TSSAA Legislative Council Meeting

[FBMan]

I attended the portion of the TSSAA Legislative Council session where the vote on the Collinwood split proposal was taken, and I think I can give an objective view of what happened.

 

No one other than Mr. Carter and the members of the Legislative Council were permitted to speak. This was not an open forum and this should not have surprised anyone.

 

Mr. Carter acknowledged that the proposal had been under review for a year and had been the subject of a great deal of debate. He stated that the only proposal under consideration was the split--the multiplier concept was simply an idea that the Board of Control could consider when developing a new classification formula. (I believe that the Collinwood proposal required a Legislative Council vote because it invovled a change to the TSSAA by-laws.)

 

One of the members of the Legislative Council asked him to review the implications of approving the proposal. On the positive side, he indicated that it would significantly strengthen Division II by expanding the number of teams and helping the Division II teams on travel. He really did not address the competition issues in any current classification. (I do not believe that it his job, as a paid staff member, to elevate the interests of one or more schools over others, although I know that people may see this issue differently.) On the negative side, he said that travel time and costs would increase significantly, particularly in West Tennessee. He provided some information to the Legislative Council concerning a hypothetical regional breakdown that assumed a split. This was not displayed to the audience. He also said that the TSSAA operating expenses would increase because of the greater duplication and that the member schools should expect the TSSAA to increase its share of revenue from play-offs and tournaments. He said he did not think the TSSAA could take any more from football, but that its share of other TSSAA events (e.g., basketball tournaments) would increase. There also seemed to be an assumption that the greater geographic dispersion of the schools in the event of a split would hurt attendance at some of these events, although I do not believe this was stated.

 

With respect to the vote taken by the TSSAA, he said that virtually all of the Division II schools had voted in favor of a change, which obviously significantly affected the 62% of the member schools that voted for a change of some kind in the TSSAA's poll. The Division II schools then were more divided among what type of change they would like to see.

 

He also reported that Kentucky has a similar and, in some ways, more severe public-private issue than Tennessee.

 

There was not much comment from the members of the Legislative Council. At least one of the members alluded to the question about whether this is a public-private issue or an urban-rural one. From that standpoint at least, it appears the lengthy debate on this topic is causing people to try to determine the true nature of the issue.

 

The bottom line: I got the sense that everyone believes a change of some kind is coming, although not everyone will agree on what the change should be. The TSSAA appears to be searching for a common ground that will help preserve geographic proximity of opponents to lessen travel time and costs but will provide some kind of accommodation to the wishes of a large number of its members.

[krichunaka]

Good Report, FBMan,

 

I'm glad that they're suddenly concerned with the added travel expenses, while considering the highly unlikely "change." "Especially in West Tennessee;" give me a break.

 

Unaka and Jellico are in the same district. It's only about 200 miles-plus from one to the other. Cosby to Unaka is only a little over 100 miles. For Cloudland it's even farther to both places.

 

So, pick your poison: Play, and lose.... to the "more local" teams, or be lumped into a district that makes little-to-no geographical sense. So, for those who think that this change - or no change at all - will give advantages to the rural publics; well, I'm preaching to the choir.

 

Happy Holidays!

[VolunteerGeneral]

Krichunka...consider this. A split would only help a small handful of 1A public schools. In fact it is very few. Most 1A public schools would see no real change at all. However the adverse affects rise all the way up to 5A. Yes there are some bad travel situations now, but taking away schools (private) would only make that situation worse. That doesn`t make much sense.

[Antwan]

Krichunka...consider this. A split would only help a small handful of 1A public schools. In fact it is very few. Most 1A public schools would see no real change at all. However the adverse affects rise all the way up to 5A. Yes there are some bad travel situations now, but taking away schools (private) would only make that situation worse. That doesn`t make much sense.

All of these public schools would not have to compete with the privates in the playoffs. If you call that a few...then so be it. You could also add about 15 teams to the list if 4 classes were adopted.

 

69 Tennessee School for the Deaf

159 Oakdale High School

161 Greenfield High School

176 Tennessee Preparatory School

179 Copper Basin High School

181 Sunbright High School

194 Coalfield High School

199 Red Boiling Springs High School

207 Gleason High School

219 Cloudland High School

224 Lake Co. High School

233 Bruceton Central High School

245 Midway High School

248 Jo Byrns School

253 Huntland High School

255 Greenback High School

255 Lookout Valley High School

261 Moore Co. High School

264 Cornersville High School

266 Celina High School

270 McEwen High School

274 South Pittsburg High School

277 Watertown High School

288 South Fulton High School

302 Gordonsville High School

302 Cascade High School

304 West Carroll High School

324 Collinwood High School

332 Perry Co. High School

338 Whitwell High School

339 Middleton High School

343 Unaka High School

346 North Greene High School

347 Forrest High School

348 Jellico High School

349 Wayne Co. High School

349 Mt. Pleasant High School

349 Monterey High School

354 Cosby High School

359 Powell Valley High School

359 Oneida High School

361 Halls High School

 

Football Division I Class 2A

Enrollment School

364 Rockwood High School

369 Mitchell High School

384 Tyner Academy

384 Dresden High School

386 Manassas High School

386 Alcoa High School

387 Adamsville High School

390 Trousdale Co. High School

394 Houston Co. High School

396 Huntingdon High School

398 Harriman High School

403 East Robertson High School

415 Wartburg Central High School

423 Westmoreland High School

425 Richland High School

428 Peabody High School

429 Bledsoe Co. High School

429 Hampton High School

430 Westside High School

433 McKenzie High School

438 Jackson Co. High School

442 Union City High School

449 Polk Co. High School

463 B. T. Washington High School

467 Tellico Plains High School

476 Upperman High School

489 Sweetwater High School

501 Decatur Co. Riverside High School

507 Oliver Springs High School

511 Sequatchie Co. High School

527 Meigs Co. High School

534 Humboldt High School

547 Oakhaven High School

555 Lewis Co. High School

556 South Greene High School

562 Loretto High School

568 Marion Co. High School

575 Treadwell High School

578 West Greene High School

582 Stewart Co. High School

584 Happy Valley High School

586 Camden Central High School

587 Harpeth High School

588 Chuckey-Doak High School

592 Fairview High School

592 Pigeon Forge High School

597 Cannon Co. High School

604 Alvin C. York Institute

613 Smith Co. High School

621 George Washington Carver High School

623 Waverly Central High School

624 Westview High School

644 Milan High School

673 Chester Co. High School

[VolunteerGeneral]

Antwan...you`re wrong. It is only a very few. It`s a nice list you presented, but in reality most of those schools are not good. They won`t succeed whether there are private schools or not. Even some of the better public schools currently in 1A won`t fare any better when teams like Huntingdon and Trousdale are dropped down. Antwan....Instead of losing to good private schools, they`ll lose to good public schools. There would be no real effect on most 1A public schools...period!

 

If I`m wrong then please take a shot at explaining. If not then just drop it.

[Antwan]

Antwan...you`re wrong. It is only a very few. It`s a nice list you presented, but in reality most of those schools are not good. They won`t succeed whether there are private schools or not. Even some of the better public schools currently in 1A won`t fare any better when teams like Huntingdon and Trousdale are dropped down. Antwan....Instead of losing to good private schools, they`ll lose to good public schools. There would be no real effect on most 1A public schools...period!

 

If I`m wrong then please take a shot at explaining. If not then just drop it.

You still don't get it...don't expect you ever will. The vast majority of those schools don't want to play the privates. I have listed numerous times why. It has nothing to do with winning a title. Is that explanation enough?

[VolunteerGeneral]

Antwan...I get it. You don`t. Thevast majority of those teams would not be effected. It doesn`t matter nor do I care if they don`t want to play them, that has nothing to do with it. The fact is the VAST MAJORITY won`t be effected.

 

Again if I`m wrong then give it your best shot to explain...I`ll listen. But not wanting to play them does not cut it.

[Antwan]

Antwan...I get it. You don`t. Thevast majority of those teams would not be effected. It doesn`t matter nor do I care if they don`t want to play them, that has nothing to do with it. The fact is the VAST MAJORITY won`t be effected.

 

Again if I`m wrong then give it your best shot to explain...I`ll listen. But not wanting to play them does not cut it.

Nah...that's just not the answer you want to hear...so you dismiss it. You don't listen if someone says something you don't agree with. We don't want to play the privates because they have an unfair advantage. It has nothing to do with winning a title. By your logic...only a few teams have a chance to win. Why not have just one class. Only a few teams would be affected by that. The VAST MAJORITY of teams aren't going to win anyway...right?

Edited December 23, 2003 by Antwan

[Chakra20]

Antwan what he is sayin is that prolly somewhere in neighborhood of 90% of the schools it wouldnt effect them. The only effect would be the names on the front of the jerseys of the school that where kickin their butts.

Edited December 23, 2003 by Chakra20

[CYJacket]

Antwan...you`re wrong. It is only a very few. It`s a nice list you presented, but in reality most of those schools are not good. They won`t succeed whether there are private schools or not.

If I`m wrong then please take a shot at explaining. If not then just drop it.

General, you are wrong in the 1a list alone I found 10-11 teams that are in contention in their region year in and year out. So yes they are very good, just small. The privates do have an advantage and we have discussed this ad infinitem in the past, so I won't go there.

Now, antwan, be advised that Powell Valley High School is now Cumberland Gap High School and combined with Forge Ridge High School.

[TheEgoHasLanded]

Antwan,

 

I would believe your statement "we don't want to play the privates because of their advantages"

 

IF...some of the 1A and 2A schools didn't have the same advantages.

 

Alcoa...Great school district, more football state championships than 95% of the teams out there...and oh yes, OPEN ZONED.

 

Tyner...Magnet, free, great football team, best football player in the state in Demonte Bolden...OPEN ZONED.

 

Someone also said that South Pitt is open zoned? I don't know, I've never been there, but if that is true, then you need to explain yourself.

 

We could also talk about all the Memphis City schools such as Mitchell High School in AA. They went to the state championship last year, have a brand new school, great football coach (former U of M player) and great facilities...their coaches make more money than 95% of private school teachers...in fact the only two private schools who pay their teachers what the city school teachers make are Hutchison and MUS (both D2 schools!!!)

 

Mighty Mighty Mitchell, Carver, and other really good 2A schools would move back down...it would just start all over...you'd be losing to schools that are open zoned.

[GregC]

161 Greenfield High School

219 Cloudland High School

245 Midway High School

255 Greenback High School

274 South Pittsburg High School

288 South Fulton High School

302 Gordonsville High School

304 West Carroll High School

324 Collinwood High School

338 Whitwell High School

349 Wayne Co. High School

349 Mt. Pleasant High School

361 Halls High School

 

All of these teams were eliminated from the 1A playoffs by a private school. Wayne Co. was the only public 1-A school that defeated a private school in the playoffs. Plus, Perry Co, Middleton, McEwen, and Jo Byrns are in regions in which only private schools advanced to the playoffs(7A & 5A). That's 13 eliminated by privates and 4 more who didn't get in because four privates schools finished ahead of them in their region. I hope I didn't miss anyone. If so, please forgive me and correct me.