hardball03

the lack of knowledge of soccer by referees, is what is hurting the game of soccer in high school competition.

I agree, especially as it relates to enforcing the rules. Inconsistent and ignorant

are at a minimum the best description I can give.

I have had numerous players taken down from behind with slide tackle........never

a card........the rules state that a red card should be given.

Very few referees are ever held accountable. I am a proponent of allowing coaches to complete an assessment report on the referees performance in a match.

Very few referees treat the players and or the coaches with a basic level of respect, let alone the rules of the game.

Referees are indeed changing the nature of the game with their ignorance and apathy.

The good ole boys are running off good young referees that have experience in the game. Wise up guys. You are the reason that more young people do not

ref games.

How old are you?

Do you play?

Who for?

Some of your lists are a tad biased and are definitely inaccurate.

predicting the state brackets because i have accurately predicted the last 2 so making the brackets exactly rocket science

Seems to be a natural bias in your top 100 TN players to Centennial. You are

leaving out several talented and recruited players.

Coffey... TWO TIME STATE CHAMPION

It was good to see him try a "slide by". He's now working on another takedown.

A single leg snatch will not get him beyond state champion.....I'm amazed he's

gotten this far with it. His strength will be matched at some point and he'll need

more technique.

As for now, enjoy the ride.

No doubt that D1 is more difficult.

There were kids placing that were dominated by guys that didn't even place in

the D1 tournament.

It tightens up a bit when you look at the Top placers in D2.....a few would do

fine, however very few.

I know you've been waiting for this so here you have it:

 

Trashcanman's Top Ten

 

1-Kelly Felix

 

2-Corey Manson

 

3-Ben Johnson

 

4-Bo Usary

 

5-Brandon Wright

 

6-Travis Creagan

 

7-Jay Adamson

 

8-Ryan Fuller

 

9-Damien Buchanan

 

10-Demetrius Johnson

 

I can't wait to hear from the you know who koolaid drinkers.

 

And some who should be on the screen, however...

 

Nick Reveiz

 

Josh Jadoobirisingh

 

Jake Young

 

Spike Rawn

 

The wrestling Youngs

 

Matt Lettner

 

Ryan Konz

Reveiz should be in there. He is a better wrestler than Coffee. Coffee knows

one thing. Single snatch although I did see he's working on a slide by.......power

half and let them up when he can't turn them.

Correction, he wrestled Father Ryan in the finals and yes he went awkwardly to

his back .......... but did you see him stay there? No he is a hoss.

Reveiz would either pin him or win in 3 by say a score of 6 - 3.

Kelly Felix is the real deal. Even though he didn't tech or pin the kid from SD

on Friday.....he wrestled at one speed in the first two rounds and then went

maniacal in the third. SD didn't know what hit him.

He almost TF'd in the first round of the finals. He's amazing and a Junior.

Is there another sport that is any more messed up right now in how post season competition is structured.

It was tough seeing some of these kids lose an opportunity to advance knowing

they worked harder and were better than some that are advancing in other regions.

There has to be a better option than a random 4th place. At least let the kids

resolve it on the mat.

The realignment has eliminated at least 12 very good wrestlers that would have

normally gone to state if not more......it's also allowing more weaker wrestlers

to go that would have never made through the consolation rounds.

They may want to adjust the schedules, there will be a lot of short matches.

Does anyone know how the TSSAA will set up the brackets?

 

In the past, a Region Champion could only wrestle a Region Champion in the quarters which meant the loser would be "carried" into the consolations. This year, with 10 Region Champions, there will be two matches in the second round at each weight where a Region Champion will wrestle a Region Champion. The winner will advance to the Quarters and if he loses the Region Champion will not be carried.

 

When the TSSAA changes to 10 regions this should have been considered. If is was considered, the TSSAA would have surely seen the unfairness of the "carry bracket" to certain kids and changed to a full wrestleback bracket. Therefore, one of two things happened. Either the TSSAA didn't consider the problem OR it did and didn't care. Either way, it's a shame.

First match listed is the Consolation Finals

TSSAA Region 7 State Qualifier

Glencliff High School

2/10-11/2006

Finals

Weight: 103

Chris Soboun Antioch Dec Britney Burns McGavock (Nashville), 9-7OT

Luis Aguilar East Literature (Nashville) M-Dec Andrew Reed Martin Luther King, 12-4

Weight: 112

Nick Steiner Glencliff Fall Antonio Lillard Hunter's Lane, 309

Weight: 119

Eric Rucker Antioch Dec Corey Jones East Literature (Nashville), 8-7 OT

Tony Corley Hunter's Lane Dec Clifford Lett Stratford (Nashville), 9-5

Weight: 125

Son Nguyen East Literature (Nashville) Fall Richard Jolley Maplewood (Nashville), 225

Austin Haynes Stratford (Nashville) M-Dec Beyar Yahya McGavock (Nashville), 9-1

Weight: 130

Seth Jones Maplewood (Nashville) Dec Josh Field East Literature (Nashville), 6-4OT

Brad McCallister McGavock (Nashville) Dec Brian Shook Tennessee School for the Blind/Donelson, 7-4

Weight: 135

Thomas Holman McGavock (Nashville) T-Fall Nick Simon East Literature (Nashville), 600

Kerry Dowell Hunter's Lane Fall Scott Osatile Antioch, 4:47

Weight: 140

Darnell Booker Antioch Fall Dodger Clemons Hume Fogg, 314

Shawn Garrett East Literature (Nashville) M-Dec Delon Eckles McGavock (Nashville), 12-4

Weight: 145

John Haynes Stratford (Nashville) M-Dec Stephen Gentuso Tennessee School for the Blind/Donelson, 22-10

Taylor Fortune Martin Luther King Fall Havar Abdullah McGavock (Nashville), 116

Weight: 152

Terry Pegram Glencliff Dec Charles Pillow Hunter's Lane, 6-5

Brandon Quick Antioch Dec Nick Burnley Martin Luther King, 6-3

Weight: 160

Drew Lambert Martin Luther King Fall E.J. Smith Hunter's Lane, 433

Daniel Hardin McGavock (Nashville) T-Fall Matt McClure Glencliff, 5:44

Weight: 171

Jessie Watkins Martin Luther King T-Fall Michael Pack McGavock (Nashville), 435

Monterrace Reams Glencliff Fall Rhees Oakes Tennessee School for the Blind/Donelson, 141

Weight: 189

Shaun Rhodes Antioch Fall Samuel Hopper Maplewood (Nashville), 459

Anthony Clemons Glencliff Fall Chris Robinson Hunter's Lane, 323

Weight: 215

Hervie Clemons Hume Fogg Fall Dylan Jones Antioch, 325

Hakar Yahya McGavock (Nashville) Dec James (JEB) Stuart Martin Luther King, 7-2

Weight: 275

Leobardo Rucker Glencliff Dec Jaymz Shields East Literature (Nashville), 4-2

Cory Hamilton Hunter's Lane Fall Brandon Morris Antioch, 302

Ok guys most of yall know who qualified for state and have results. Can we just have one page with results from each region? That way we could clear up the board a little bit instead of having a bunch of threads about results.

 

For ex.

 

region 1

103-

112-

119-

 

and so on you guys get the picture. It would be nice for yall to help everyone out so we can look at everybody that qualified instead of looking at so many different threads.

The first match listed is the consolation Finals.

TSSAA Region 6 State Qualifier

Brentwood High School

2/10-11/2006

Finals

Weight: 103

Stephen Cau Centennial M-Dec Josh Overmyer Brentwood, 20-9

Talon Noman Overton M-Dec Chase Beazley Independence, 17-5

Weight: 112

Renas Zebari Hillwood Fall Eric Hancock Overton, 2:33

Sean Ford Ravenwood Fall Ben Ennis Hillsboro, 5:34

Weight: 119

Danny Pappas Ravenwood Fall Cagg Cabell Overton, 0:55

Dustin Ortiz Franklin Fall Jeremy Carter Franklin Road Academy, 2:10

Weight: 125

Chase Sanders Brentwood Fall Ben Thompson Lipscomb, 4:04

Joseph Pair Page Dec Stuart Cope Centennial, 6-3

Weight: 130

Alex Rochelle Lipscomb Fall Cameron Patterson Hillsboro, 1:27

Ty Zarbo Franklin Dec Jacob Creighton Page, 6-2

Weight: 135

R.J. Rayborn Overton Fall Adam Gregg Hillwood, 4:17

Ryan Konz Franklin T-Fall Jesse Murphy Franklin Road Academy, 17-1

Weight: 140

Grant Geasley Page Dec Rijar Emin Overton, 10-6

Kellen Holliman Brentwood Def Mason Caples Hillsboro

Weight: 145

Spencer Cope Centennial Dec Daniel White Overton, 13-7

Kelly Felix Franklin T-Fall Richey Ward Ravenwood, 26-11

Weight: 152

Andrew Hedges Hillwood Dec Colt Kittell Overton, 7-3

Jonathan Brown Brentwood Dec Jonathan Heacock Franklin, 7-3

Weight: 160

Seth Jones Brentwood Dec Shawn Godwin Ravenwood, 5-4

Ben Heacock Franklin Dec Brandon Vanderloop Hillsboro, 5-3

Weight: 171

Bert Herring Franklin Road Academy Fall Matt Reese Brentwood, 3:44

Carter McPhee Franklin Dec Ian Haggard Ravenwood, 8-4

Weight: 189

Kevin Cox Centennial Fall Cory Konz Franklin, 2:59

Austin Marcum Franklin Road Academy Dec Chris Wolfe Ravenwood, 7-5

Weight: 215

Thomas Berry Independence Dec Ben Cross Franklin, 13-6

Stephen Ball Franklin Road Academy Dec Chad Parker Page, 7-4

Weight: 275

Josh Winters Page Fall Tucker Cathey Franklin, 2:59

Brandon Swinney Overton Dec Mark Moore Hillwood, 3-1

Who cares if a girl wrestles? Does it hurt your ego to lose to one?

 

Too many people are focused on the "ego" element of this predicament. It's not

about ego, it is far more basic than that.

 

I have no issue with girls and guys competing up to a certain age......beyond that

age it is not healthy for either kid, the girl or the boy. Young girls and boys mature at different ages as we all know......yet both are continuing develop values

and beliefs throughout MS and HS and it is in these years that this can become

(1) unwholesome, (2) physically dangerous, and (3) just simply an unhealthy ego

trip for either the young lady who might be up against ninth grade boy that is new

to the sport or two for the ripped/shaved head boy that is out to prove a point to

the girl.

 

Open your eyes people. Competition is intended to be healthy and this threatens

every basic element of such.

Playing travel three years back does not necessarily make them travel players....anymore than playing Y soccer makes someone a "travel player"....I think my math is pretty good...perhaps players played some travel in the past....I do not consider someoen who gave it up a 'travel starter".....generally the complaint from the publics is that these travel players benefit from year round soccer. This is not the case in the entire starting bunch...although I think we see a tend in that direction for most of the top ranked teams....and not just in soccer. My guess is that in 5 years 90% of the starters in the final four teams in soccer in each state division will have "travel experience" as you put it...part of a trend across the sport scene.

 

Indiana still limits travel participation from one high school...I think ist 5 players, and yes it is a bad rule.

 

And yes Coach Mac does an excellent job....I hope he contiues to grace FRA with his excellent coaching ability for another decade..... I think most any parent associated with FRa would probably speak highly of the FRa coach....if that is recruiting, so be it.....I'm sure that the Ravenwood parents are speaking pretty highly of their football coach right now....is that "recruiting" also????

Come on now.....three years ago? The air isn't that thin up on the hill!

Try this year (2005).

Now how about you go back and read the very beginning of those rule listings? "if the offensive wrestler causes a potentially dangerous hold to become illegal". If a legal hold becomes illegal because the arm was unintentionally moved too high or slides to an illegal position, then it will be stopped for potentially dangerous (looking out for the safety of your kids). If the offensive wrestler forces the hold illegal and is driving with it, then it is consider illegal. Sometimes it may be hard to distinguish between the two in the heat of the match, but the call can be made either way depending on the APPLICATION of the move. And Dadof125, I can assure you that no referree out there is waiting for your child to come out on that mat so that he can screw him over. Mistakes may be made and that's unfortunate, but nobody has set out against your child. And if you don't mind, could you give your interpretation of the words "SLAM / POTENTIALITY DANGEROUS/STALLING/PIN/NEAR-FALL?" I'm just curious to know how you see it.

I have read it all. More importantly I understand firsthand what creates what. I can differentiate what the offensive wrestler is creating/causing and what the defensive wrestler is doing.....which is very little unless the wing is in "loose".....

Reftn blew it in his commentary....go back and read it. Again, respect starts when

one can admit they are wrong.

Likeachimp171, try not to be so defensive.

reftn,

Regarding your earlier response to my example.....see the following in the rule

book.

Rule 7 Section 2, Article 1-page 36 .......if the offensive wrestler causes a potentially dangerous hold to become illegal, the offender shall be penalized

according to the penalty chart........

Rule 7 Section 2, Article 2 (a list of potent. dang. holds) (includes a chicken wing)

Now see the photos page 74, #81 (illegal chicken wing)

page 76, #92 and 93 (legal wings, but potentially dangerous)

Hope this helps you.

After reading your post.....it is apparent you have very a little understanding of the

purpose of an official and what is being complained about.

 

As a coach, my kids drill and condition in a manner that not only is demanding, it

requires a great degree of selflessness and sacrifice. Keep this in mind as you read the rest of this.

 

A referee is there to insure that the "rules of the sport" are enforced in an effort

to produce an accurate result and to protect the wrestlers.

 

It took over half of the season before referees began to penalize an illegal wing, most continued to call potentially dangerous if called at all.......however if one of

my guys leg touched the butt of the other wrestler in the referees position it consistently cautioned. This is only one example of many that could be given.

To me it is a symptom of a lack of experience or majoring in the minors and minoring in the majors. Illegal holds are not readily identified by over half

of the refs. A small number of refs cannot clearly see the weigh in sheets.

Over half are not in position to make a timely/accurate call. I have actually

counted to one thousand four before a few get down on the mat......numerous pins

have been missed because of.........simple laziness?

 

If my kid goes on the mat and does something similar, he gets beat. He has

an immediate result that he experiences.

 

A referee should be assessed by experienced referees and they should have to

pass an eye exam and a physical in addition to experiencing regular assessments.

 

I don't like to complain about refs, however it's the only form of real feedback that

an assignor gets. I pick my battles according to the real danger and that is generally limited to those referees who show a total disregard to understanding

of illegal holds or flagrant violations.

 

You might be able to feel comfortable with throwing verbal stones at a spectator

or even a coach for expressing concern..........try telling a parent why their son

is on the way to the hospital......when the ref says he didn't see the illegal headlock or neck wrench.......you think I'll get excited on sideline when I see it

happening again.......you bet I will.... as a coach I have a right and a duty to question or obtain an explanation in a respectful manner and expect that same

level of respect from an official......generally the weaker officials show very little

respect to the kids or the coaches, it is unfortunate.

 

Again the purpose of a ref is ............

reftn,

As long as they are doing one the other should be happening..........an illegal "anything" that is not seen is due to either lack of knowlege or being out of

position to view the critical elements of the hold.

I am just stating some facts and attempting to address observations and assumptions being made with regard to why a coach communicates with an official.

The rules are augmented by illustrations in the back of the book.

I have respect for many officials, but especially those that are honest enough to

admit a mistake and or those that are respectful of the wrestlers and the coaches.

Regular observation, assessment, and feedback are proven methods of enhancing performance at an individual level or even at a group level.

It is a very real issue and unfortunate for the ones that work hard at being the best they can be.......both the officials and the wrestlers.

It is people like you who get spectators like me angry. You are quick to see a bad call from the seats. The refs are on the mat. Meaning they see things you and I can't see from the bleachers. I remember a match I attended a few weeks back and the coaches along with some of the spectators were horrible. Maybe there are a shortage in refs because all the heckling and other stupid things coaches and spectators say and/or do causes them say "the heck with this, it's not worth the time nor gas to be scrutinized." Remember this , the refs are on the mat, they see better from the mat than in the stands, they pay a fee and take the test to be on the mat and you have not. If you had, you would not be on CoachT knocking on their ability to referee a match. " To err is human." Are you perfect? Why are you expecting them to be? Everyone is entitled to their opinion. And everyone is entitled to make mistakes. Some new refs may need a little more training, but that does not make them incompetent at what they do. 9 out 10 refs are former wrestlers, so stop stomping on their ability.

After reading your post.....it is apparent you have very a little understanding of the

purpose of an official and what is being complained about.

As a coach, my kids drill and condition in a manner that not only is demanding, it

requires a great degree of selflessness and sacrifice. Keep this in mind as you read the rest of this.

A referee is there to insure that the "rules of the sport" are enforced in an effort

to produce an accurate result and to protect the wrestlers.

It took over half of the season before referees began to penalize an illegal wing, most continued to call potentially dangerous if called at all.......however if one of

my guys leg touched the butt of the other wrestler in the referees position it consistently cautioned. This is only one example of many that could be given.

To me it is a symptom of a lack of experience or majoring in the minors and minoring in the majors. Illegal holds are not readily identified by over half

of the refs. A small number of refs cannot clearly see the weigh in sheets.

Over half are not in position to make a timely/accurate call. I have actually

counted to one thousand four before a few get down on the mat......numerous pins

have been missed because of.........simple laziness?

If my kid goes on the mat and does something similar, he gets beat. He has

an immediate result that he experiences.

A referee should be assessed by experienced referees and they should have to

pass an eye exam and a physical in addition to experiencing regular assessments.

I don't like to complain about refs, however it's the only form of real feedback that

an assignor gets. I pick my battles according to the real danger and that is generally limited to those referees who show a total disregard to understanding

of illegal holds or flagrant violations.

You might be able to feel comfortable with throwing verbal stones at a spectator

or even a coach for expressing concern..........try telling a parent why their son

is on the way to the hospital......when the ref says he didn't see the illegal headlock or neck wrench.......you think I'll get excited on sideline when I see it

happening again.......you bet I will.... as a coach I have a right and a duty to question or obtain an explanation in a respectful manner and expect that same

level of respect from an official......generally the weaker officials show very little

respect to the kids or the coaches, it is unfortunate.

Again the purpose of a ref is ............

haha thanks for that

Where is she going?

joe young would be above ben johnson, and coffey is killing people so he should be on there

The best, pound for pound, is Kelly Felix. His ability to size up an opponent is

uncanny. His consistency speaks for itself.

Forgot one thought....

I really want to push for a double-elemination tourney in DI wrestling state!

Stick to it, you have support. I am really surprised that this still exists and in addition I am really surprised that the TSSAA would unbalance the regional feed

into a 32 man bracket.

It's a "luck of draw" for some kids..... to me it taints the process of qualifying, it's

inconsistent therefor inequitable.

Sure the power houses shift from region to region.....so why make them work with

a defective process?

Double elim is the way to go, it is more equitable and places the burden to advance on the wrestler that loses.......and not by the luck of who he loses to.

There doesn't seem to be a lot of listening to the coaches on these matters.

It's like building highways after the mall is built.??????

TSSAA should recommend a format for the wrestling to "grow" into versus struggle in.......multiple divisions and or more teams advancing in duals

is the way to grow the popularity....it will grow into it if given the chance.

There doesn't seem to be as much local summer wrestling as there used to be.

I know there were several kids looking for stuff all summer....maybe one tournament.

Weight classes also seem to be an internal problem as well.

The recent realignment seems to have segregated the schools again when you look at it closely.

Any word on early commitments from the 2007 class? :usa:

I think that 7 of the 11 starters for FRA were travel players? and yeah ai think all the starters are great....super bunch of ladies So many of these keids give up other sports to play soccer at this level...other kids choose to play many sports...should kids who focus on one sport year round ( i.e. travel baseball) be excluded from competing for a school championship?...perhaps its a hot spot because I have a relative who was big with TSSAA and has been in the public school arena for many years (coach, principal, athletic director, teacher, etc.) He thinks the public school and private schools playing each other is fine and doesn't really see a need for a multiplier unless a school i gender specific...this would throw off the student/athlete ratio! I trust his judgement on this after over 25 years of involvement with public school athletics (at big and large schools...it just so happens he attended a private school in hgih school)

You better check their resumes.....at least 10 of 11 plus travel depth on the bench.

Alabama used to limit the travel and HS relationship.....BAD rule.

Not taking anything away from Ken Mc.....the program/coach has had a lot of help

from parents in pulling good players toward the doors.....hey, it' s tough but so can

anyone else if they care about building a "winning" program.....it attracts the kids and families that aspire to be a part of a competitive program. Their depth is the key. Their talent for the most has been average, however most A/AA schools do

not have the travel players that are even average either on the field or the bench. Again, not knocking a great coach, he does have the soldiers when comes to battle.

www.wilsonpost.com has a story saying she's going to Union in Jackson. Should add real fire power to a second year program.

That's an understatement....Fulmer could use her at linebacker.

Totally agree hardball03 I know one incredible forward/midfielder, several midfielders and an unbelieveably talented defender ( Flash), that should have been on 1st or 2nd team or at least been recognized somewhere from A/AA. A name on a list, or not, shouldn't define any player, that is done on the field. MERRY CHRISTMAS ALL!!!

Has anyone seen an official list printed anywhere?

All Mid-state is about 50% on target.

As for "recruited players"....what are the schools that "recruit"...about 8 to 10 teams? I don't remember the total DII classification, but most of the alphabets (CCS, FRA, ND, KC, etc. are all DI....no recruiting). As I see it many of those AAA schools have a VERY LARGE pool of students to pick from...and if kids transfer from those schoold to a private school they are prohibited from competing for a year....a very long time for any kid in high school. Shouldn't this be a new thread of discussion...or perhaps a new "old" thread???

FRA is/was recruited by parents affiliated with the Harpeth Futbol Club. They're

strong enough now that they are attracting players from other clubs........plus

they have a very good coach.