Seldon
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Posts posted by Seldon
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Being very familiar with both the 03 and 04 Farragut teams, most of the people involved with whom I have talked generally agree that, even though the 04 team was Nationally #1, the 03 team was actually a little better. However, the senior 04 class was outstanding. I also think the Houston team that dismantled Bearden in either 00 or 01 was extremely good.
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Actually, that 2003 game was the District final, and it was the most exciting game I have ever seen. But Coach Culbreth said this one was even more exciting, so I'll have to take his word for it since I didn't get to witness it.
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QUOTE(rigger101 @ May 25 2007 - 02:02 PM) 826467060[/snapback]It talked to a Dad from Farragut Wen Night. He said they had recently moved to Farragut from NY. He said that the area's rep in soccer was a major reason he moved his family there. When I was transfered to Knoxville it was one of the factors for my family moving to Farragut.
So what will happen now with the opening of Hardin Valley HS? It should adversely affect Farragut much more than Bearden but it may also be the emergence of another W Knoxville team.
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QUOTE(rigger101 @ May 25 2007 - 12:23 PM) 826466996[/snapback]If I remember correctly his brother did not letter as a freshman or soph on those teams but was a heck of a player.
Farragut was the only school that I know of that had a Freshman, JV and Var soccer squads back then.
Good luck to the Ads and Coach.
Actually Rigger, the elder Backstrom (Ian) DID letter as both a Freshman and Sophomore and he WAS a heck of a player...he'll also be starting Med school in the Fall.
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QUOTE(uniden @ May 25 2007 - 10:38 AM) 826466917[/snapback]Seldon, let me guess, you are a former Bearden of farragut player from 3-5 years ago? Of course you think the level was better then /smile.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile.gif" /> All of us think we were better when we played.
Then you'd be quessing wrong, uniden. I've been watching Bearden and Farragut (never played for either) since the mid 90s and I believe it is safe to say that, between the two teams, the period between 2001-2004 was and is unparalleled in the total accumulation of talent. Ask either coach and they will tell you the same. It was an abberition and will quite possibly never be seen again. In 2003 alone, there were 10 All Staters between the two.
In addition, look at the interest the games drew back then as compared to the last couple of years. There was TV coverage at every game, headlines in the paper, and probably 50% larger crowds. Don't get me wrong, there's still plenty of talent out there and some darned good soccer, but that 3-4 year period was exceptional.
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QUOTE(Bulldog Dad @ May 25 2007 - 08:32 AM) 826466819[/snapback]I don't think you'll see many yellows. The past two years of Brdn-Farr soccer is nothing like it use to be. It's a lot less brutal and IMO better soccer than it used to be 3-5 yrs ago. Most of the yellows have come from stupid fouls not mean fouls.
Less brutal? Definitely. Better soccer? Not sure about that. One thing I have noticed about Beaden and Farragut as compared to 3-5 years ago is that the overall talent level now is not near what it was a few years back. Just goes to show how good the coaching is that both teams are still tops in the State.
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From Coach Smelser,
Three years ago the same situation occured and the coach at Farragut lied that the TSSAA can set the time if we do not move it. After getting cussed out by the coach at Farragut Fri. morning I called the AD at Farragut who explained to me that they have had private ceremonies in the past with track athletes that made it to State.
Perhaps this explains a lot about the "class" of a particular team, coach, and fans. The first statement is an out and out fabrication. Three years ago Coach Culbreth certainly DID NOT cuss out coach Smelser regarding the start time for the sectional. He requested that Smelser set a time to accomodate FHS graduation and when Smelser refused, Coach C expressed his opinion, but I'll guarentee you he did not use profanity.
As for the private ceremonies for track athletes, we are talking about a statewide event that had been scheduled for a year not a single game that was arbitrarily scheduled by a single coach. Too bad he can't tell the difference.
As for the rest of coach Smelser's comments, they help explain a lot about what I witnessed first-hand in regard to competing against Science Hill and interacting with their players and fans. Teacher, coach or whatever, his comments revealed a considerable lack of maturity and honesty. The use of excuses, complaints, and unfounded accusations are not qualities I would want from someone who is supposed to be a "leader" and a "molder of young men". Thank goodness my son played at Farragut for a coach with class.
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Three years ago the same situation existed; Farragut had lost to Bearden in the Regional finals and had to travel to Science Hill on graduation day. SH changed the time of the game to 11:00 AM to accomodate Farragut's graduating seniors. Farragut proceeded to whip them both on the scoreboard and physically on the field. Maybe Science Hill remembers that outcome and doesn't want a repeat.
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When the Bulldogs went totally offensive in the second half, it looked like all they tried to do was pound long drives in the direction of #17. They completely by-passed their own midfield, had no possession and became very predictable for the Farragut defense.
That's the style they have played since Turner got there but they don't have the studs up top that they have had in the past.
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We've seen some recent discussions on the size of fields and how many schools are forced to make do on Football fields or other less desirable pitches. Farragut had issues with field size in a major SC tournament, Madison just played a district game on an inadequate field scratched out on the side of the playground of an elementary school. Dyersburg's soccer field is 120 X 64 which sounds like it is closer to college specs than other team's but what about other teams? Why do soccer teams have to settle? If our state's players are going to be competitive dont we need to have competitive size fields? What do you think?
Two points: I don't believe Farragut "had issues" with the size of the USC field, it was merely an observation on the size as related to the norm for most TN schools. From my experience, the "good" teams with more speed and skill generally prefer a larger field.
Secondly, field size for most TN teams is a matter of economics not preference. Most schools are forced to play on their schools' football fields or carve out another plot of land for soccer. Most TSSAA schools' soccer programs simply do not have the financial resources to build and maintain a separate soccer complex of proper dimensions. Sad but true.
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The first thing u said was no excuses but u gave big paragraph list of why yal lost filled with pitiful excuses.
Hey ozzie,
What is the difference between an excuse and an explanation? Before you rack your brain trying to determine the subtle differences between the two, let me offer that the difference is often in the eye of the beholder.
You obviously have some animosity toward Farragut as evidenced by your tone and other posts, thus your "perception" of Coach Wallie's explanation is tainted, to say the least. My guess is you haven't had much success against the Admirals in the past. But hey, you're not alone.
I have known Coach Wallie for some time and I can promise you that making excuses is not part of his personna. Having followed Farragut's trek through the Palmetto Cup and being familiar with the talent in that part of South Carolina, I'd say they performed quite well and that the final game score probably WAS an aberration.
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Bearden: 5 Final Fours in the last 6 years
Farragut: 2 Final Fours in the last 7 years
Comparing final four appearances for more than the past three years is misleading in that the format changed in 2003. Arguably, Farragut probably would have been the final four in 2000, 2001, and 2002 had the current format been used during those years. The presence of two very strong teams in the same district/region was a motivating factor in going to the current 8-team State format.
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i'm not sure if the "die hard clubs teams" are the problem or the parents that start pushing their kids. there are kids that thrive on the year round playing and enjoy the tourney's.but it is a choice that the kids should make.parents should provide the choices then support the player be it ayso or div 1 club. as for college if you can get a college coach to come to a high school game you've worked a minor miracle.they don't have the resources to travel alot so their best "bang for the buck" is gonna be club tourney's like raleigh and tampa.ok kids the part you hate to hear there are more academic scholarships than athletic scholarships. but if you can get academic money the coaches can save money and may be more apt to help you get in to a better program.
Not sure I concur with you on this zaphod, old pal. By "die hard club teams" I can insert ""die hard club team coaches" who demand an excessive amount of a player's time and are really indifferent to anything in a kid's life that isn't directly related to the "club". You either go along with what they demand or you don't play. You know as well as I do that the list of very talented players who simple quit playing later on in their teens since they have had essentially NO break from playing soccer for several years is very long. Even professional athletes have more breaks than teenage club soccer players in the U.S. There is also a huge difference between training (i.e. conditioning) in the off-season and actually playing soccer year round.
As for the question of club vs team, I think that question is best answered by those who have experienced the upper levels of both club and school. A player on a Div.1 club team who plays on a mediocre school team does not have an equivalent comparison. As for my personal experience, having a son who has won both club and school state championships and has played against the best school competition around, I would have to say this: winning the club state was satisfying on a personal because of the skill level of every other team in the state, but winning the TSSAA was satisfying from the perspective of pride in representing his school and community (and besides, his school team was as darn near as good as his club and better than most). Ask him which one is most "important" to him and he will say without hesitation, winning the TSSAA championship.
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fingolfin, you obviously know little about Wallie Culbreth or Farragut soccer. He calls it the way he sees it and most of what he points out is valid, if somewhat biased. If you want to call that whining, fine. Sure, he's had talent the past 2-3 years and has made the best of it, but Farragut has had as much talent as anyone for the past 6-8 years but it took Coach Culbreth harness the talent and turn it into a TEAM. He's as fine an individual as you will find coaching anywhere in Tennessee and a darn fine coach. I promise you, I have encounter coaches in this State that whine a great deal more, with much less validity, than Wallie Culbreth.
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bhs, I believe your theory is flawed. In Knoxville, as in Nashville, there is very little cross-over of other sports into soccer. Most, if not all of Farragut's soccer team are soccer-only athletes. The only Farragut player in the past few years to play anything BUT soccer was Aaron Doyle, and he only kicked and punted for the football team his senior year. I imagine Bearden is pretty much in the same boat.
The talent in Tennessee ebbs and flows from section to section. A few years back the Memphis area teams were strong in both club and TSSAA. The past 4-5 years, Knoxville has seen a tremendous amount of club-level talent go through mainly Bearden and Farragut, with some fine talent at LC, CAK, and Catholic. Maybe the talent pool is ebbing toward the mid-State...we'll see.
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According to bhs007: "Don't believe everything you read and only half of what you see. There was NO WAY play went on for 2 min. The coach actually was quoted at saying 3 min so you see how a story can get changed. As an eye witness, I can assure you that play went on for at most :20."
Interesting.....the reporter said 2 minutes, the coach said three minutes, but YOU were an eyewitness and said it was only 20 seconds...
So I assume the reporter and the coach were NOT eyewitnesses and your opinion is more valid than theirs.
But then, since you can only believe half of what you see...
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From what I have heard, Doyle is not exactly a class act. This is just hearsay but I have been told that before the final Doyle said in the Memphis paper that the only way that Oak Ridge would win would be if OR broke all the legs of the Farragut guys.
A few points:
1. As has been pointed out the comment was taken out of context;
2. How is such a comment any indication of a lack of class, anyway? Sounds more like a comment on Farragut's determination to win.
3. Doyle is and always has been a class act. He is a quiet no-nonsense player, doesn't talk trash or taunt opponents.
Sounds to me like someone trying to make something out of nothing.
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I have played against Doyle at a competetive level, and I would have to say that he isn't that great. My name is never brought up in the threads, such as "Best Players" or "Best Goal Scorers" but I would have to say that I am better than Doyle. Honestly....he stinks. He just cherry-picks in front of the goal and scores alot. AARON IS THE MOST OVER-RATED PLAYER IN TENNESSEE.
Swole, if some bleeding heart soccer mom ever needs an example to support her premise that too many headers causes severe brain damage, you should volunteer.
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You can imagine all you want to, but that's all it will be: your imagination. A loss is a loss. "Excuses are like (a certain body part): they stink and everybody has one."
Plus, I don't buy it anyway. Farragut may have had injuries and illness but CBHS had just graduated 11 seniors and lost a 12th outstanding player – Coleman Whitsitt – to transfer.
No excuses were offered. CBHS won the head-to-head matchup between the two teams. But facts are fact: at the time, FHS had several highly debilitating injuries to key players and another 1-2 starters out with mono. All but one of those players had returned and were "up-to-par" by the end of the season. I believe is was quite obvious that by the end of the season, Farragut was playing at a considerably higher level than earlier when the two teams met. My statement was based on these observations. If you believe that there is no validity in my statement then you are either too bias to form an intelligent opinion or just simply uneducated to the realities of athletic competition.
As for having graduated 11 seniors, so what? That was last year. Farragut ALSO graduated 11 seniors LAST YEAR, including several all-region, all-state and current college players. In case you missed the point, LAST YEAR IS IRRELEVANT TO THIS YEAR! Geez, if you're going to attempt to argue a point, at least use relevant data.
Facts of the 2004 season:
1. CBHS beat Farragut head-to-head in an early season match-up
2. CBHs lost in the quarterfinals of the DII state tourney
3. Farragut won the AAA state tourney handily
4. Farragut finished the season as the #1 team in the country.
Draw your own conclusions.
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Calm down Seldon. I agree that Farragut was the class of the field and was only pointing out that picking out one game from some distant point in the season means nothing.
What a silly statement. I am perfectly calm and really can't understand how you are perceiving anything I have written as being anything other than calm. Trust me, if I were agitated about anything you may have posted, you'd know it.
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Doyle is a stud and would be much more well known throughout TN if he played club.
Just a note, Doyle played club and played it very well. Though a year (schoolwise) behind the rest of the team, he and Matt Blair were arguably the best players on the 85 Knoxville Select, which included several all-state and all-South players, many playing in college at this time.
Who Is The Best Tennessee Team Ever?
in Boys Soccer
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No, I didn't ALMOST get it right, I got it COMPLETELY right. The 03 Farragut team won the regular season 3-1 at Bearden, won the District 5-4, lost the regional final 2-1, then beat Bearden in the State finals 3-1. I attended each of those games. I have no idea what you're referring to.