Tronado

Coach Vandergriff was Blaikes wrestling coach in 6th and 7th grade at Loftis Middle school. I think we set a record that still stands and probably will never be broken in that magical year that every wrestler we entered, placed in the HCAC, it was totally an awesome performance led by a great wrestling Coach. Of Course with a few pieces missing from that team was essentially the same team that made their runs at Soddy Daisy High school a few years later. Great times, not forgotten Coach Vandergriff, thank you. The Henry's

Attended the meeting shortly before the quarters Friday afternoon, approximately 80 coaches in attendance; there was an overwhelming sense of support for Tennessee to gain 1 qualifier/ wt class for next year. I was surprised by the quality of the wrestling; obviously we expected Blair and Wyoming Seminary to be tough, but there is some very good wrestling beyond those guys. Our boys represented the state well, even though both lost heartbreakers that prevented them from placing. The venue was awesome, such a step up from the embarrassment we use for our state tournament. Too bad we couldn't represent our schools; but our boys looked okay in their team Tennessee uniforms.

Glad two of our better scrappers got to go, I've never seen either one not give everything they've got. Wrestling does matter, its more than just a participation sport. Wrestling encompasses all into one sport. I always loved going out of state with our Team Tennessee guys, the trip to Iowa was a great memory. I think we got 4th or 5th in the country at AAU middle school national duals. Lost to the same team twice. Good times.

You recall that? Wasn't even close to a pile drive,,, his body went forward and horizontal to the mat for a text book perfect TD. It was beautiful until the whistle blew, pt awarded and the scene that followed at McKenzie. Saw a similar pivotal call when a wrestler that same year had a deep double, head on the chest, defensive wrestler lose grip and falls strait back and whistle blows for a body slap. I was stunned and the MBA coaches thrilled!

The call that always got me was the return to the mat from the claw. Coach Gilbert and I, never quite saw that call in the same light.... Made it to iffy to run in a tight match.

Well it ended in heartbreak for both Adam and Blake. Both were one match away and wrestling really well. I didn't get to see all of Afams match as he and Blake were up at the same time but I think it was 5-2, he got reversed and caught for 3 back points . Blake was up 5-1 with 30 seconds against a thrower. The kid double under hooked him and Blake threw him but somehow they got in a weird scramble and he came up with a deep half and pinned him. Very heartbreaking. The tournament is phenomenol !! I hope all the d2 kids get to go next year. Every aspect of the tournament is top notch! We were wild cards and just went into whatever slot was available if any. Adam didn't even have a spot until late last night when someone didn't show up.

Sounds like an awesome experience Mike. Not sure where the kids were from that Blake and Adam wrestled but I've noticed this year that a big difference in our wrestling in the South is that we are not as physical as in other places. I've seen some hand fighting that I'm not sure our refs would let go but you better have your headgear strapped on,  very heavy hands....careful on the way back home.

For the 37 years the state championship was undivided, 1961-1997, the traditional state team title was won 19 times by teams that are currently in Dii. It was won 14 times by teams that are currently classified as Di A-AA. That leaves 4 titles won by schools that are currently Di AAA.

 

Every year since 1961 there has been at least one state champion from A-aa schools including after the Dii split. Most years, there have been multiple state champions from current A-AA schools.

 

It is what it is, whether we like it or not. I just wish that some of the postings on these boards could gain some humility, lose some arrogance, and not be so needlessly combative with their tone. Perhaps it makes the offenders feel better about themselves and perhaps that's all they have. I suppose I will continue to endure the less intelligent and mean spirited postings of a few so that I can benefit from the insightful and well meaning ones.

Its this right here, Most of those titles were won by what used to be the big schools in Chattanooga. We now have 200 little private schools, and those once big schools are now not so big. Most of those used to house 1200 kids, or were considered big schools in chattanooga  I'm not going to take the time to go back and research your research but your not telling the full story, just the one that fits your argument.

    I mentioned Boatman to a College coach as I was texting the results from the state tournament. I like the young man, I've talked with his dad several times and complimented him as they were leaving the state tournament when Jon was a freshman. I have already broken down last years results, lets not inflate them. 10 placers, 1 champ these are the results from what are now 1A/AA schools when they competed together last year. Guys, thats a huge drop off in talent. I understand families have ties to certain schools, nothing wrong with any of it.  When the first split was made, we went from crowning a state champ to crowning a division champ. We didn't need more divisions. Do you guys understand what im saying? AAA schools are having a hard time filling rosters. You scream growth I say bs, a lot of the ones doing the screaming about wanting a split had and have excellent programs. What are we going to do for the big schools that need help growing, nothing?, or do they not get an excuse. I'm sorry if I offended, but those are my opinions.

This seems oddly firmiliar. Anybody remember when the ChattCentral troll got on and started spouting off nonsense a couple years ago...

Tread lightly God, the goobsquad is watching. Thank you TSSAA.

I'm now convinced that TN wrestling will be fine with small school titles, but still there is great strategy in facing all competition for individual development.

 

Love to see D2 and 1AAA combined for the traditional. Team scores can be separated to please the powers that be. Let the boys wrestle. They all put their pants on the same way! Don't they?

Your too much, does 1A/AA have different pants because enrollment at a lot of those D2 schools is about the same as the big AA schools. Funny how people can make exceptions to the rule to fit their desired out come.

This is all fun speculation but I say let's put a d1 and a d2 team together and wrestle in the Dixie Duals. It would be close with a lot of great match ups. If someone can get the atleast 10 of the d1s to comit I'll get the d2s

Sounds awesome, and for the kicker match. You representing the rich people division and I the simple man division for a winner takes all, no holds barred, cage match........Ric Flair style, or I can be Dusty Rhodes. Either way you will be getting the peoples elbow, u 1%

Alcoa beat .pf on the middle school level the last two years

and if Matthew Cate is helping, you couldn't have a better young man, Awesome family too. Go Alcoa

Larger school enrollment = larger pool of athletes to draw from, which is one of the reasons there are different divisions for other sports.  I recall the complaining of Division I coaches about Division II schools having the advantage of Nation wide and state Wide recruiting base and this was not fair to the public schools, who did have have that same benefit.  Tronado believes that only thing that matters is a wrestlers weight.  What makes a wrestler a champion is having good drilling partners and competition in the wrestling room.  Larger pool of athletes is a nice benefit to have to increase  the possibility of increasing the numbers, quality wrestlers, in a room.  Now I know that increase athlete pool is not the only factor that allows wrestling programs to be successful, coaching, admin. support, etc all play a part.  I understand both sides of this issue.  

I've moved on. Parents, if you have a good wrestler, take them to the big programs that face the best competition. These big programs need kids too, look all across the state AAA programs don't have full lineups, you can help them. Wrestlers aren't born, their made. It could be the reason a lot of schools don't have them and then we have to lower the level of our competitive wrestling here in Tennessee to say we are growing. Chattanooga has 3 big schools, Soddy Daisy, Ooltewah, and East Hamilton at which two of them cant even fill out a full line up. Yet the small schools needed the help. Please take your great little wrestler and go to these schools. I'm partial to Soddy these days, so go there friends.

  P.S. for those worried about the size of the medals, win a state championship and you get a RING at Soddy.

Wow!!!

 

I think first off its D2.....Or JV

 

Mr. Popp, would not only place but I believe that he would have had a great chance at OW in D1...

 

Nuff said...

 

Bcb iii

 

Joe Waddell

Still trying to work an angle on them Baylor mommies. Such a dog, I mean Bearcat...

Again, who did Pop loose his two matches to?  I know he beat Garrett Alexander in the finals of the McCallie tournament (Alexander did not place in D1, not close to being in top 6).  Who else did he get beat by?  Dooley and Klingingsmith less losses combined. 

 

 

Also,  McCallie tournament "The 152-pound bout, with Soddy-Daisy's Gage Richmond rallying to decision Baylor's Blake Sutherland 6-4 in overtime, was voted best match by the coaches. Richmond scored a tying reversal shortly before the third-period whistle, then won with a quick takedown in OT"

 

145 lb junior  Luke Hamilton pinned Gage Richmond in a very lopsided match to win the state.

 

No question D1 head and shoulders over D2

Alexander wasn't right the last three weeks of the season but he did make it to one match out of placing. I'd say that's darn near close to placing. No excuses for Garrett, he just didn't appear focused for a long stretch. 160's in D1 are good no doubt but Popp is really good too. I think Luke beat Gage twice badly, tells me the kids pretty good. Another example of y the kids should be in one division. Remove all doubt...to an extent:)

I agree and I have brought this point up in the past.  Wrestling, the grandest of all sports deserves the same treatment as other sports.  Tennis, Track and Field, Bowling, even cross country, kids get the chance to compete against kids who attend highs schools that are about the same size or at least same classification as their school.  Why should wrestling be treated any different? 

 

Give the A/AA a few years.  You will see more participation and you will see improved skill levels.  I was approached by several small school coaches and parents of small school wrestlers asking me about what off season camps and programs they need to be involved.  These people were excited about what the future of the A/AA holds for their school/wrestlers because they now believe they have a chance to compete on a fair playing ground

No. A move made for participation and medal redistribution. Life's not fair, and 1 kid weighing 120 vs. another kid that weighs 120 is about as fair a shot your going get in this world. Telling them any different and your not being honest with them. What does student enrollment have to do with an individual sport. It will only take you one word. I see, they were losing thru no fault of their own, it was due to the size of the school they were facing and because of this change they now believe, Id believe too if they took the majority of the best wrestlers in the state out of play. FAIR PLAYING GROUND., what a farce.

Do I see another little hardcore out there

You said he should not have won as a freshman. Didn't he beat Casey Brewster by 10 or more points. I know he was up by 10 at one time.

I didn't think Keller was the favorite going into that match. I could be wrong though. Sorry for my wording.... Thank you for correcting me.119--Brewster (O) d. M. Keller 11-3, this was from the state duals, I don't think Keller was the favorite to win. But I could be wrong about this too. Som's been learning me some cut and paste.

I see a close match. I don't think the ref called control on the stack, college is a lot differently officiated than high school;. I like both wrestlers and I love the cradles, Devan may have been able to close that match out a couple of times if he's under a little more control. I still can't figure out the stalling call. I'll leave it at this, Devan should be a two state champ right now. I felt last year he was the more talented wrestler and this year but Fuller is a freshman that will fill out more and only get better, looks like we could have another 4 timer with him. Keller won a state championship as a freshman when he probably shouldn't have and then went on to be top 2 or 3 wrestler in our state i've ever seen. Devan will bounce back, love his wrestling style, reminds me of my son.

D2 (106 & 120) wins two weights D1wins 12........ placers....no comparison..look at the kids that took third in d11, would not have qualified for d1.

I think D2 wins 160 as well. 138 is in play as well.

If the TSSAA Board of Control votes to split again as it has been reported and place all private schools in D2 I see a complete split taking place. It has been reported that the current D2 schools had a meeting a few years ago about forming the Tennessee Private School Athletic Association and they will move forward if all private schools are forced into D2. If a complete split takes place the larger D2 wrestling schools will get even better as they will attend national level tournaments and more than likely end their season at the National Preps. However, the smaller private schools may suffer in all sports due to travel cost.

D2 should have done this years ago, how fun can it be to be compete against the same kids over and over. D2 was made a scape goat for parents exploring the possibility of a better education for their kids. The athletic opportunities and facilities are a bonus. I think it would increase the interest even more in these excellent schools.

I was completely opposed to the split. And I was very vocal about it. I was shocked to discover that I seemed to be in the minority. At least among the people that spoke out about it. However, I've opened my mind  (and heart) up a bit and am not ashamed to say I may have been wrong - at least to some degree.

 

I've personally witnessed a few things over this last year. I won't make this long, but lets just say it is a tremendous boast for local communities. Local communities that need encouragement. Good news. Hope. The split has accomplished that and will continue to do so. More so then I anticipated. Yesterday our Principal was able to stand up and say Red Bank HS had their first State Champ in 5 years. Did he lie? No. Politicians hear that. Businessmen hear that. Parents hear it. Middle school kids hear it. To be honest all they hear is "state champ". Is that bad. No. Does it mean we need to split again? No. 

 

Like most other controversial topics the truth and answer is somewhere in the middle.

 

Apparently D A-AA will get a bit smaller next year as D2 gets a bit larger. 

I hope and pray that there is no more 'splitting' until our participation numbers grow from the current 4300 to well over 6000. We need to set a mark and stick to it before the discussion on 'splitting' even comes up again.

You coached their last state champion, and that program over the years had plenty of placers and good wrestlers. Logan, Zach and on an on. Problem is keeping a lot of them on the mat, their in the school.

In this analogy who is "I suck at my job"? The wrestlers or the coaches? Just curious cause the kids certainly didn't ask for a split.

It makes it a hard topic to broach, I for one never want to appear to put down any wrestlers. I like the fact that Alcoa showed up with a good group of kids, more kids is good for every one. But the problem is the fact they had to lower the standards set by generations of wrestlers that busted their butt to compete with anyone in the state. I don't even lay blame with D2 and the numbers in their brackets, some of our best wrestlers and some of the greatest coaches we've ever known in our state come from that division. I give them a pass because those guys would and will wrestle anyone at anytime. It sad to look down there some years, those kids deserve to compete with every one else. A few coaches pushed really hard for this to happen, the few that have big established programs that stock more wrestlers than a lot of AAA schools. We all know y, Pigeon Forge finished in the top 5 a couple of years ago, Hixson has always had talented wrestlers and the numbers to be near the top. Hixson won Region 4, I think 5 years ago over Soddy Daisy. Don't set there and tell me its to help those programs grow. It will help and I support this for the very small schools or wrestling programs, but these guys lowered the standards at which they wanted to be judged. I think Pigeon Forge over the last 5 years has had some of the top talent in the state, bar none. Hixson has kids up and down their line up that have wrestled their whole sports lives, lets talk about facts instead of trying to make everything a feel good story when we all know its not. Go Alcoa, and Greenback and who ever these new rules help but quite a few schools didn't need it, they just accepted it. I have a ton of respect for the coaches and what they have done with those programs, Garrick has done this in the face of a changing school system in Chattanooga, he is to be commended for the job he has done with his program. I also believe that they can compete with anyone in the state, they should've believed in themselves to stay competing in a division they belonged. Good people run all these programs, and good student athletes I've known their whole lives are involved in something they could have cared less about. I think we may need to all just leave it a dead issue, because now only hurt feelings can come from its discussion.

Haha.... That's what we enjoy most !Kicking the shizzz out of BigWHININGtit schools in football and looks like the mat too!

He has a point here about the football. Signal Mtn. could have stayed in Alcoa's division like they did in their other sports but Coach Price decided to take the football program to another class. I laughed out LOUD> I think the wrestling program can be good at Alcoa but here again your coach along with others said they needed another division to be competitive. I think both coaches made the right decision.....Signal didn't want to compete with Alcoa for state championships in football and Alcoa didn't want to compete against Big schools in wrestling. When your wrestling team kicks the shizzz out of Cleveland's wrestling team, I want to be there to see it. Like I said in a post a while back....freaking scream for separation and then walk around talking like you can beat the big dogs. I didn't even need a crystal ball, what happens when you give medals away. Total lack of respect for the sacrifices made to earn it.

Agreed 100%

Agreed 100% the TSSAA just got an influx of cash, that was the buzz they claimed to have heard that was printed in Chattanooga's paper. You have three wrestling mats, 6 individuals all weighing the same weight fighting to be called a state champion in an individual sport. D1 screaming that D2 can come in an recruit( their kids) they have put time and effort in to making good wrestlers, and D1A/AA they needed their on division to grow the sport. When the top programs in that division field more wrestlers than a lot of D1AAA schools. What should happen is D2 go the way of the prep school circuit, D1AAA have their own tournament, D1AA their own tournament and lets make a new class for D1A. I say this because a lot of teams that you would consider to be D1A have enrollment numbers far fewer than the separation from AAA to AA. It would be fair and closer to the reasoning given for the separation in the first place.

   Going off last years results you now have 14 new state champions from a division that  produced one last year. 84 state medalists up from 10 last year. So from a participation stand point it all makes sense, and it will help small programs grow. Lookout Valley had a young man in the finals in D1A/AA, I think they have about 400 students...including the middle school(including the middle school)! How fair is it for him to compete against those big AA schools with 950 to 1000 students. It was fair enough for Dusty Griffith and Tim Voiles to win a state championship while they attended Lookout Valley, no separation needed and both friends of mine. You have young men that have trained their whole life to be a good wrestler, be a placer, be a state champ. We let money and perceived recruiting separate the wrestlers, now we have let enrollment numbers separate us yet once more. Our nation has grown accustomed to lowering standards in the classroom, so now if you have a good student in a public school you sign them up for advanced classes. Instead of encouraging your under achievers to perform better, we make new rules to make it easier for them to succeed. Your right Mary, y go back to having to compare yourself against all when you can determine the opponents you have to compete against. We have football teams with 2-8 records going to the playoffs(playoffs), had a heck of season. In the old days 6-4 and you were still 2 games back of going to the playoffs. Our society props up under achievers, I like looking thru the old record books, past champions. It reminds me of a day long past when as kids we thought everything was fair an just, and if you worked as hard as they had, you too may someday be called state champ. heck, now you cant even look up the past. While the numbers increased this weekend, was it fair to send a better wrestler home with out a medal just because he attends a bigger school. I'll tell you what it creates, animosity. I've always felt wrestling as a sport was the great equalizer, no matter how big or small there was a weight class a kid could fit into to compete against kids his size. Look at it now, this is not the TSSAA's fault, nor the coaches fault. Its our fault, as a society always looking for the reason for our failures, who can we blame for us not winning or being as successful as we think we should be. I love wrestling, my sport was football but wrestling is life. No teammate to cover your faults, and everyone wanting to knock you down. Y couldn't we just leave this one sport to stand alone as it deserved. 

Coach Connell,

 

Thanks for all you have done for High School wrestling and wrestling in general.  You have been instrumental in the growth of wrestling in Tennessee.

 

You are an icon of the State.

 

Thanks.

I've always considered it to be a privilege to talk wrestling with the man, but there is a lot more to him then just the wrestling. A great sense of humor, and wrestling knowledge second to none. Simply the best.

You always hurt for your children when they don't win. Our rule was that if they had left the match close enough for another human being to error and decide a match for them then they have to accept the result. Doesn't erase the pain you feel for them but the out come is not going to change. I saw Devin forfeited out to 6th, was he injured. One of the best wrestlers in the state, no doubt about it.