Slide Tackles...don't let them slide any longer

[Canesoverhere]

Has anyone wearing a yellow shirt answered the original question yet?

 

BigG, I'm on your side with this. THey are part of the game. I am 2 for 2 now with clean tackles being called as fouls when no foul was committed. My curiosity was is someone trying to quash them by calling everyone a foul.

 

RE the St Agnes Player. Tough call. I wasn't there, but based on several reports, the injured wasn't in the play. Seems like there are grounds to address this with more severity than a red card. If it took place as reported, seems logical that player should be suspended from the game for a season.

 

As we should track players offenses, we should also track officials calls. That would certainly be an interesting statistic. Two games back to back can be so different based on the amount an official will call or not call. Many permit use of the hands to defend with, others whistle for it. What message does that send to a player?

[ws6transam30]

Has anyone wearing a yellow shirt answered the original question yet?

 

BigG, I'm on your side with this. THey are part of the game. I am 2 for 2 now with clean tackles being called as fouls when no foul was committed. My curiosity was is someone trying to quash them by calling everyone a foul.

 

RE the St Agnes Player. Tough call. I wasn't there, but based on several reports, the injured wasn't in the play. Seems like there are grounds to address this with more severity than a red card. If it took place as reported, seems logical that player should be suspended from the game for a season.

 

As we should track players offenses, we should also track officials calls. That would certainly be an interesting statistic. Two games back to back can be so different based on the amount an official will call or not call. Many permit use of the hands to defend with, others whistle for it. What message does that send to a player?

 

Canes and BigG, I am with both of you on this, slide tackling is a part of the game. I do feel the problem is a result of allowing improperly trained players performing the tackle. Which in effect is a result of not being trained properly, and on the officials side lack of training, be it knowledge of what a good slide tackle is, being whistle happy, or not in proper physical condition to be in the proper position to make the call.

 

I played the game, coached the game and ref'd the game in the past, and when it reached a point that I could not physically do what I asked the players to do, as a coach; could not physcally stay at the speed of the game as a ref...... I became an observer and fan. My point is, we are asking these girls to play a game that is a contact sport, but we don't want them to play the way the game is supposed to be played. Why? because we either, as refs we can't keep up with them or don't know the rules and as coaches don't know the proper way of teaching the techniques of the game or are physically unable to, or to proud to ask for someone who can teach them, to come help.

[Canesoverhere]

Maybe we found a topic within a topic. I don't think there will be any argument that the level of girls soccer has changed dramatically in the past 10 years. The game is much more physical, there are more athletes with a high level of fitness. THe clubs have been cultivating theses players as athletes since they were U-8s & U-9s. Are we all on the same page?

 

Okay, now lets look at the average ref. I can't speak for east or west but a lot of the same faces on the west have been here for 10 years. They have not elevated their fitness to keep up with the game. I watched a ref Saturday officiate nearly the entire match from the circle at mid-field. Yea, I'm exaggerating but by feet, not yards. Perhaps something can be done to address this? G?

[Stoat]

Looking at the bigger picture, a slide tackle is just one of a number of different ways of challenge for the ball.

 

What makes it a foul is when the referee decides it is a foul.

 

The six most important words in soccer; In The Opinion Of The Referee.

 

As to the subject at hand, banning "slide tackles". There is a men's league in Franklin, the least competitive of which does not permit "slide-tackles" mainly for the safety of all the players. As has been mentioned, some know how to execute such a tackle, others don't. Some have played enough, at a high enough level, to expect such a challenge and be able to avoid it. Others haven't. In order to have everyone report to work on Monday, the long standing policy has been no slide tackling.

 

What constitutes a slide tackle?

 

A question that is heard week after week. "Ref! That's a slide!" Or "Ref! That was never a slide." Etc.

 

It's all subjective and ultimately the referee has to make the decision, quickly and in the heat of the moment.

 

I'll also add that "getting the ball first" does not always make for a clean challenge. Please help me dispel that myth.

 

Consistency of officials. I agree that the general standard of officials is not great. But, take all the old, fat, lazy and/or incompetent referees away and there would be heck of a lot of games that would either not get played or would be played without officials.

 

Are coaching decisions consistent? Are they always right? Do players never miss shots? Do keepers never let the ball slip from their grasp?

 

Of course they do, but games are always lost because of the referee. The referees are always terrible, but I suspect that not one of those shouting parents or spectators looks into getting certified and doing a better job.

 

I agree that referees sometimes call things that make no sense, but players and coaches, please understand that yelling at the referee is going to make very little difference. Consider your angle of view and then that of the referee. Did he or she see something that you couldn't? Were you 80 yards away and the referee right on top of play? Were there five players in between the referee and the incident and you had an unobstructed view? Was there a deflection that went unseen by one of you?

 

I suspect my words will be wasted, but if even a few of you take them to heart, educate others, go to your local high school referee chapter meeting to see what it's all about, learn the rules. Learn the rules. Read the NFHS rulebook. Go online and read the US Soccer memos and referee directives.

 

There are a couple of YouTube clips from England out there about referees and abuse. Check 'em out.

 

But lay off the referees. If enough of them get fed up with being shouted at, called names, abused, taunted, etc., you may well have games going unplayed or officiated with club linesmen.

[Stoat]

Perhaps something can be done to address this? G?

 

See my other post. If you don't like the referees you get, become one yourself. Tell ten of your friends to get certified. If we get enough new blood who will keep up with play, rules, etc., we won't need these guys everyone complains about.

[BigG]

Maybe we found a topic within a topic. I don't think there will be any argument that the level of girls soccer has changed dramatically in the past 10 years. The game is much more physical, there are more athletes with a high level of fitness. THe clubs have been cultivating theses players as athletes since they were U-8s & U-9s. Are we all on the same page?

 

Okay, now lets look at the average ref. I can't speak for east or west but a lot of the same faces on the west have been here for 10 years. They have not elevated their fitness to keep up with the game. I watched a ref Saturday officiate nearly the entire match from the circle at mid-field. Yea, I'm exaggerating but by feet, not yards. Perhaps something can be done to address this? G?

 

In an ideal world, all of the refs would be FIFA fit, and know the game as well as we all thought we knew it (said with tongue in cheek more to myself than to others). The problem is that we barely have enough refs as it is (at least in the Knoxville area). There are many games that teams have only 2, and some I have heard that only get 1! While it would be great to require a fitness test to qualify, then how many refs do you all know what would be able to pass said test? 1/3? Even if it is 1/2, then we all would be crying out for just getting a dual at a game, let alone 3!

 

Reffing is truly a thankless job, and my hats off to them. For the most part, we have had very good refs as a whole, in my years coaching at CAK. I would never want to do it (and I have tried in the past, and hated it). It would be GREAT to get "new blood" into the reffing realm, and I am sure the refs that are there would love the help. Don't know how to do that.

 

It would also be good to have the head ref assignor frequently critique the refs at their games. I know in Knoxville they do so. I have no idea about the outcome of those critiques, but I appreciate them doing so.

 

We do have 2-3 really good young refs here in Knoxville, and some of our great ones have just recently retired (which is a shame). I would love for those older refs to mentor the younger ones, or the ones still doing it, and make them into the great officials that they are.

[Canesoverhere]

Whoa...Whoa WHoa.

 

I asked a question, no bait attached.

 

Has something changed with the ruling on slide tackle and high school soccer?

[Bean0007]

Big G, is a surgical scar required to be a serious injury? That's absurd

! There are many significant injuries that don't require surgery. Surely you don't subscribe to the 'no blood, no foul' theme. I would bet that a majority of the HS girls don't play club soccer, therefore, they have no other oppurtunities for quality coaching, and many don't get that in HS. I would also bet that there are many more improper tackles than proper. Do you really think the game would be changed that much? Afraid someone might score a goal against CAK and the margin of victory would change that much? In HS baseball, a runner cannot plow into the catcher......it's an automatic out. Same at 2nd on a DP. Overslide the base, same thing, automatic out at 1st on the DP. Does it severly handicap the game....no, but it may save a potential serious injury and that is exactly why slide tackles should be eliminated in HS soccer.

[Bean0007]

and furthermore evidently we cannot train a few referees to judge proper slide tackles and we expect to properly train 100's of players and hope that they execute them properly? It's HS soccer, not the world championship. How much generally poor soccer do we see anyway? There are plenty of other basic techniques that need to be taught before slide tackling. It's not a big deal to me, my daughter graduates this year, but I'll still see the games and various injuries and hopefully they won't be serious and leave a scar.

[BigG]

Afraid someone might score a goal against CAK and the margin of victory would change that much?

Why be rude? I haven't said anything personal to you. My opinion was that I think slide tackles have a place in the game. Never said anything about blood or fouls, or score margins. I said that done properly, they are a useful tool.

 

There are a lot of things that cause injuries in soccer, and I think that some could be prevented, while others wouldn't no matter what the rules. It is a contact sport. Am I happy when injuries occur? Absolutely not.

 

If you feel otherwise or think I care more about the score margin than I do about my players or those that play against me, you don't know me in the least.

 

Perhaps I am in the minority. But I can tell you that some feel quite passionate about this topic. And I for one, am bowing out of the conversation.

[Bean0007]

Am I the only one that think that this is uncalled for? Slide tackles are a part of the game, that, when done correctly, are a very affective defensive "tool". To outlaw them, because they are being performed incorrectly is absurd.

 

G...you're the one that thought the idea 'absurd'..rather a strong disagreement, and nothing wrong with being passionate about it. And I did take your comment about surgical scarring to be sarcastic, as in no blood, no foul........a terrible concept all too frequently thrown around by some parents and coaches. There is plenty of physical play, that all too often seems to be substituted for skilled play in HS. In fact it seems to become more prevelent now, and starts in middle school to some degree. Playing hard does not always mean being physical. It is a tough game, and unfortunately, some refs allow a lot more than others. Not trying to pick on the refs, but I think that is the best place to put the emphasis for more consistent and safer play within the rules, physical or not.

[KeeperFan15]

Gotta agree with G on this one. A good question no doubt, but we get on here and complain all the time that TSSAA is "muddying" the sport by adding rules and changing things. This is not much different IMO.

 

Yes it can be dangerous. So can an improperly executed header, skull to skull contact on 50/50 balls, or a keeper going out head first. If we are intent on changing the rules to protect the players, let's require head protection. Sadly, there are more in memorium plaques on soccer fields for head injuries than badly executed slide tackles.

 

With regard to the original question, I haven't been able to find any memos on focused inforcement from the ref associations. Doesn't mean that it is not a point of emphasis, just haven't found it. All in all, I haven't seen much change in the quality officiating over the past 8 years.

 

Most of the coaches that I have observed over those 8 years spend rainy day practice time on slide tackles and the proper execution several times a season.