FatCat

Now, see......that right there is EXACTLY what I am talking about. THAT IS A PIECE OF CRAP! To boot, it is OUR tax dollars that are paying this idiots salary. Who is he to not look at tapes from parents? I don't care how many million tapes they get in. The thing that most of us parents were told by the colleges we talked to was that they needed a game tape and a highlight tape. If that is not what college coaches really want.....then they need to publicize this so we don't all waste our time. That is exactly why I am saying there should be some published standards about what you need to do to position your kid for an athletic scholarship. If you can do it in academics, why can't you do it for athletics? Now, trust me.....there may be 1000's of Roger Herndon's out there.....but there are 1000's of football scholarships each year. You take 300 some odd Div I-A and I-AA times only 10 scholarships and you have 3000 at that level. And, that is a CONSERVATIVE number. To boot, Herndon was on 2 or 3 national recruiting lists, to include Rivals. So, he is special.....and he would make a heck of an impact as a defensive back on any team's roster.

Well, I am a little calmer now and I might not be quite as "passionate" about my points as I was earlier on this thread. And, as for the "black" issue, this is my basis for that statement. I believe that blacks are perceived to be better athletes overall (and they probably are). And, because of that perception, they are given more attention or a "benefit of the doubt" over a white athlete. But, again, that is just one portion of my issue. I am frustrated with "the system", but I may be a little more level-headed now. Anyway, I think my points of contention still stand, but here is the biggest gripe of all. We wouldn't have to have this thread if colleges would formalize with SPECIFICS what it is they are looking for in a football player. I know there can't be a hard, fast rule. But, they could say...."if you want to be a linebacker at So-n-So University, you need to be at least 6'2" and 240 lbs, run a minimum 4.7 in the 40, vertical leap of 32 inches, etc." or whatever standards they have. And, each school would be different. This is no different than academic admission standards that are published. But, they won't ever put it out for athletics and that is a shame. Here is something simple they could publish.....if you fit the above standards or have the potential to have them as you mature (or are close) and think you deserve to be recruited to play football for So-n-So University, then you need to do the following: 1. Have a minimum 2.5 GPA and ACT Score of 19 (or whatever their standards are....it could be higher than the minimum required by NCAA). 2. Submit a complete game video tape and a highlight video tape. (this is what I was told by at least 4 different schools) 3. Attend the So-n-So University Football Camp at least once beginning your Sophmore year. 4. So forth and so on. The problem I have is that while going through the recruiting process, we kept being told all this stuff, but nobody would tell us "you are not recruiting material for us and here is why"......or even give us a guage as to where you may fit. It is just a big unknown and you are exploring trying to see where you fit physically, academically, etc. The process just STINKS! If I would have known what I know now, I would not have wasted all the time and money I spent the last two years. And, to top it off.....to see someone so deserving as Roger Herndon get the shaft from the college football world......well, it just makes me want to blow a gasket!!! Thoughts?

Well, first, I am not an expert as to where he SHOULD have gone. But, in my opinion he could have gone to a lower-tier D-I school (say MTSU, Vanderbilt, Tulane, Ala-Birm, Memphis, etc.) as a D-Back. But, without a doubt, he is a top notch D I-AA prospect. But, the whole point I had was he was barely recruited. So, I don't think he got a fair look or evaluation to know where he did fit. It just doesn't pass the common sense test. Why would someone who runs a 4.6 (minimum), 36" vertical leap, Mr. Football winner, over 4000 yds in 2 yrs, outstanding defensive stats, 4-yr starter, great student, etc. not get looked at by more schools? SOMETHING IS WRONG WITH THIS PICTURE!!!!!

Oh.....so since it is not ignorance, now it is a "weak mind"? You have to come up with something don't you? It is not an excuse. It is a fact. I am a realist. The reality is that black athletes of equal ability/athleticism get greater attention than that of their white counterparts. Doesn't mean you don't try or give up. Doesn't mean the world is over. But, when something doesn't go right....you analyze why. And, when analyzing THE FACTS, it is clear that being black and coming from a high school that consistantly produces college talent gives you a HUGE leg up in the recruiting battles. That is why Austin Rogers got his scholarship. He came from a high school that habitually produces college talent (not to mention he had 4.4 speed). Same thing for white boys coming out of Brentwood Academy. Funny thing is....with 4.4 speed....why wasn't he recruited more heavily? How many schools actually recruited him outside the immediate area? THS....this is not my son we are discussing. I can live with what happened with him because he was not the "clear" talent that Herndon was. And, he limited himself because of what he wants to study.....many schools don't offer his intended major.

First, apsugov, thank you for your level-headed response. I can agree to disagree....especially if the person on the other side is level-headed in their argument. I can respect your points, especially since I know you knew Davis much better than I did. Second, I don't think Roger can dunk with 2 hands standing flat-footed.....BUT, he can dunk. His vertical is about 36". I am sure Mario's was more than that, though. Anyway, I am over it now......just had to get that off my chest.....very frustrated for Roger. Such a great kid and athlete. Didn't seem fair. And, as for him playing for APSU, that may not happen. I am not going to speak for him but I know he is considering not even playing ball now. Time will tell. I think he is still frustrated over the whole recruiting thing, too. I think he needs some time to just sort through everything right now......but, again, I don't want to pretend to speak for Roger. These are just things I am hearing. Personally, I hope he does play. He'll have 6 other "former" teammates to play with if he does. And, with them adding a scholarship program, there is clear incentive for him to play. But, as I said, I know he will be successful no matter what he chooses to do. Again, thanks APSUGOV......would not have expected a response like that out of you.

Thanks Gerry.....these IGNORANT IMBECILES have got my blood boiling now. First, my "sour grapes" have nothing to do with my son. I know he is not a D-I talent. But, I do know he is a D I-AA talent. But, that is not where my heartache comes from. I sat and watched Roger Herndon play lights out football for 4 years.....he became a starter sometime during his freshman year on both sides of the ball. He went to the summer camps. He was clocked in the low 4.6's and high 4.5's in the 40 on a consistant basis. He is a 4.0 student and much higher on a weighted scale. And, he is not one of these kids who is all finese and no punch. He would come up out of his safety position and knock peoples' lights out. As a running back, he literally drug 3 and 4 defenders with him after the initial hit.....sometimes 5 yards or more. And, he was the ultimate team player. When asked to play QB, he played QB. When asked to move to RB, he moved to RB without question. If asked to do anything, Roger did it and at 110%. He killed himself during the off-season working out at the stadium when the weather was at it's worst in the winter. He got up early in the morning before school and worked out at the YMCA. So for any of these idiots to say "if he can play football, they will find him", it proves their ignorance. Yeah, we were told all that when our kids were juniors. But guess what.....it didn't happen that way. Greenbrier made it to the 3A Semi-finals when they were juniors and to "the 'Boro" when they were seniors. NOT A SNIFF! And, too boot, Roger played 12 out of 14 games his junior year with a Grade 3 seperated shoulder. He played hurt all the time. And it NEVER resulted in less performance. Roger was Mr. Football runner-up as a junior and won the award as a senior. And to have ONLY Vanderbilt and Austin Peay seriously recruit him is a HUGE slap in the face from the entire college football institution. Tennessee Tech was the only OVC school to talk to him and then never followed up. UT talked to him, but it was never at a serious stage. But, UT was probably a reach. So, how no OVC school could recruit him AT ALL is just a JOKE and proves the point. Here are two perfect examples for you to prove my earlier points: 1. Marshall Co. has been a consistant winner and produced talent for years (see the third point in my original post). They had a kid who was very talented that graduated last year, Mario Davis. Mario is black. Great athlete who ran lights out. According to the folks at Marshall Co., Mario got letters all the time from every SEC school, USC, Nebraska, etc. But, also according to folks at Marshall Co., Mario stunk it up in the classroom, but was recruited heavily anyway. So, here we have a black kid who is no more athletic, only slightly faster, and according to awards given, not as good a player as Roger, and NO WHERE NEAR the student Roger is. Yet, he gets recruited heavily and Roger doesn't. Somebody PLEASE explain that one to me!!! 2. Vanderbilt signs a black kid out of TX to play safety. His 40 time is slightly slower. He is the same size as Roger. His stats are far worse. (I have no clue about his performance in the classroom). And, he gets the scholarship offer and Roger is left out in the cold. Somebody please explain that one!!! Listen, everything you guys are saying on here is exactly what myself and all the other parents were told while our kids were juniors/seniors. But, guess what.....IT DIDN'T HAPPEN!!! Greenbrier was loaded with talent and we all just knew we'd have recruiters coming to check out our boys to evaluate them. They didn't even come around to look. How do you even know if they can play or not if you don't come check them out. It was obvious they didn't want to waste their time watching a bunch of white boys. So, before you go criticizing me........know your FACTS and walk a mile in my shoes!

Not trying to ruffle feathers or offend. I am speaking the truth. And, if a black man can talk about whites anytime they feel like it, then I can give my opinion about blacks. First, I am not a racist. I had a close black friend as one of the grooms in my wedding. Grew up with several black friends and served in the Army with several. No problem with blacks. BUT, the fact is if you are black, you have a greater chance of being recruited. The statistics speak for themselves. Just like if you are white, you have a much greater chance of being a Quarterback or an O-lineman. There are statistical trends that show this. I was just shocked at a couple of the blacks with worse stats, worse accolades, slower 40 times, etc., that were given a scholarship over a white boy with more stats, more accolades, faster 40, etc. But, this is far from just a race issue, that is just the#1 issue. As I said, there are at least 3 other major factors involved. If I offended anyone....no intention. Facts are facts.

Oh, I have to stop this. I have stooped to his level. See ya CBarkley. Good luck this fall.

The Drew Bennett/Erron Kinney Camp is geared for Youth.

Yeah, sounds like you have a LOT of respect for him! Plus, you are the one who popped off at the mouth all last year just to have your Eagles finish 6th in the region! So, don't tell me or anyone else about "popping off". If they mean nothing, why do we play them?!? They are a gauge for the coach to check the progress of his team. And, based on their performance in that scrimmage, their progress is very good. Makes for a good season in the fall! They still have a lot of work to do as all teams do. But, their progress is good since they are replacing a ton of great seniors! Again, you can't read the English language. I said the last several games EXCEPT for the game this past year at your homecoming. Go back and try to read that one again.....S L O W L Y! You are clearly the epitome of the "dumb jock"! You must have been a lineman.

See, there you go again. Taking plain English text and twisting it around into something that was never said. First, No Doubt has yet to EVER talk smack on here that I have seen in my 2 years of posting. He is probably the most respectful guy around when it comes to posting. Very humble in all . Second, I said IF I were to make predictions based off the scrimmage they would finish second or third. But, you must have skipped the rest of the paragraph when I said there was a LONG WAY to go from here to there. Lots of things like injuries, maturity, teams gelling or not-gelling, etc. that happen along the way. But, the talent is definitely there to finish 2nd or 3rd. I don't know why they post a score. Probably because the average joe in the county like to see scores. The reality is that they both scored 3 touchdowns. The only reason Greenbrier "lost" was because they went for two after the last touchdown. And, as you should know, they did the two point try not to "win" the scrimmage, but just to work on it in a game situation. Yes, my son was a senior last year and is no longer playing, but that doesn't make me any less a Greenbrier Bobcat. I have another one waiting in the wings to play in about 3-4 years. And, even after he graduates, I will still be a Greenbrier Bobcat! That is one of the great things about this close-knit community.....everyone comes out and supports the program! Everytime we have played at Sycamore (high school or Pee Wee) our fans have outnumbered the Sycamore "faithful" each time except this last year. And, you only had a decent crowd that night since it was your homecoming. CBarkley, as long as you are around here posting your incessant, immature dribble, FatCat will be here to annoy you! I don't go looking for your posts, I just can't help but find them since you seem to post all over the board in every sport as a supposed subject-matter expert. I have ignored many, many of your posts. It is just that certain ones require a response!

Wow! Cbarkley/catfish is at it again! I step away for awhile and he goes and tries to stir it up with another Bobcat fan. Sorry about that No Doubt. CBarkley, I am glad to see that you take it so personal when I "attacked" the Sycamore program. As No Doubt has accurately interpreted, my "attack" was on you and not on Sycamore. I have plenty of respect for the Sycamore program from the Pee Wee level all the way up. I think it is a GREAT rivalry and was THRILLED when I found out we would be in the same region again. I just love to call you out since you seem to love to run your mouth and tell everyone how it is going to be about EVERYTHING!!! No, the odds of Greenbrier ending up in Murfreesboro again this year are pretty dad-gum slim. BUT, that doesn't mean they won't have another high-caliber squad again this year. If I were to predict the Bobcats' season based on their scrimmage with Portland, I would say they finish #2 in the region, #3 at the worst. However, there is a long way to go between here and there. They could finish #5. What they will be is good. And, they will definitely play smash-mouth football the way Greenbrier always has. Cbarkley, if you didn't get on here making a fool of yourself so often, maybe I and others wouldn't jump at the chance to mess with your mind so much. Your reaction to my post is evidence enough that you are easily riled up. Worse, yet, is the way you responded making bold predictions about how the War Eagles were going to kill Greenbrier this year just like you said they would last year. You continue with your normal madness. I am looking forward to seeing how this year's Bobcats play after losing such a loaded senior class. I think there is a lot of talent still on the team that will step up and win a big game or two along with the games they are "supposed" to win.

Tim, You continue on with your White House arrogance! White House should win our region, and maybe even make it to Murfreesboro. But, after seeing Fulton put it to our Bobcats in the second half last year makes me agree with catfish for once. Everyone else is playing for 2d in 3A behind either Fulton or A-E.

So, how did this year's Bobcats look against Portland tonight? I know they are having to rebuild the whole offense and half the defense. How did it come together?

....And the Sycamore Wanna-Be Eagles!

I know Herndon is consistantly in high 4.5's/low 4.6's.

Yeah, but when you have kids who have proven on the field what their heart achieves, then it is no longer a blind date. You have seen them accomplish something without the 4.4 speed. I am sorry, but if a kid has 4.6 speed or better and puts up over 4000 yards rushing, plus over 5000 yards all-purpose in 2 years, then he should be recruited heavily at least by Div 1-AA. But, when you have the white skin, they seem to overlook your on-field performance. As No Doubt said, I think there is a lot of relationship issues that come to play in this as well.

Read this article last week and thought it was very good. I have wondered aloud why some of these obviously very good football players are not drawing more attention. I think Coffee County's coach hit on something when he mentioned that they are all white as a reason for the lack of attention. Top colleges not rushing to sign these backs I mean, at a minimum they should be getting heavy attention from 1-AA schools, but they just aren't. Something just doesn't seem right about that.

Here's the article from The Tennessean: Johnson Leaving Stratford Sounds like MC got themselves a good one!

Excellent job CoachT! As VG said, you may be able to argue onesies and twosies, but it is a well put together team that is well represented across the state and all classifications. Personally, I wouldn't want to even try to put together just one 24-man team. But, I will agree with one poster.....the only one that shocked me was seeing Coker on the team. He only played about 6 games. There were a ton of great backs in the state this year to have selected somebody who only played part of the season.

Yes, the local papers know more, but most of the local papers in the Nashville area are all owned by the same group that owns the Tennessean. The local reporters have a lot of input to this team.

You and ELA are the ones who still don't get it. Nobody is defending the coaches who don't participate and noone is blaming those that do. What we are doing is blaming the organization as a whole for putting something out that should not be put out. AGAIN, WHY DO THEY HAVE TO PUT OUT A TEAM?!?

Again, just because they call it an All-State team does not make it so. Most people's point is that this list is more of a vendetta against coaches who refuse to join than it is an attempt to honor the players. I could argue that having only 12 spots is rediculous, but I won't because until you can at least get the system to 12 defendable players by having good participation, why does it matter. ELA, you still haven't answered the infamous question as to why the TFCA feels it necessary to even put out an "all-state" team since they don't have even decent representation. It is like the TFCA has to do this to have credibility or something. If that is the case, they are losing more credibility than they are gaining by having something that is not representative of the whole state.

AHA! You just proved my point! This is a list of the best players on the teams whose coaches participate in TFCA!!! This is NOT an All-State list!!! No matter how much you want it to be an All-State list, it is not. Just because TFCA calls it an All-State list does not make it so!!! Since TFCA is so new, I go back to my original question. Why bother putting out a list until you can get membership to a point that it is much, much more representative of the WHOLE state?!?

Leonard, just like everyone else, valid point. However, that still doesn't make this even close to a credible "all-state" team. Heck, I could put out an all-state team that would be as credible, if not more so. The whole point is why bother if it is only getting participation from 1/3 - 1/2 of the coaches? Just don't put out a list. You are not penalizing the nomination. You can nominate all day long. But, there is a HUGE difference from getting nominated and deserving to be labelled as "best of the best". Again, make it defendable. This is not defendable!!!