repete

My sentiments exactly. No intent to bait. I made no mention to any named specific players to protect their. privacy. I know there is a mix of very good players from a variety of competetive teams on BHS. I have an idea of who plays where. I have had the luxury of being on the field with these fine athletes in the heat of battle and know first hand what they can do. Someone said there were 9 VP players on the team, so logically that was highlighted, since the fastest one on the field plays for them. My comments were not intended to exclude anyone else. I think the mustcoach referred to Bearden as flat to somehow take something away from the quality of the opposition. I dont bait. I present the facts as I see them. If a person's perspective is otherwise, they should search their own motivations.

You can say the same about any team. Remember, BHS had a day of rest, and ORHS was coming right off that very big win that no one gave them any credit beforehand . BHS is very talented and fast, with the Velocity Elite players. They were matched in very contentious away games (with the Ohio teams) and you can tell the difference between being flat and being evenly matched by a very skilled opponent (I watched the end of one of those games). Most of their local competetion with the exception of the last 2 games, have been walkovers, and blow outs as well. In any event, they did manage to pull out the win in the last 20 seconds. So in that, it was a very good game. I look for them to beat Greenville and advance. But then again...

Thats not factually accurate. That's not "all" you have to do. You have to attend at least 3 meetings of a local association a year, which means you have to join the association. You have to be in good graces with the association, and be assigned by an assignor of that association that is blessed by TSSAA. You have to go to the annual coach/referee rules meeting. Usually the assigors rank the games and the referees and cross match. You have to pass the post season law review to qualify for post season play. Look at local association web sites. There they will have more detailed requirements. It is a big disconnect when people cry "incompetence" and then find out with a little digging that their least favorite referee is in fact, very active in their local association, probably even the president . You have to bust hump, do games in areas you dont want to, probably spending the game fee on gas and food. Its called paying your dues. And you do it year after year until one day you get the call to do a big game. So its not all true that you just take an open book test and voila, you're doing Bearden vs Farragut. That comes with experience, most physically fit, proven track record, and trust. Sure there are politics but mostly its about managing scarce resources and putting the most capable with the most demanding games.

The only problem is that there aren't enough people willing to step up to officiate because of people with a lynch mob mentality. So you reap what you sow sort of speak. Soccer is a physical game, its played that way all over the world. I tend to let them play, bringing them to the ragged edge, but reigning it in as appropriate. Players like that because it pushes their skills to the limit, which they want. People want their teams to win, so naturally they will be biased. Its all white noise to me when I am out on the field. Their point of view is slanted from the perspective of armchair observer. Most never have called a game in their life. Usually at this level in the tourney assignors go with the top refs, who are college and semipro level. I cant speak for one region over another but I know the folks where I ref are very good. My suggestion, stop assigning blame and get over it. Coaches make mistakes, players make mistakes, referees make mistakes. It goes with the territory. This is not an exact science. Its highly interpretive and subjective. It requires alot of judgement and weighing the decision versus the spirit of the game. People who are engrained in the football mentality usually have the toughest time adjustng to proper soccer. HS soccer is hamstrung by additional NF and TSSAA requirements that thickens the rule book needlessly to keep lawyers from sueing schools.

It was an evenly matched, well played, hard fought game. Oak Ridge was up 1-0 with 10 minutes left then Bearden ties it. With 20 seconds left, Bearden put the ball in the net on a cross to the back post to win 2-1. I think the consensus before the game was that Bearden would have an easy time but I think the home team gave them all they could handle.

In all fairness, I got home from the Oak Ridge Farragut game tonight and the website was already updated with the game highlights before it hit the report on WBIR later on. As far as the flash goes, just skip over it. I think the website was by volunteer standards, outstanding. The webmaster said if he fixes the errors, it would mess up the look and feel. There are good soccer schools that dont even have a website so kudos to anyone who gets one going. If people want a pro web site then pay for it. Im not going to be nitpicky with respect to a school website built by a volunteer. For the time and info, I think the website is the best in TN prep soccer, boys or girls.

mj, Did you get a chance to see the game in person? It was very good. Oak Ridge's defense played very well. Their offense made the most of the opportunities presented. They definately play Farragut better on the wider field, as their early season loss was on a narrow Farragut football field.

While I understand your frustration, it is still not an infraction if it is not deliberate. Ever hear of Maradona? The FIFA refs had it right, but it did look bad. I totally disagree with your analysis that things should be called different in the box just because its the box. The foul is the foul. Now what you dont realize is that the bar for trifling can be up to the referee. Players that act differently in the box thinking the referee will give them a little leeway are setting themselves up for disaster. This isnt mindreading or rocket science. For me, a player has to make a play at the ball, propel it or swat it away for it to come up on my radar. That person is probably getting a red or yellow card too, depending on the circumstances, and whether the action was DOGSO. You get to understand what gets what after alot of games.

USSF Advice to Referees is pretty authoritative and interpretative, and Law 12 is pretty universal, even for HS games. High level referees usually refer to it often. There is also a video "Myths of the Game" we use when training new referees that shows a few misconceptions regarding deliberate handling that really bakes the less informed coaches and parents noodles. First things first; it is not an infraction if it is incidental, doesn't matter if a player gains an advantage. Its is not an infraction if the ball played to the hand, doesnt matter if player gains an advantage. The only judgement used in applying the law, ask was it deliberate? Thats all. There are only two places in the LOTG where the word "deliberate" applies; deliberately wasting time (pass back) and deliberate handling. Both require fore thought and intent. Its probably an infraction, but I would categorize it as trifling if 1. The score is 8-0 and its in the box, and the losing team somehow handles it. I wouldnt call it, and sell it that way. (Why rub it in). 2. the player made no attempt to play the ball after it hit their arm. I wouldnt call it if a player had her back to the ball and it struck her in the arm, propelling it to their feet. How could a person deliberate on the ball with their back turned? I probably would call it if its so obvious that not calling it would put my credibility in the tank. Unless it was #1.

The IFK in HS (National Federation) for the team in clear posession is the correct response. Kudos to all who knew that. We must try as referees to sort out which is which. Often fans, coaches, players who cross-play school, competetive, it is often what they see the most. One other rule nuance is the throw in. If the ball doesnt come in, it goes the other way only in HS. In my competetive, HS, adult amateur and college matches, its usually some rule nuance one must keep straight. It gets difficult when one calls different games on the same day.

If you saw the Houston matches, did you not see their match against Oak Ridge?

It might be a stretch for you to find them outside the KFC. Most of the players you cite come from that organization. A little parochialism?

Just wondering since you had an earlier thread on good up and coming new players if you happened to notice the younger ORHS players battling the seasoned Collierville team pretty evenly. They were outstanding and are surely exciting to watch. Look for good things to come from this group.

Hmm. Not to sound condescending, but if you did ref you would understand the code of ethics that all of us who do it, are held to. When we ref, we ref, when we watch, we watch. We don't bash refs when we watch. I understand your life situation but that is not the issue, nor an excuse to ridicule or smugly chide with indignation, those that put their integrity on the line. This is why not everyone can do the job, since courage isnt passed out evenly. More so, those that become frustrated, quit, leaving the game for various reasons. The issue as you say, is thinking, as the late great FIFA ref Ken Aston said so poignantly, "reffing is thinking". Now with regard to "thinking", one must ask "why do you think it's poor?" The word poor has many meanings, and in this context, the only interpretation you give is that it is below acceptable. So what is acceptable? 50% of all spectators think every call is a bad call. The other 50% think the same call is a good call. So there you have it. Only half of all calls are acceptable in an ideal world. Half of any distribution is normal, and normal is poor from your own words. So the normal condition is the state of adversity by design. Unless you have in your data bank a thousand games under your belt to draw on, as some of us who have been doing this for years, it really doesn't matter what perspective you come from, at best you will be 50% satisfied. Maybe now you may see that all parties make mistakes; players miss runs, coaches make strategic errors, spectators see only what they want to see. Without a ref though a game can take two states - either a glorified warmup, or all out brawl, My personal opinion, I like to see them play to their ability, take them to the edge of that ability within the spirit of the game. Anything less is a milquetoast scrimmage. If you really do care for the game, as I do, you would appreciate the physicality without resorting to the cop out that safety is somehow compromised. Remember, that person in the middle may have a busy schedule too where their choice to ref comes at the expense of other things as well. Maybe they are a single dad, or college student, or retiree. Maybe they arent as fast as the players, but maybe they dont have to be. They get banged up too. A thousand or so games does that to an aging body. The mind is still there though. Since refereeing is thinking.

BigG I think it already has gotten to this point. All I am reading is alot of folks (likely adults) trashing a group of 14 to 17 yr old girls for playing the game of soccer. And now they are gunning for them to be stomped on and thats OK. Cudos to fevercoach!

I'm curious, since you were a player, and coach, how come you haven't taken a ref certification class to complete your knowledge base? It might be easier to understand the game from that point of view, rather than come across as someone so expert at the game, and ranting about poor officiating. You talk the talk, but can you walk the walk? There is a great shortage of HS refs and until people step up, it isn't going to get easier. My kids play HS and I ref around their games. Its difficult to schedule. I also ref college and adult amateur. We are only human but we are out there serving for the good of the game. So the gauntlet has been laid down. Get certified.

This was sent to us HS officials from TSSAA: ----- Original Message ----- Sent: Thursday, August 16, 2007 4:25 PM Subject: HEAT & HUMIDITY REMINDER!!! Remember to take every precautionary option you can to deal with the extreme heat and humidity issue that exists early in our girls' soccer season. You can take official's timeouts for unusual heat or humidity which may create a health risk to the players. There is no set time or number of heat and humidity timeouts that can be called. Call as needed! --------------------- Some more things to add. An officials time out stops the clock. Usually when I do a game I look for an opportune time when the ball is out of play that is a non impact to play (GK or TI near half). Here are some helpful things to make it go smoothly: 1. Dont throw water bottles on the field. 2. Players usually will try and come off the field. Try to keep them on the field and bring water to them 3. Keep track of your subs at this time 4. The clock will stop 5. For an officials time out, a restart with the whistle and proper signal to signal to timekeeper. 6. Dont throw water bottles on the field. (reinforcement)

Oak Ridge does not play Greenville until Sept. 7th.

http://orhs.ortn.edu/ I received my information from their web site as follows: The Oak Ridge Schools have been ranked second in the South and one of the "100 Best School Districts in the United States" by Offspring magazine, a new parenting magazine by the editors of the Wall Street Journal's Smart Money magazine. The Oak Ridge Schools were earlier ranked among the country's best by Expansion Management magazine. You may get more info on their website at: http://orhs.ortn.edu/ Also West and Oak Ridge are in Region 2 District 3 AAA.

I am sure that club teams would hold a tryout for your daughters. In that age bracket the Knoxville Crush club has two teams. They just switched up their teams, I believe. . One team is to be a Div I the other D2. Hard to say how the teams will turn out in the spring There is a Div I team named The Velocity Premier out of the Smoky Mountain Club. Very, Very good team, they travel quite a bit to some top tournaments. I don't believe that The Impact has a team in that age bracket, but you could check. All these clubs have web sites you could get coach contact info. In Oak Ridge they have one team with a combined age bracket U15-U17. It's a pretty good team. Regardless of where you choose to live any of these teams are options. All practice fields are easy enough to get to from anywhere in Knoxville and some drive from Oak Ridge to Knoxville for club. Hope this helps.

All three schools are very good schools academically. Oak Ridge has very high math and science programs. Listed as a top 100 school. Bearden and Farragut are strong as well. As far as population Oak Ridge has 1400, Bearden has 1911 and Farragut has 2373. While looking at schools be sure to undertand that there is a new high school opening up in West Knoxville in fall 2008. It will change the demographics of where folks will be going to schools rather drastically. I am not exactly sure how it will effect sports, but when kids are being shifted around the many high schools of West Knoxville I believe it will have some effect. Right now Bearden and Farragut are the strong teams after the new school opens the power may shift a bit. Oak Ridge is the only High School in that town so they are not effected, they also will have a brand new state of the art building at the end of 2008 or 2009. They under contruction right now. I do not envy your choice. I would suggest looking for the school and area that best suits your family and the soccer will follow. Best of luck.

I agree. There are some freshmen who are coming in that are not necessarily big, or fast, but can play. Give them time to develop. They wont displace starters but they will get a look. Some have been seen when they were on club teams and were middle schoolers when they were at HS camps run by some of the coaches that post here. The coaches know who they are and wish they either played for them, or are at home in bed sick on the day their schools play These players will be at an advantage having played up a few years on their good club ball team (U16) with existing upper class members and they will be already playing at a higher physical level than say a person playing on an exclusive single aged (U14) club team. They will also have established themselves with a team chemistry. Lets not put any pressure on incoming freshmen agreed. Lets let them come in and if they happen to turn some heads then all the better. All I can say is keep an open mind, watch and don't be suprised if one of these new players on the field sneaks past good established players to snap the ball in goal with her head. Then you will believe.

It was a great game to watch! 0-0 at the half Both teams came out strong in the second half. Oak Ridge was able to get two on the board early and with about 7-10 minutes to go Karns was able to score one and then soon tie it up. With about 4 min to play. Both teams played the last minutes hard no one willing to settle for the tie and play overtime. Two ten mintues overtimes, then two golden goal fives with great chances for both teams, perhaps Oak Ridge had a couple more chances, but both keepers played a great game. Each team played all out with players cramping up on the field. Not one player had anything left. I am sure they left it all on the field. In the end it came down to PK's. Karns goes first and scores, Oak Ridge, Karns keeper saves. Karns up next and scores just past the hands of the goalie, thought he was going to have it.. Oak Ridge puts one just a hair wide of the goal. Karns up next and it goes over the top. Oak Ridge, blows one over the top of the goal. Karns needs one to win it, next up for Karns I believe was #6. He played a great game. Places it right in the goal. Karns wins 3-2 on PK's. If you would have told me Oak Ridge would miss three PK's I would never have believed you, but it happened. It was a super game. Every player fought for every ball and both keepers battled to keep the ball out of the net. My hats off to both teams. I hate that a game this good had to go to pk's but I had a feeling if they would let them keep playing they would still be playing and we would still be watching. God I love soccer.

I ref at Mike Rose in Germantown alot, during State Cup and prestiguous tournaments. I come 320 miles away to do the games. The Memphis referees are very good, there are a couple local high level and USSF nationals, and the GIT attracts alot of referees from around the country. I absolutely agree there is no place, absolutely no place in soccer for an adult to abuse any youth, referee or not. I protect my youth referees in my area with stiff fines against clubs for these instances. Also hearing the diatribe about a player whining about reffing, and particular calls, get over it. Here is my solution: sit in a class, get certified, get on the field, or shut up. In reading the posts, its a never ending litany of the blame game. Players rank on referees, coaches spectators are also in the mix. Its a veritable gang up on the guy in the middle, who probably will make a mistake since they are only human. As referees, we strive for 2 things : 1) control of the game 2) any decision, for what its worth, not affecting the outcome of the game. Anything else is just the filler. Now yes dissent is one of the seven cautionable offenses, and maybe the referee had enough. I ususally let players and coaches vent, as long as its not disrespectful. Sportsmanship is the true hallmark of this game. Winning is secondary. I'll be in Memphis for State Cup this year, with all the other higher ranking referees in the state.

I applaud you and challenge you to improve on and off the field, having a ref cert isn't the end. I also think that more youth should certify. This will make them better players, and more respectful as I have observed. Spectators and coaches that discourage youth referees by criticizing them do a disservice to the game as well. Referees can be teachers and role models too. Referees are held to a high standard as noted, including ethics regarding criticizing other referees when not working games. We have to support each other even off the field to improve the game overall. Its a cop out to say we have fewer refs because our youth dont want to be like the bad ones. We have fewer youth wanting to be referees because its a position where they see people will get on them. Those that take up the challenge see developing leadership and courage as opportunities. Maybe we have more youth wanting to be doctors and lawyers (some are refs too) because young people only see what society shows - money, and want that. They dont see the hard work, the sacrifice, drive and dedication it takes to obtain and maintain excellence. There are no short cuts. People that referee are doing it for a variety of reasons. The more successful do it because they care about the players and the game and work hard to improve. There are politics also. Has anyone really given thought to why the Bearden, Houston, CAK, games get the more experienced officials? I know some of you personally and respect you and you respect me. In a customer oriented service, the players are our customers. You have a hard job. I have a hard job. We are both try to be very good at our jobs. When I show up for a game, I would rather they say "thanks we have you today", versus "(expletive) not you again!" as I have had both. It gets more difficult to do the higher level as we age and our bodies break down. We are out there with people maybe a third our age. We work alot of games, some over 200 a year, because there is a tremendous shortage of officials. I have well over a thousand games in my career. I make mistakes too. I try not to let them affect the outcome of the game. The JV game where the refs made the mistake did not affect the outcome of the game. In the final analysis, the game is for the players, not the coaches, not the referees. Refs work to an unwritten rule, that they are not to interject too much to spoil the enjoyment of the game. This is a double edge sword, since at most only 50% will agree with them. We in America really have only scratched the surface of this game, the way the rest of the world views it. It is truely a beautiful game, one that needs nourishing, in play, coaching, and officiating. At the highest international level, it can also be a war, figuratively with nations and people pitted against each other. Our games in TN are nothing near like that. Referees are guardians of the spirit of the game, striving for safe, fun and fair, which must be in delicate balance between flow of the game and control. My hats off to coaches who support the people calling games, and to those that are working for the good of the game.