soccerdad

How's that great qurterback of yours doing? And that BIG lineman? Hope they're getting healthy. Hated to see those injuries.

Well tell me dawg, where'd you get the idea that most are NOT athletes? Goodpasture fields all the TSSAA sports and has done well in several of them (golf, baseball, volleyball, basketball, softball, football,...). How'ya going to do that without athletes? Because of the quality of their athletic programs, many are drawn to the school. But , at Goodpasture, the typical student starts out in elementary school and is exposed to a system that seeks to instill excellence in all phases of school life - spiritual, academic, social, and athletic. As a result, the students work together for years creating great teamwork and discipline (much like what happens in small town schools). When highschool rolls around students and their families make choices. Some leave Goodpasture for other schools and some leave other schools for Goodpasture. The reasons for these changes varies. Some are social, some academic, some spiritual, some athletic. But this is not just a private school issue. Students also leave public schools to go to other public schools - depending on their strengths. If you notice I'm into soccer and I know for a fact that public schools, in this area (north of Nashville), have lost quality select players to other public schools and/or private schools. It was all done by the book. The driving force? The quality of play at the other schools. So being a winner brings new winners. I would imagine Milan also benefits from its good sports program by drawing athelets. Anyway, it will be a great game and I hope all involved are injury free and play the game of their lives!!!!

Good! unusual makes it all the more interesting! Teams need to try new stuff all the time - keeps them and their opponents on their toes. Makes them wonder why they didn't see it in the films - HUH???, Where'd that come from??? I'm sure for both great teams (Milan & Goodpasture) it will be a new experience (cuz no year or opponent is ever the same) and one to tell the kids about someday!

Probably, the most difficult thing about all this "public/private debate" is the socio-economics of our culture. I believe there are two socio-economic factors, in particular, that have a lot to do with our discussion. First, a high percentage of good athletes come from well-to-do families (wealth brings health and health often improves intelligence and physical skill) who would rather see their child in a school with a readily apparent mission/purpose/goal (ie. college prep, Christian, etc.) rather than the public schools that don't really have a readily apparent mission/purpose/goal (I know, I've been in both). So they send them to these schools. However, this happens in the public realm also - parents send their children to better publics when they have the chance (obviously this occurs in locales where there's more than one school = urban/suburban areas). The other socio-economic factor that greatly affects our discussion is the plight of the poor. There are many great athletes from the poorer parts of our communities. Many of these are minorities. Unfortunately, sports may be the only way out of poverty so they look for the best routes to success that happen to be in their area. Usually, these tend to be with the schools that have a winning tradition, and can be either private or public. They look for schools that have raised the interest of the scouts. Because of my point above, the private schools who attract the wealthy, have developed a winning tradition and thus the interest of the scouts. This is true for some of the elite publics also. So when you add in the poor/minority athlete, looking for a way out, to the wealthy-family athlete you have developed quite a program! There is no way to legislate against this! It's a fact of life. To try to do so (legislate against socio-economics in sports) would be to say that NASCAR can only be raced in a car of a certain make (say Ford), because others would offer too much competition. Or, it's like saying no more hispanics from the Caribbean can play baseball, or we must limit the number of southerners on NFL teams - they're just to good! Maybe these analogies aren't good, but we must admit that legislating equality is something that even the Supreme Court has trouble with. The American way is to face the odds stacked against you, spit in their faces, bring your best game, and work your hardest to win. In so doing, you elevate your game and begin to build a tradition that will lead to excellence and success!!! In the mean time, the schools that attract the wealthy and the poor will continue to excel, giving us all something to measure up to, something to strive for, something to make us get off our backsides and spend more time being all that we can be (great Army slogan of the past!). Isn't that a great goal for life - to be the best that we can possibly be? And not worry about our shortcomings compared to others! That's what brings joy and fulfillment! So I say, lets stop whining and do something proactive. First, each individual must commit to improvement. Then, each must work on bringing up his fellow man or woman - helping them to be all that they can be. Place us all together in four divisions - but totally outlaw recruiting of any kind (leave it for the colleges and pros). There might be some others things we could do to promote competition. What we are doing now stinks! The end result will be true champions of our great state who got there by being committed to excellence. Yeah, I know some of you think this is full of hogwash, but don't go on denying the facts of life: life is not fair. Well, I've said enough! Your friend (of both public and private), a former athlete, a former public school athlete's parent, a current coach (in both public and private), soccerdad.

Well, I guess you haven't seen them all (worst state contender), cuz I saw an excellent 5A team get destroyed twice in the last decade at the finals. It happens! You take care of things in the east and GP will take care of things in the west and then we'll see. PS- what happened in 2003 (55-6)? = pretty bad contender.

Yeah! Too bad so sad.

Let's ditch this thread and go where reason rules!

But you assume these great athletes all choose the small privates. Also, not all public schools in urban areas are 4 & 5A. There's quite a few smaller schools in urban areas. DI privates locate where there's enough population to support them and play teams of public and private schools in urban and rural areas.

It's the same with most PUBLIC schools in urban areas - the athletes get waivers, pay out-of-district tuition, or just move so they can play in PUBLIC schools (that have winning traditions of course). So your argument is more about rural vs. urban, lack of choice vs. multiple choices. A merit system would help even this out.

I guess in your senario (24-7) vs mine (21-7) you've got #17 coming up with a fine field goal from 35 yards. Well, I think you've got your head on straight about this!

Why, why why? What have you got against the privates? And there's pompus ones on both sides. How about we put all of us together and use the merit system? Seems like a good idea to me - as long as we get rid of recruiting. I've worked on both sides and think unity is best for all.

Please ignore dueces unkind words. He just not thinking right. This point can only be answered on the field - not on the boards. So lets slip on to the great game coming up. Both good teams - but Goodpasture's depth will rule the day. Goodpasture 21 Milan 7

Wow, for some this could be a roller coaster! Hey, why not treat those from the triplets the same way? 1A is getting killed by 2A (in the A/AA alignments) - it would be great to have those winning 2A's move to 3A and taste what it's like for 1A!!

Unless my glasses are fogged up, it appears a team that went out in the 1st round and is sitting at home is immediatley in front of one that is still unbeaten and still in contention for the state title. No sense in that! Your machince (which is so much smarter than the average dude) must of hiccuped on that one. Ohhh, could it be the programmer, a meer mortal, goofed up? Anyway, this is far from flawless. All polls have their problems. There's no way the cold hard facts as figured by man or machine are right - look at the past problems with the BCS and computer rankings for a lesson on this.

Don't know why Portland would laugh at anyone - but there's no accounting for bad manners! No, I don't know how that one turned out - hope it was good for you.

That's the number from 2004, after multiplying. See current TSSAA numbers at http://www.tssaa.org/Classifications/e2007...enrollments.htm Actual number for 2006 is 360, with the multiplier it's 648.

Maybe we were talking apples and oranges. I was thinking ALL privates Div I and II, the larger Christian schools (e.g. the catholic ones) put a LOT of money into their sports. But maybe I'm wrong.

Over the years classifications change (due to TSSAA, etc.), but one constant has been that since the 1970s, when cougar football started, GP has played UP. GO COUGARS!

Not true Mustang! Several of the GP player's dads played on past teams. Also, remember we are a smaller school (360 vs. 577) but play up due to the multipler. Therefore, there is a numericaly smaller amount of possible supporters. If you take the extra 217 you have over GP and multiply it by 2 parents you'd have a potential fan base of 434 more than GP. And I bet all of them will be there for this great event! Anyway, it will be a great game against a great opponet! Lets play ball!

Well coach, I don't think you can say that about ALL privates being different from the preps - there is a particular type of Christian school that seeks to dominate and pours BIG $$ into athletics. But the majority of us are not that affluent.

Could you or someone else give us or point us to an example of this. I'm new to the debate, but not to the issue. However, I'd like something concrete that I can see. Is there a written document on the "merit system" that shows how it operates? Thanx!

I know public schools who, because of their intense desire to improve, went out and built a nice new facility (with some tax dollars and some private money). It has not, in these cases, turned them into instant successes. It's the drive for excellence that brings improvement and this drive starts with each athlete and coach. Sure it's nice to have better weights and lockerooms, but they don't build winners. They do help with attitude. But there are other ways of building positive attitudes that lead to winning. And small town schools have a greater advantage of developing that versus a team strung out over several counties. Probably, the most difficult thing about all this is the socio-economics of our culture. I believe there are two socio-economic factors, in particular, that have a lot to do with our discussion. First, a high percentage of good athletes come from well-to-do families (wealth brings health and health often improves intelligence and physical skill) who would rather see their child in a school with a readily apparent mission/purpose/goal (ie. college prep, Christian, etc.) rather than the public schools that don't really have a readily apparent mission/purpose/goal (I know, I've been in both). So they send them to these schools. However, this happens in the public realm also - parents send their children to better publics when they have the chance (obviously this occurs in locales where there's more than one school = urban/suburban areas). The other socio-economic factor that greatly affects our discussion is the plight of the poor. There are many great athletes from the poorer parts of our communities. Many of these are minorities. Unfortunately, sports may be the only way out of poverty so they look for the best routes to success that happen to be in their area. Usually, these tend to be with the schools that have a winning tradition, and can be either private or public. They look for schools that have raised the interest of the scouts. Because of my point above, the private schools who attract the wealthy, have developed a winning tradition and thus the interest of the scouts. This is true for some of the elite publics also. So when you add in the poor/minority athlete, looking for a way out, to the wealthy-family athlete you have developed quite a program! There is no way to legislate against this! It's a fact of life. To try to do so (legislate against socio-economics in sports) would be to say that NASCAR can only be raced in a car of a certain make (say Ford), because others would offer too much competition. Or, it's like saying no more hispanics from the Caribbean can play baseball, or we must limit the number of southerners on NFL teams - they're just to good! Maybe these analogies aren't good, but we must admit that legislating equality is something that even the Supreme Court has trouble with. The American way is to face the odds stacked against you, spit in their faces, bring your best game, and work your hardest to win. In so doing, you elevate your game and begin to build a tradition that will lead to excellence and success!!! In the mean time, the schools that attract the wealthy and the poor will continue to excel, giving us all something to measure up to, something to strive for, something to make us get off our backsides and spend more time being all that we can be (great Army slogan of the past!). Isn't that a great goal for life - to be the best that we can possibly be? And not worry about our shortcomings compared to others! That's what brings joy and fulfillment! So I say, lets stop whining and do something proactive. First, each individual must commit to improvement. Then, each must work on bringing up his fellow man or woman - helping them to be all that they can be. Place us all together in four divisions - but totally outlaw recruiting of any kind (leave it for the colleges and pros). There might be some others things we could do to promote competition. What we are doing now stinks! The end result will be true champions of our great state who got there by being committed to excellence. Yeah, I know some of you think this is full of hogwash, but don't go on denying the facts of life: life is not fair. Well, I've said enough! Your friend (of both public and private), a former athlete, a former public school athlete's parent, a current coach (in both public and private), soccerdad .

Where do you get the idea that the ALL privates get the cream of the crop? I've often seen superior athletes choose public schools, with a tradition of winning, over the small privates and publics with no tradition (but of course this happens mostly in the urban areas). Yes, there are privates that openly recruit and some that recruit behind our backs - but they tend to be the large privates that want to dominate all. These are the ones you have the beef with. Please realize that all private schools are not the same. The recruiters bother the small privates also! Especially when people talk of throwing us together.

Good stuff!

But in the real world we all have "off" seasons, even among the elite programs. How would this affect or not affect ones classification? Also, are there any safeguards to overloading regions (that would keep us from experiencing the gerrymandering of the TSSAA - as in 2A)? How would we ever develop traditional rivalries (which = great spirit and gate) if we move around from class to class? How would "competitive" be determined? A 5-5 season or above? Etc., etc.... I guess it would take a genius to work on all the possible permutations of this system! How about we realize this world is not fair or equal and get on with playing the game!