trend. 

This is all just opinions and observations. I understand my opinion will change nothing and this whole piece was probably a waste of time. Still fun to have discussions, even if I don't post often. Nothing wrong with open minded, polite discussions.

I'll end with these facts. RIverdale hasn't won a title since he left and didn't win before he got there.

Was there not a zoning or split in Rutherford County shortly after he left that took athletes away from Riverdale?

Since 1991 every kid that played four years for coach Rankin earned a state champion ring- That's 30 years!

Rankin has won 11 state championships in 14 yrs at Alcoa and is 10 points away from 14 straight.

As I asked before, in those 14 years, how often has Alcoa been the underdog or had less athletes than the opponents? When has anyone ever felt by looking at stats or the players on paper Alcoa would lose? Now I get there is family ties through Alcoa and the bloodline of Alcoa greats continue to live up to the Alcoa brand, which is a major part of the success of Rankin.

Alcoa won 7 state championships without Rankin in 35 yrs, yet have won 11 more in the 14 years he has been coaching there.

In the 90s and the 80s the playing field was more level than it has been in the last few years. The competition was harder for teams in those days as well. Alcoa is a great team and continue to produce great athletes that work hard. That is fact. Which is the main reason he is so successful. 

 

How is that not great coaching?

Don't get me wrong he is a good coach. But I do not believe he could have the same success at other schools in the area. I also don't think other schools in the area love their football the way Maryville and Alcoa do. The support is tremendous and for that, no-one can blame him for staying at Alcoa and continuing to win. Like I have stated before, the facilities, coaching, history of winning, and support of the community is why I believe athletes want to be there and one of the main reasons they are so successful. 

Watching them play this year multiple times, the odds are likely they will win state the next few years. The upcoming youngsters have skill and regardless of bias, there will be more transfers coming in that make a big impact. Not 5 star but athletes that are better than the majority in the area. 

 

 

[BoardHater71]

7 hours ago, rebelwoman87 said:

 

Same song different year. And for the “5Star blue chips” has Alcoa had any 5stars of late? I don’t recall Maryville having any. I know Dylan Jackson wasn’t rated a 5. Aaron Douglass might have been. 

#1 for Alcoa looks like Joey Bosa playing high school football.  That kid is a beast.  If I'm Jeremy Pruitt I'm providing his family season tickets for life.  

[32hammer]

15 hours ago, CoachingFromTheStands said:

 

Everyone is entitled to their opinion. I respect the fact that you have expressed yours in a polite, well thought out and courteous manner.

I, of course, disagree. I feel the objective information supports my side of the discussion and I'm sure you feel the same way about your side.

I have been really close to the program these last four years so I feel I have added insight over someone viewing the program from the outside.

I competed at the state championship level, the national level and the world championship level in different sports. I have been around a ton of coaches and have been a high school coach myself. Now that I will not be around the program as much, I feel I can say without being accused of trying to win favor, that there is no other coaching staff I would rather have for my son than the Alcoa staff. They do things the right way.

GQ was amazing at Maryville, I hear fantastic things about Dereck Hunt and I have friends on the Maryville staff and I hold them in very high esteem as well. Bill Satterfield can turn any school into a state contender within a few years. These are all great local coaches. 

All that being said, I feel I was very Blessed to have these group of coaches helping raise my son and coach him. They invest in the kids, they lead by example and they sincerely care.  I love the smaller community school.

Despite my son's injury his senior year, my son had an amazing high school educational experience and I am forever grateful to the school, the community, the other parents  his coaches and it starts with Rankin. My only regret is I didn't put my older son at Alcoa.

That's the best endorsement a dad can give a coach

 

 

[32hammer]

8 hours ago, howdoitknow said:

#1 for Alcoa looks like Joey Bosa playing high school football.  That kid is a beast.  If I'm Jeremy Pruitt I'm providing his family season tickets for life.  

Carroll, Cox and a few others in that junior class should really start getting interest from SEC level schools next year.

Memphis got lucky keeping Alford after the HC left. #64 and #50 will get some late offers this year. The team that ends up with Eli Mitchell is getting a  steal. #68 can ball.

If Pruitt doesn't offer Carroll, he's making a very stupid decision that he will regret.  I think UT staff is waiting on local kids hoping they can talk them into PWO status since the hope scholarship, etc. helps cover in state cost. Then let them earn a scholarship after they are on the team and prove themselves.

I heard UT didn't go after Elijah Young after he decommitted from Mizz. Why?

[BoardHater71]

1 hour ago, 32hammer said:

Carroll, Cox and a few others in that junior class should really start getting interest from SEC level schools next year.

Memphis got lucky keeping Alford after the HC left. #64 and #50 will get some late offers this year. The team that ends up with Eli Mitchell is getting a  steal. #68 can ball.

If Pruitt doesn't offer Carroll, he's making a very stupid decision that he will regret.  I think UT staff is waiting on local kids hoping they can talk them into PWO status since the hope scholarship, etc. helps cover in state cost. Then let them earn a scholarship after they are on the team and prove themselves.

I heard UT didn't go after Elijah Young after he decommitted from Mizz. Why?

I saw Brandon Warren, Rae Sykes, Braylen Young, Tyler Robinson, Derek Evans, and the big DT from a few years ago (Jonathan Something?) all play and watched them with no bias and rated them all very high as high school football players when I saw them all play.  Carroll rated above them all when I saw him on film and when I saw him last week.  Anyone who hasn't watching him play needs to imagine what Clay Matthews or Joey Bosa looked like playing high school football.  He can play with his hand in the dirt as a 40 defensive end, he can play with his hand in the dirt as a 3-4 defensive end (although I think you waste him there when you do that honestly), and he can play standing up as a 3-4 outside linebacker.  

[32hammer]

3 minutes ago, howdoitknow said:

I saw Brandon Warren, Rae Sykes, Braylen Young, Tyler Robinson, Derek Evans, and the big DT from a few years ago (Jonathan Something?) all play and watched them with no bias and rated them all very high as high school football players when I saw them all play.  Carroll rated above them all when I saw him on film and when I saw him last week.  Anyone who hasn't watching him play needs to imagine what Clay Matthews or Joey Bosa looked like playing high school football.  He can play with his hand in the dirt as a 40 defensive end, he can play with his hand in the dirt as a 3-4 defensive end (although I think you waste him there when you do that honestly), and he can play standing up as a 3-4 outside linebacker.  

Great post. Very insightful.

[FBfan26]

On 12/10/2019 at 9:39 AM, howdoitknow said:

 

That's not even counting the "5-STAR" blue chips that will be sitting in a classroom at AHS sometime after Christmas Break-Easter Break (just in time for Spring Football Practice to begin).  

 

I told a friend yesterday that Gary Rankin is now 439-76 with 15 State Championships.  Alcoa has 18 State Championships as a school and comparing what they return next season to everyone in 3A (heck even everyone in the state i.e. Maryville, Oakland, and Ravenwood) there's no way they will not reach Cookeville again next year and be the odds-on favorite to win a 19th State Championship.  Next year will begin the 5th decade that Gary Rankin has been a head football coach (80s, 90s, 00s, 10s, and now 20s).  If he coaches 5 more years he will easily get to 500 career wins.  He would probably have 20 State Championships at the same time (Alcoa would have well above that as a school).  

 

Only two head coaches have ever reached 500 career victories and they are McKissack (SC) and Curtis (LA).  

My question is why he never left to coach in college? "Rankin"