hsfbinsider10

Have been following this thread with much interest. In the past when a thread has gone this far in its discussion, it's been closed down. I'll just say this, "I told you so." It's not about discipline, being tough, motivation, etc., etc., etc. It's about respect for others and being secure in who you are--two qualities not found in the current HC. When a coach doesn't inquire once about a two year starter not playing the third year or why a player would transfer, that coach is narcissistic to the core and afraid of being challenged to change.

As I previously mentioned on another topic thread, we as coaches and parents should be held to the same standards. Just because I coach your child doesn't mean that you should hold me to a higher "moral" standard than you do yourself. Why do we, as a society, think that a coach, teacher, administrator, etc. should be expected to teach our kids the values that they should be getting at home. Sure, for some kids, coaches are the only adult figures in their lives, but to expect more from them than we as parents are willing to give isn't right. How many parents take, or let their children go to an R rated movie that has profanity? For that fact, how many let them watch TV? Just because they see and hear this on TV or at the movie theater, as a parent are you going to condone them speaking the same way. Most will answer NO! But, will you continue to let them watch the show?

 

I, as a coach, have never cussed a kid, although I have cussed in front of them. Not proud of it and am continuing to watch what I say. I don't let the athletes that play for me use profanity in any form. If they do, they are punished. Does this defer them from using profanity away from my presense, probably not. For me, it's a personal preference not to allow it from the children that I coach. Because I may use profanity as an adult mean that I should allow my athletes or my own kids to do it? No. My point is simply this, stop using the excuse that coaches, teachers, etc. are "role" models and should adhere to a higher standard, and stop using the excuse that kids believe "it's ok because my coach does it". We, as parents should teach our kids that they will have to make choices and hope that they choose the correct ones. If your child chooses to cuss, are you going to blame it on his/her coach?

rc, I agree with you to a point but whether we like it or not, we are role models. Some of these kids do not have a good home life and are looking for direction from some authority figure--coach, teacher, movie star, upperclassman, etc. I've cussed myself and cussed myself for cussing. In this situation, apparently a parent had taught his son that what was happening was wrong--a good thing on the surface--but if the situation was used for personal agendas and the principal overeacted, I too feel badly for Chuck. My whole point has been that we cannot whitewash the situation. Discipline applies to coaches as well as players--that's all.

This isn't about anything like that...it is about treating a man like he is a human being that made a mistake. Parents too are role models...so every time they cuss at home or ground a child are you going to video tape it on the phone and run to Child Services? I don't condone the language he used but there are many a coach out there that put their hands on kids AND use fbombs yet they still are praised for being "role models" mainly because they win championships. Look at the teams record and that is why people are quick to get a coach out for any reason they can...

Settle down oldtimer! If you've read my posts on this, which obviously TLH10 has not (and there's no need to reply to ignorance), I'm not siding with crybaby parents or foulmouthed coaches. I don't know enough about this situation except to say that f-bomb is not acceptable and some action was needed. I have said that the punishment may not fit the crime but it seems to me that some are ready to give a pass without knowing all the facts. Spoiled overprotective parents and abusive coaches both make me sick.

hey insider, i think you have something on your nose. i wonder how long it took you to type out those first few sentences. are you and bigtimeloser done making out yet?

"When ignorance gets started, it knows no bounds." -- Will Rogers

I know some of the parents at Mo' West. One of them is a pastor. I don't know his involvement but I think it doesn't hold water to assume the kid who reported this uses the same language. I know a lot of players who don't and are offended when someone does--what is wrong with that? In this case, not knowing the history, the punishment may well not fit the crime but I don't know. I just think that it is no argument to belittle those of who think that cursing is boorish and as inappropriate by a coach as it is being used by a teacher. The next time a class does poorly on a test and the teacher wants to chew them out and uses the f-bomb, let's just see if they still have job afterwards.

It's amazing how we can just laugh off crude behavior these days. If an ump hears the profanity, the kid is out of the game. A coach should hold the same standard on his players and live by it himself.

Not my fight but "denote" means to signify or to explicitly stand for. While glove's syntax may be a little pressed, there's actually nothing wrong with the way he used the word. Certainly his diction could be better by choosing a more precise word. If you follow these boards, something much worse than poor grammar takes takes place and that is faulty logic. Just because glove's team went through a dry spell doesn't mean that his handle is inaccurate. His fielding percentage during that time may well be 100%. The only way to ridicule his use of "bigtime" is to show that he doesn't deserve the handle because of a propensity to make errors. That's even if he is a player!

Can there be a "standard"? I think the problem is not that of standards but character. Most coaches I know are persons of character but they are not infallible. A coach who continually abuses his or her players lacks character and is teaching that abusive treatment is okay which can translate to the homes, school, work, etc. and a lifetime of abusive behavior. A good coach does not have to demean to discipline. John Wooden (to me) is the greatest coach who ever lived. To be successful, he did not have to be abusive. At the same time, he was tough on his players but respectful to them as human beings. No former player has ever had any bad things to say about him. I do believe that there are some coaches in our high schools that will never enjoy that kind of reputation because they've confused the priority of building winning character in players with winning ball games.

That said, too many parents want coaches to perform miracles because they have not disciplined their children through the years. Or, the opposite happens, and spoiled brats have no idea what discipline is and cry to their parents that a coach actually expects them to behave, practice, and perform a certain way. These kids are destined to a lifetime of seeing themselves always as "victims."

My coaches were the greatest influencers on my life as to what it takes to succeed and I am thankful for them, but my mom and dad never expected them to be substitute parents or to be perfect.

Yes, I too need more info to pass judgment in this case. Too often we rush to judgment one way or the other. While I think we've gotten way too soft and need tough coaches who take no bull, some actions are beyond the pale and must be disciplined (just as players need discipline). I admired Woody Hayes, but when he hit a Clemson player who had gone out of bounds in the Gator Bowl, it was over for him. Many fine people make mistakes but sometimes an apology is not enough. A player who misses practice or disses a coach should not get by with just an apology. Neither should a coach if they did something that requires more. If Stansberry did something of that nature, the best thing he could do is to tell his players that he is sorry and that he is willing to pay the consequences as they stand. This will teach his players a very valuable lesson. We live in a society where way too many folks think that they can get by simply by saying, "I'm sorry." On the other hand, if what he did does not rise to that level, then the principal has taught the players an awful lesson: Whine and you can get what you want.

I'd sure like to know exactly what was said or what happened.

NEWS FLASH.... in this game, IT WASN'T ENOUGH!!

 

So, if you have 3 quality pitchers on your roster, either blame the coaches for not pitching them, or blame the situations that did not allow them 2 be thrown. But, it is not fair to blame Coach Ritz or anyone associated with DB for the things that happened. This is a tournament and the object is to win and advance. Regardless of who did or did not pitch the outcome was decided and what he did was not cheating in any way. If anything, it hurts his own team because it gave Jeff. Co a chance to get a couple runs and extend the game, which the COULD NOT do. So, blame the coaches, players, situations, or whatever else but DO NOT cry and blame Coach Ritz.

It's not about losing--you just don't get it. It's about the integrity of the game and respecting your opponent. We knew where our pitching would be because we made up three district rainouts this week. We knew we'd have a tough time but we did not believe we'd witness what we did tonight. Try to defend it all you want, there's no excuse. Ask anyone who really loves the game (more than having to get in a complete game or whatever reason you may cite). They would never make a mockery of the game and a competitor at the same time.

I really dont understand the argument you Jeff County fans are making here. Look, DB was up by 11 runs, with rain coming in about 10 minutes or less. It is not Coach Ritz's fault that DB was up by so many runs, all he was trying to do was get the game in so they didn't have to pick up where they left off the next day for no reason when the outcome was clearly decided. If you want to blame the game on Coach Ritz then go ahead, but in my opinion, you should be questioning your players for not giving DB a game. Regardless of who you pitched, you only scored 3 runs and that will hardly ever beat a DB team...

 

Congratulations Indians on the win tonight and good luck in the semifinals and finals...

Let's see, we have two pitchers who have an era of less than 1 and another just over 1--maybe three runs will be enough. It was against M'Town West and Bridgewater. BTW, I never said DB didn't play well but not to get all excited about hitting batting practice pitching.

Hey Everybody its Tony Rabbins......

CLASSLESS--when a person runs out of reasonable arguments he/she begins name calling. BTW, "cheif" is spelled "chief" and it's "Robbins" not "Rabbins". And it's "it's" and not "its." And it's "baseball" not "mockery."

not a d-b apoligist but have to say: jeff co. fans love to get on d-b threads and talk smack, but when they go 0-3 in d-b's tournament are full of excuses. When d-b struggled in knoxville, jef co. fans were first to pile on. as for coach ritz, you don't have to agree with everything he does to recognize that he has done an awesome job everywhere he has been. Haters just have a hard time realizing that their son or brother can't hit as well as they thought they could.

I can take the losses--we've never started the season by conjecturing about winning state like many DB fans--we respect Knox teams and know they can play ball. We know who we threw tonight and who you threw. We also know who we didn't throw. And we're not going to play pretend that Gate City threw their stopper or that Happy Valley did. Only DB fans do that. That makes sense and the real test will be later in the year. I have also said I respect Ritz's record--just not what he did tonight. And I don't hate. I didn't put down any DB players--just our own pitching--but you did which is not surprising.

Ok, Obviously you wouldnt have understood what happend tonight b/c you probably didnt no that we in kingsport had a toronado warning meaning that if the game didnt end soon it was going to be posponed, which probably would have been good for Jeff since they still had a chance... Anyway... If my comments show my "ignorance" then I dont want to know how smart you are......... You are just like every other DB hater, you can't beat DB so you find anything you can to hold against them..... If Db would have won by 1 "run" (sorry for the confusion by saying points ) you would have said they are overrated, they barely won.....And when DB destroys someone the coach is classless......haha....... Seriously, I would rather be "ignorant", rather than not have a life, Bc you know the one you do have only consist of thinking of the next way you can put down DB, and thats sad............. My suggestion stop whining and just talk about the players....Or go somewhere else b/c i know no one on this thread wants to hear about how much you hate DB... We try to keep it as positive as possible.....

CLASSLESS--I don't hate DB--I don't hate anything but arrogance and braggadocious fans who do not understand what the game is all about. It's about competition, integrity, playing hard and by the rules. Winning is secondary to respecting the game. Ritz showed everyone what was most important to him. And you, you probably ignore penalty strokes in golf, cheat on your taxes and believe that showing up 16-18 year old kids is justified if you can make sure to get a "W." As for me, I'll keep my integrity and have respect for the world's greatest game.

First of all i was talking about how the players played tonight...... I could careless about Coach Ritz to be brutally honest...... He has nothing to do with what the conversation was about, but we all appreciate the usless peice of information on your philosophy of the game...... I guess playing to win might be a little to much for some people, classless or not, the score was 14 to 3.......

 

Oh and they pitched their 7th, 8th, and 9th ranked pitchers, so........ Its good to know that their #1 pitcher has the power to make up for the 11 points they lost by.... Be sure to give me his name so I can get him on my fantasy team in the next couple years.......

11 points? How about "runs"? Do you understand anything about baseball? I did not bog on the players but ignorant fans like you taking pride in a shameful course of events carried out by your coach. There's nothing wrong with trying to win but if you don't understand the significance of what happened tonight, you should do baseball a favor and start rooting for ice skating. Your comments show your ignorance. BTW, there's only one word for your comments about the pitching: clueless.

Let's see--DB's number one pitcher aginst Jeff's #7,8,9. What effort? It was batting practice for a girl's school! If any DB fan takes pride in what happened tonight, you can only be described by the new word I now have for your coach and his antics at the end of the game: CLASSLESS. The more things change, the more they stay the same. A true ball player would have told Ritz to stick it where the sun don't shine to make outs on purpose and to show up a competitor. Ritz owes Jeff County, its coach and the game of baseball an apology--and if you're a DB fan who believes in the integrity of the game, he owes you an apology as well

Kudos to M'town East in another tough loss to a top level program--this time Farragut. East has played a schedule that more IMAC teams should play in preparation for the post-season play. I think they may catch West or Jeff by surprise.

Is the whining over now? If you had read my past posts you will know that I have the utmost respect for your coach and for your players. The first thread on DB (by a fan I assume) on Coach T was about them winning the state championship. That thread set the stage for all that has followed. At Jeff County we are about winning our district first and we give respect to our competition in the IMAC by not assuming that district is already won. I have never, nor will I ever, bash players or coaches. Obnoxious fans are another matter. BTW, the way the Knox paper handled Halls' lack of success in the Sports Bell was much more objective and their coach, Polston, was very honest in appraising his team.

Bud is a class act on the these threads and I apologize for using his statement to lob a grenade at some other less than astute fans. But as the old saying goes, "Throw a rock at a pack of dogs and the only one that squeals is the one that gets hit."

Friday will be fun. It will be our sixth game of the week and I don't even know if we have six pitchers on the team. We've already thrown 1,2, and 3. I assume 4 and 5 will go tonight and tomorrow night. One thing I agree with that has been said on this thread is that in tournament play (as in scrimmages) when you pitch somebody that is not part of the regular rotation, it is almost impossible to judge how the same two teams will come out in the play-offs with their best on the mound. I bet there are over twenty runs scored in Friday night's game.

And why does everyone have to be so angry? This stuff (the back and forth between fans) is supposed to be fun.

Drew Story from Jefferson County hit 91 mph four times in the seventh inning last night against Morristown West. he has already signed with ETSU.

Who cares? Let them play ball. If DB plays well and comes together and does well in the long run, so be it. If not, maybe they are not playing to their potential, who knows. Who cares? Just let them play ball and quit analyzing and criticizing.

Now we say "Who cares?" Typical.

It was a good game. My perspective on what we saw is this: West--Bridgewater pitched a great game but was beginning to fall off in velocity at the end. He will be next year's Drew Story. Good athletes but West's line-up falls off greatly after their number 5 hitter. They play solid baseball, well coached, and can play small ball. They will give any team a run for its money. Jeff--Story is the man. In the seventh inning, he was stronger than in the first inning (91 a couple times). With him on the mound, Jeff can compete with any team in the state. Jeff's infield play was sloppy and it almost cost them the game and probably will in the future. Missing Belcher hurt both offensively and defensively but he'll be back in the future. Jeff's line up can hit the ball from top to bottom, as demonstrated by the fact that their lead off hitter had the big hit that knocked in two runs (one earned, one unearned on West's CF error). Overall, they need to be tighter on defense and play more small ball.

Future West/Jeff games? If West's lower half of the line up can catch up with Jeff's #2 and #3 pitchers and Jeff doesn't cut down on infield errors, West may take both ends next week. That's a big "if" though. With Belcher back and Taylor and Joey throwing well, I think Jeff has to be favored in both games. They will certainly score more runs, the question is how many they will allow.

I hope DB makes it to the championship, playing Halls.

I think Bearden will have something to say about that as they are in DB's pool. If they bombed Cat the other night, I'm not sure DB has anyone quite like him. With Miller hitting over .600 and the rest of the line-up solid, Bearden is my choice for second best in the Knox area to South Doyle, with Halls and Webb three and four.

I think the Sports Bell tournament in Knoxville will be a good indicator of how far DB can go. They first have to win their pool that has Bearden, the most overlooked team in Knox, in it. I think Bearden is 9-0 or thereabouts, and can hit the ball. Wayne Miller is a stud. Then, DB may have the pleasure of playing Halls--not as good a team as last year but still better than your average bear. I'll be following the results closely. Win the Bell and you'll get the attention of everyone in Knoxville.

8 or 9 times out of 10 and they got beat 6-1, wow what are you smoking. my money is on west.

Let's see--West's victory was the championship game of a tournament that means nothing to conference standings. It was the fifth game of the week which means using a starter who won't start that much during the year, especially against West in a conference game. It was also on West's home field as the second half of a double header. Besides, the sun was in our eyes, we had a rock in our shoe, and West is just mean!! Seriously, like scrimmage games, I would not put a lot of stock in this victory--but if West would like, they can. That will just make it all the more satisfying when they watch several 90 mph fast balls go past without even reacting.

Mark it down that you are not a DB fan so in the future DB does not get 50 posts bashing DB for what others will take as a DB fan claiming DB will win state.

I haven't bashed DB, just certain DB fans. As to winning state, I do not think DB has the pitching or the overall talent to make it past sub-state as in previous years. This comment is not a "cut" but an observation as a fan of high school baseball. In Knoxville, South Doyle is loaded (beat defending champ Houston 10-1 in Memphis but lost a close one to a good Germantown squad 4-3 this week for their first loss). Farragut will be tough with Cat on the mound and they always reload. Halls has the talent to go all the way if they fix their attitudes. Personally, since I'm a Jeff County fan, I think that DB may have a tougher time than usual before sub-state. JCHS is 4-1 with their only loss coming to M'town West in the finals of the Lakeway tourney, leaving the bases littered with runners and making a couple untimely errors. West will be tough as well. Your own district will be difficult with the 'Toppers and a few other rejuvenated teams challenging. It is a long season and the best thing DB has going for them is a great coach, rabid fans, and Mr. Trent. If young arms develop, who knows, but that is the question.