KitKat2

If there is a soft red, yellow/red that doesn't result in a 2 game suspension, that would be news to our coaching staff. That could be since they tend to be overly conservative and interpret rules at a very superficial level.

Thanks for the clarification.

I've got a question that I'm sure some of you can help me with, especially some of the knowledgeable couches and officials. Can a player be on a high school roster, travel with the varsity (but not dress out) and play club ball? The player would not play in any varsity level games but in some JV level games? Allowed by TSSAA rules or not?

HB2021 - You probably don't unless you get a lawyer to do the talking. They don't like lawyers /smile.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile.gif" /> /smile.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile.gif" />. The one time I tried, they blew me off because I wasn't "an official represntative of the school".

BigG - I didn't mean to imply that I agreed with our coaches rule about blanketly applying the yellow card rule. I actually thought it was a very bad rule that probably cost us a trip to the region (or at least a good shot at it). With that said, I definitely support it in the case of abusive language and/or actions toward the officials. But again, I think there would be very few of those instances if there was more respect toward the players since I see very few of those instances now even given some of the official's attitudes. There has to be some middle ground when dealing with these kids who mainly just want to play soccer. I don't think it is unreasonable to expect the TSSAA and officials to respect these student athletes by providing competent and qualified (physically and knowledge wise) to oversee the games. Some of the best officials I have seen have managed to take and keep control of a game by simply calling some fouls early, not necessarily cards, and setting expectations for the game. If there were 1 or 2 players bordering on out of control they would simply stop the game and talk with them in a respectful manner, not trying to intimidate, embarrass or belittle the player. I actually saw one official send a player off (no card or anything) and tell the coach to get him under control before he re-entered the game. It was amazing how effective that was.

defender25 - That is a great post. Is there any way we can get you to work a few of our games? Pretty much all the refs that have worked our games this year have not been very courteous to our players. From my point of view, the no. of cards as a whole seemed to be much less this year (but the physical style of play was probably higher in several of our games). The limited no. of yellows even seemed to be for the minor offenses (player yelled "OUCH" when he kicked at a ball, missed and fell, multiple fouls going to a yellow for "aggressive play", etc.). In one instance, we had a player taken out a good two steps after passing a ball resulting in a broken collarbone (in my opinion the #1 purpose of the official is to protect the players) and there wasn't even a card issued. The intent of the foul was obviously to injure and the player committing the foul was well known for taking cheap shots. I think the TSSAA definitely went too far in their rule change (2 game suspension for red). I think the first offense should have remained disqualification and a 1 game suspension. If a change was needed, I think there should be a change to allow a feedback and evaluation process for the officials (we all know if an AD files a complaint to the state or requests that an official not officiate certain school's games, they will be on a "list - the process should be anonymous with action levels for warnings, remedial training, and/or suspension/revocation of certification). I think a lot of the perceived red card problem is more related to a lack of respect toward the players on the officials part (see defender25 post) and no clear expectation on official performance on the TSSAA's part. Officials are not held accountable at any level. All the TSSAA wants to do is analyze the numbers without assessing the cause. When you have officials who physically can't get in position to make calls (making offside calls from 15-25 yards behind the play), it's tough to deal with. I think the TSSAA should have left the player penalties alone and held the coaches/schools more accountable. It is human nature to adapt to the norm and if coaches let stuff continue to go on and not deal with it, the players will adapt the style of play to reflect that. If the coach can't meet the expectation, the coach might really be the problem. Couple the red card rule change with a coaches rule that a player who gets a yellow is done for the game (our coaches rule), and pretty soon the players try not to touch a player, let alone challenge for a 50-50 ball.

I would prefer not to name the schools involved since there's enough "bad blood" between them already.

I witnessed something that seemed odd or at the very least inappropriate and was wondering if someone could explain the situation to me. During a district playoff game, at the half, the school administrator crossed the field, talked with the coach of his team, (who was animated, pointing, and indicating actions he obviously thought should have been calls in favor of his team) and proceeded to the officials. He then had about a 10-12 minute conversation with the officials using many of the same gestures his coach had used. When asked about the conversation, the administrator indicated that he just went over to "pay" the officials since they had to be paid from the district game gate. I don't know as I've ever seen payment of the refs take 10 minutes. In 10+ years of watching soccer I had never seen an official paid at half time at any game. Any insights/opinions? BTW, in defense of the officials, it did not seem to have an effect on their approach to the game. Probably a much bigger effect was the negative approach of the fans, coach, and players of the team.

To begin with if the kids and the coaches feel the game is under control then it probably is and that kid needs to come out for a while. This is a sport and injuries do take place. There are true accidents. I have seen foul calls made where to me it just looked like the momentum of the player was just running and could not stop and ran into a player. On the other hand I have seen flat out deliberate fouls and nothing called. We had a kid on our team that had to be helped off the field in three different games. Twice fouls were called and once it wasn't. I also watched a girl charge into a player in Chattanooga this season and broke the player's nose. No card was given. I have also seen a game where the goalie kept getting run over. I thought tackling the goalie was a foul, but the refs in this particular game did not. This game was so badly called that the goalie quit. He said he wasn't going to risk getting injured. In reply to your question the refs can't stop all malicious fouls, but if a kid is consistantly making intentional fouls, then take him out on a red card. Contrary to belief, not all refs are stupid. They can tell when a game is getting out of hand and they can see the players that are constantly playing dirty. Control of the game needs to be determined at the start of the game, not half way through it. Kids do get hurt. There are accidents and there is intentional harm and refs need to recognize the difference. I saw a game where a player was given a yellow card for "persistent infractions." That wording tells me that the kid is doing the same things over and over and a yellow card was just like a slap on the wrist. When he came back in it was the same stuff all over againg and the ref did nothing. There also needs to be consistency in the referee organization. As I posted earlier what accountability do refs have? Do we need to start taping games and sending them to TSSAA. We played a game where the linesman on one side called every little thing he saw and the lineman on the other call nothing except out of bound. What type of training to refs have? Do they all go somewhere different? Or is there any type of central classes for refs where they are all learning the same? And are there yearly refresher classes? I do try to make a point to let the refs know if they have called a fair game. Even when we're on the losing end. They are the ones who stick around after the game. The ones who know they called a bad game are off the fields so fast it's as if they are in fast forward.

In reference to the red cards that the Sweetwater players received during the McMinn game, they were not issued as a result of foul mouths (that came after the cards). The first red card was from an intentional tackle from behind. It was a fair call. The second red card was the result of a player retaliating for being held around the waist, when nothing was called the Sweetwater player took it upon himself to get back and so he took the McMinn' player's feet out from under him. The McMinn player fell into the box, so what the ref saw was a player down in the box. Thus the card, then the mouth. The ref in this game was inconsistent (he let hard tackles go then call touch fouls) at best and then we saw him ref a game Thursday and he was just as inconsistent in that one. He appeared to spend more time grand standing for the fans than reffing the game. His poor calling had a direct effect on the outcome of Thursdays game. i.e. resulting in a team losing that should not have. I don't condone the language used by the kids, but in reality you may not think "Your kid would never say things like that" but the reality is they are all adolescent boys with the testosterone flowing, and when they feel a game is not being called fairly, tempers start to flare and the language is not pretty. When we played a Christian team this season all our boys were talking about were the words those kids used on the field. It a fact the language is bad in all sports. I've seen enough soccer to see that there is no consistency among the refs. Each game is called different. Calls are made according the discression of the refs. Some refs are really good about not letting pushes, shoves, elbows in the back, tackles, etc., get out of hand, but you also have the refs who call nothing. When that happens the refs lose control of the game. The kids (and that includes both teams) start trying to push the limits, knowing that nothing is going to happen. When this happens tempers flare and it become a mental game rather than a good game of soccer. Players are expected to be held accountable for their actions, why are refs not held accountable for theirs. The refs number one priorty should be to protect the players. We've all seen it happen. I dare say none of use care to lose if is a fairly called game and is won on the merits of the team and not on the bad calls of the refs. I