Is fouling becoming a problem? Intending to hurt or punish kids

[ThrillaNvanilla]

Thoughts from anyone

[Hooper101]

Thoughts from anyone

 

 

Its a physical game. When you come in the paint you should know about it. Although there is a difference between a hard foul and an out of foul that is intentional

[ksgovols]

Fouling wasn't a problem at all in the game I watched last night. Both teams fouled at will.

 

My opinion is that the referees need to establish how much physical contact they are going to live with and call the game accordingly. There were plenty of no calls last night that didn't particularly bother me on contact in the paint, but then they would call a hand check out on the floor. To be fair, when teams make long cross court passes, set up for charges and one team has a size advantage over the other, the little guys have to do something to level the playing field. This loosely called game eventually almost came to blows and in fact a player left the bench and was ejected. You could see it coming. The physical play was getting his fire going.

 

What I really saw was a lot of flopping on charges and hand checking up and down the court without anybody really getting into foul trouble. I thought both teams could have been in the double bonus by the 2nd period and they had 3 apiece.

[Old Warhorse]

Fouling wasn't a problem at all in the game I watched last night. Both teams fouled at will.

 

My opinion is that the referees need to establish how much physical contact they are going to live with and call the game accordingly. There were plenty of no calls last night that didn't particularly bother me on contact in the paint, but then they would call a hand check out on the floor. To be fair, when teams make long cross court passes, set up for charges and one team has a size advantage over the other, the little guys have to do something to level the playing field. This loosely called game eventually almost came to blows and in fact a player left the bench and was ejected. You could see it coming. The physical play was getting his fire going.

 

What I really saw was a lot of flopping on charges and hand checking up and down the court without anybody really getting into foul trouble. I thought both teams could have been in the double bonus by the 2nd period and they had 3 apiece.

Who were the teams involved?

[bbgocats]

Who were the teams involved?

 

 

The game that KS is referring to was Harpeth and Montgomery Central. I agree, there needs to be an establishment of what is acceptable and what is not going to be tolerated. All three officials need to be on the same page. One stripe last night had no idea what a charge looked like. He really needed to read the rule again... the other official would no-call other blocks or charges and #3 would call a charge on a flop.

 

Typically games that escalate to a heated level are a result of a game that is not being called consistent. If you're going to call it... call it both ways!

 

Same official ejected a parent in the 1st period of the girls game last night. Honestly, the guy didn't like being called out on his inability to correctly call the game. Not standing up for the parent... he was loud, but he didn't get that bad that would warrant ejection from the gym. That, coupled with the continued inconsistent calls and the night became very heated between to District opponents. It could have been pretty bad.

 

You have to call the game the same in the 1st period that you do in the 4th period. If you're making adjustments late in the game then most likely you're not calling it correctly out of the gate. Keep in clean... keep it consistent and things will go just fine.

[ksgovols]

Yeah, if an official is having trouble with the charge/block call to begin with, there's going to be some flopping and good acting jobs. On the other hand, some of them would have be legitimate without the acting. When it looks like bowling pins every time the big man gets the ball, well.....

 

On the other hand, it was really bad officiating both ways. Some of it may have had to do with style of play or size differential. I don't think either coach or either side of the gym was all that happy with the stripes they had that night. And supposedly an evaluator was there. He got an eyeful if he was.

[sportsman20]

Yeah, if an official is having trouble with the charge/block call to begin with, there's going to be some flopping and good acting jobs. On the other hand, some of them would have be legitimate without the acting. When it looks like bowling pins every time the big man gets the ball, well.....

 

On the other hand, it was really bad officiating both ways. Some of it may have had to do with style of play or size differential. I don't think either coach or either side of the gym was all that happy with the stripes they had that night. And supposedly an evaluator was there. He got an eyeful if he was.

The issue comes to the fact the tssaa officials answer to no one. Even when coaches, administrators and fans contact them about an official nothing is done. These guys now earn 85 bucks for about 3 hours work. The tssaa doesnt pay that fee. Its time for officials to be held responsible for bad games.

[ksgovols]

I agree. One thin skinned official tossed a fan 4 minutes into the girl's game. If you stink at officiating, you're going to have to toss a bunch of fans. When I umpired, we were taught that it wasn't in our job description to toss fans. It's a tough job, but you're getting paid to do it. Do it to the best of your ability.

[blankguy]

Here is the major problem that spectators, coaches, and players have to understand this year and even the next couple of years. *(Disclaimer- I'm not going to tell you to go become an official or if you don't like it then do something about it)* The problem is that, especially in the the middle Tennessee area, a lot of the veteran officials have either retired, moved on to college, or even went back are only working middle school games. Therefore, you have a lot of new officials that don't have the experience yet to manage consistently varsity level games. They will get there eventually with working more games. However, you also have to remember how many high schools are playing on a Tuesday and Friday night. One week I saw atleast 75 games being played on a Tuesday nigh, that is 225 officials. Coaches only rate 50 officials and those are typically rated at every school. So the chances of getting 3 experienced veterans to work you game on one of those nights is slim to none and therefore you have to have more patience this year and for a few years to come.

[ksgovols]

I can see that. Rule #1. If you're officiating, get some thicker skin. If you're tossing spectators that tell you a call stinks, you're in it for the wrong reasons. I umpired for quite a few years and I never tossed a kid (though my partner did once). You have to be smart enough to know when a coach is working you, when a kid is just emotional about the game and not take things personal. Smile and call your game. It is not rocket science. You're going to miss some calls. At least have some snappy comebacks. I told a mother harassing me from the stands that I enjoyed a good debate about the rules of the game as much as anyone. Learn them and get back to me.

[bbgocats]

I can see that. Rule #1. If you're officiating, get some thicker skin. If you're tossing spectators that tell you a call stinks, you're in it for the wrong reasons. I umpired for quite a few years and I never tossed a kid (though my partner did once). You have to be smart enough to know when a coach is working you, when a kid is just emotional about the game and not take things personal. Smile and call your game. It is not rocket science. You're going to miss some calls. At least have some snappy comebacks. I told a mother harassing me from the stands that I enjoyed a good debate about the rules of the game as much as anyone. Learn them and get back to me.

 

 

Yeah... I remember that game...