Is cheerleading a sport?

[Flipn4OHS]

Ok I'm taking Trojan's advice and starting a new thread since she shut us down. JK Trojan I still luv ya! hehe. So let it begin...if i remember correctly we were talking about the "performance" aspect of cheerleading compared to other sports. I agree with you Maryville that football players will play if there is no crowd...the same with basketball too, but like you said when there is a big crowd it gets your adrenaline pumping...and adrenaline always makes you eager to perform better. The same is true with cheerleading...some competitions we go to are so rinky-dink, but I still try just as hard and perform the same. Cheerleading doesn't require a big crowd all it requires is the panel of judges. Of course I DO love it when there is a big crowd it just adds to the intensity, but I believe that is how any athlete feels. BUT I STILL stand firm on believing that when a guy dunks in basketball it is a performance. I mean you said you are trying to prove something when you do it...well WHO are you trying to prove it to? The CROWD. At our games when one of our guys dunks no one is mad or jealous b/c they know they can't do it...everyone goes crazy because OUR team can dunk and the other team can't. It gets everyone pumped up, therefore the reason the guys do it is to prove to the CROWD that they can do it, so they can PLEASE the crowd.

[TrojanSportsFan]

Well for one thing flipn I'm not a she. lol I get that all the time. If you look at my profile and see my pic you can tell I'm not a she.

Edited December 30, 2003 by TrojanSportsFan

[MaryvilleRebels]

Flipn, in sports like basketball, baseball, and football there are personal battles as well as team battles. In football its against whoever is lined up opposite of you. If you play wide reciever and you beat your man deep several times then you're in his head and thats a great thing, you can do anything u want with him...make him look as foolish as you'd like. In basketball its against whoever is guarding you, if they can't guard you then its a real boost for you and a real letdown for them. If you dunk the ball over someone in basketball it shows them your dominance. Especially if you beat them off the dribble then finish it with a hard dunk. In baseball it is against the batter/pitcher. My brother pitches for Maryville College and he is always playing mind games with batters. Its 10 times easier to hit a pitch if you know whats coming, its the pitchers job to confuse you to make you think. If a batter is struck out by a pitcher, they get worried, and they think more. If they hit a home run the pitcher is worried and the batter thinks less. Its all about small mind games, beating your opponent physically will also beat your opponent mentally. This is the entire point of talking trash. If you talk enough trash you will get inside someones head and make them doubt themselves, and thats all you need sometimes (of course sometimes it can backfire too). In cheerleading there really isn't personal battles, unless u consider gravity a personal foe

[Flipn4OHS]

Oh sorry about that Trojan! haha! And Maryville, you are correct that cheerleading is different because there are no personal battles, you don't go head to head with the other team. But I'm confused...are you saying that for that reason cheerleading is NOT a sport, because there are no personal battles? Because if so I don't agree with that. By the way you explained it-a personal battle is when you are head to head with someone, you are close enough to interact with them..touch them and get inside there head, so that would eliminate alot of other sports as well. Gymnastics, swimming, biking, rowing, track and field events...do you consider all these sports? I do.

[MaryvilleRebels]

I was not classifying anything as a sport, I was just trying to further explain why basketball players dunk, etc. Its not for a performance, its because of a mental edge. However; since you brought it up and I like to argue...the ones you listed (all except gymnastics) I would consider sports more than cheerleading. Track and field, in high school a way to get inside another runners head is to ask them how fast they run the race in. When they answer, u should automatically say a time atleast 2 or three seconds faster, and then make it seems like its no big deal. Some athletes will count themselves out right there. In jumping and throwing events its a personal battle with others and yourself. In the high jump I battle my head because i don't want to think about the height (if I think about the height I will miss, makes me nervous) and I am trying not to think about the other jumpers. If you see a guy run up in practice and scissor 5'6" or higher you automatically get nervous. Some jumpers, if they are good enough, wait till the bar gets to about 5'6" or higher before they start jumping, this also gets in the heads of the people who started at 5 foot. Showing confidence is sometimes intimidating. In swimming, same thing...if people know your name, or u tell them "ur" time, you can get in their head. Rowing...well rowing doesn't really rely on personal battles because its a sport of concentration and muscle memory. The guys have to be very in sync and if you're thinking about someone else in another boat its harder to be in sync. I don't think that personal battles make a sport or break a sport, but I do think thats what sets them apart from performances, in some cases.

[Flipn4OHS]

Fair enough. But when you put it that way, do you not think there are personal battles in gymnastics and cheerleading. Tumbling is a constant battle with your mind. People are not made to flip, but gymnasts and cheerleaders do, and it is really scary sometimes and you gotta fight the doubts in your mind or your body won't let you do it. Especially after a fall it is a huge personal battle with your head. I fell on my neck doing a full one time...and for about a month I wouldn't even throw a roundoff back handspring. I got more to add but I gotta go! More later

[MaryvilleRebels]

Well its that way with a lot of things. Really everything can be considered a personal battle...waking up in the morning for me is a personal battle. My body says stay in bed and my mind says get up and my mom just yells! The biggest part of tumbling I think is the mental part. Once you get over the mental part I think most anyone (with a typical body frame) can tumble. Now you have different levels of difficulty where some girls shine and others fall into the shadows, but its that way with everything and its a matter of hard work and the abilities you're born with. Now tht thing that really bursts my bubble about cheerleading is...well...UT cheerleading. UT's style of cheerleading is looks before talent. I know a girl on the UT cheerleading squad and throughout four years of high school I never saw her do a single tumble. She did at one point get tossed in the air, but that soon stopped, really it was more of a stack than a throw. However; the girl looks like she's a barbie doll (only a little shorter) and so she's a definite shoe-in. The idea that looks matter in this "sport" really gets to me. We have sports such as Rugby where guys are missing both their front teeth, and still they don't care because they love the game. You just never hear a basketball coach say, "Well I recruited this guy cause he had a pretty face, he was just a beautiful man!" It just doesn't work, in cheerleading however, a coach will make sure that her team is not only good, but attractive, because thats what judges look for, among other things. This bogles my mind. Being a guy I don't really consider it a horrible thing but I think its a little strange that a lot of the girls are trying to run out and claim that they don't have womens rights and what not when they shoot themselves down in their own "sports." I mean, most cheerleading coaches (especially high school) are women. At this level appearance isn't such a big deal, but it doesn't hurt. I know at my high school you had to make the cut to be on the team, and the girls on the team...well if you asked any guy in our school if we had an unattractive cheerleader he would have said no. Throughout the four years I went to high school two guys wanted to be cheerleaders, both were turned down. They were told to not even come to the tryouts because they wouldn't make the team. Now I am not even going to go into the pregidous card, I am going to look at it a little deeper. The two were excellent tumblers, they would have made the squad that much better, but they were overlooked for some reason. Why, I don't know, I won't even go into the why, but I think that its silly that two excellent athletes were turned down...especially when they have the right criteria for the assignment. You see this happen some in other sports, but I think it happens more frequently in cheerleading.

 

What does this have to do with cheerleading and beign a sport...I dunno, I think I am just kinda rambling, I am sick, you have to excuse me. I am just stating my problem with cheerleading and why I think it is more of a performance.

[Flipn4OHS]

HaHa! Well, Maryville, I hope you get to feeling better, although that may have not been exactly on topic it was a good post, and I agree with you on a lot of points. That's what bothers ME about cheerleading and I AM a cheerleader! Now you are gonna get me on my soap box and this may be a pretty long post. lol. First of all, I TOTALLY agree with you on the UT Cheerleading thing, which is why I am totally against trying out there. I am about 5'4", 110-115 lb, I have brown eyes and short light brown hair. I have all the skills and more required for the UT cheerleading squad, but I'd probably be cut in the final round. WHY? I am TOO TALL! 5'4" doesn't seem that tall, but for UT it is. Oh yea, and I don't have long blonde hair. You don't know how angry it makes me knowing that I could be just as good as the next girl or even BETTER, and she would make it over me because she is 2 inches shorter. It's not fair, but that's how it is...unfortunately at a lot of schools. The average UK cheerleader is 5 feet tall and 90 lbs. At college try-outs they interview everyone, and at some schools you are even judged on the WAY you TALK. Which is ridiculous! Luckilly, I am wanting to cheer at the University of Alabama, and although they have a mostly attractive squad they don't all look exactly alike. There are some blondes, some brunettes, some short girls, some average girls, and some tall girls, etc. I also think it is crazy for those guys to have been turned away at your school. Last year we had 2 guys try-out, neither of them made it. One was cut because of his grades, and the other just wasn't good enough. But neither of them really had the skills to make the squad. If there were a guy good enough at our school to be on the squad that was willing to try-out, they would probably make it and they would atleast be given a fair chance. So I don't know what that was about, and it doesn't seem fair at all. If a girl were to try-out for football you KNOW that if the coach tried to turn her away there would be a law-suit slapped on the school like that. But I do agree that there are a lot of politics involved in cheerleading that should not be there, and you can bet that there is no one it bothers more than the girls that are in it for the sport...not the name.

[MaryvilleRebels]

Glad we finally agree on something! Hehe. I am an all around UK fan, it can be UK's rifle team and I'm pulling for them! Kentucky's cheerleaders seem to be all short because from what I can tell shorter would be easier to toss and catch. The routine Kentucky ran last year most every single girl was in a pyramid of some sort at one point or another. Not to mention in their team picture they weren't just standing there, they made it a presentation. They recruit smaller girls because they want to win, and I guess thats a part of it. Having a natural body style definitely helps. Good luck to you where ever you end up!

[Flipn4OHS]

True. But if you notice Kentucky hasn't been as good in the past couple years as they were about 5 years ago. I mean they are still AWESOME, but they didn't win nationals in 2003 and not just that they barely got 2nd place by a point, and they shouldn't have won in 2002 (my opinion). But I don't think it is just because of the recruiting short girls, but because of other things I have heard that determine whether a girl makes it or not, BUT I won't go into that. I used to want to cheer at UK, and one of my coaches told me when I was in 9th grade that I had the skills to make it....but I KNOW I wouldn't make it there because I'm "too tall". But oh well, I got my heart set on Bama and hopefully that will work out. Thanks...glad we finally agreed on something. haha

[MaryvilleRebels]

Hey, don't let your heart stop you from trying. Their routine last year was very difficult from what I could tell, but they had a few glitches. So the way I see it is that its a give and take and they took difficulty over flawlessness.

[Flipn4OHS]

Yea that's right. But unfortunately they compete at UCA, and UCA prefers flawlessness over difficulty. I mean had they performed there routine nearly flawless they woulda won, but UCA goes for the team that has the cleanest routine, even if it isn't as difficult as another squads. UCA like "tradition" style. It's kinda complicated getting into the styles of all the different companies that put on competitions. But the main 2 companies are UCA and NCA...and to make a long story short if you went to NCA and placed first then went to UCA you probably wouldn't even get top 5.