TSSAA Proposals.....

[deadlift]

We don't really know what the definition of a "coach" is here. Would club and middle school coaches that feed predominantly one high school program be included in the "coaches link"? Does TMSAA=TSSAA? We just do not know these answers yet.

[durdon]

They are not saying that kids from outside the school can't use the facilities. They are just saying the kids can't then transfer if there is a "coaching link" without penalty. It appears there is even a loophole between 8th and 9th grade for transfers and moves to happen even with a coaches link. You will still have transfers with this rule but it's going to force more to happen between 8th and 9th grade. Here's the complete rule again, but the loophole for MS/youth kids is the last part.

Deadlift, I was speaking directly to your question would the coaching link apply to club coaches who aren't TSSAA coaches specifically and it doesn't.

 

As far as saying there is a loophole for 8th and 9th grade years that not a good way to term that either. The coaching link rule ONLY APPLIES to kids who have participated in High school sports period.

Middle schoolers are just little kids who along with their parents have zero interest or idea what the high school eligibility rules and regulations are so it would be hard to put rules into place that would effect them. Once the student athetete begins high school sports then they and their parents have athletic directors and TSSAA certified coaches that can advise them on all rules not just eligibility rules.

[deadlift]

Parents of some middle schoolers are going to have to figure out these rules because some kids will already have an athletic record in the 7th grade. "Loophole" probably wasn't the best term for me to use earlier. That time between 8th and 9th grade is when most everyone already changes schools.

Edited September 5, 2015 by deadlift

[deadlift]

But a definition of the word "coach" is still not defined for us. Until it is then I guess assumptions can be made. Assumptions now can cause a kid to miss a whole year of practice and competition.

[durdon]

Deadlift,

 

I'm pretty sure that 7th graders are not allowed to participate in HS sports, only 8th graders at schools that have a middle school on the small property that are under the same principle. So only a very small number of 8th graders each year will have an atheltic record.

 

As far as defining a coach, the TSAAA rules are very SPECIFIC what a coach is and their requirements they have to meet to coach high school sports.

 

It's Not in that section but elsewhere in the rule book,

 

"Coaches will fall into one of four categories: full-time certified teacher, retired educator, non-faculty coach and classified employee.

All coaches must be approved by the principal, schools director or school board. All coaches must go through the proper TSSAA training. But the new rule does not set limits as to how many coaches can be used.

All classified employees or non-faculty coaches must continue to have five years of experience as a coach at a TSSAA or TMSAA school to serve as a head coach in baseball, basketball, football, softball and track."

Edited September 5, 2015 by durdon

[deadlift]

This rule would not only cover upcoming 9th graders from TN middle schools. Out of state kids moving to TN with a "coaching link" would be affected too. Some states allow kids to play varsity HS sports in 7th grade. Kentucky is one of those states that allows 7th graders to play HS sports at all schools.

But this particular rule seems to want to curb transfers by kids who have already played HS sports. Including club coaches would definitely have that curbing affect. Including club coaches in that definition might actually increase the numbers of kids participating in off season clubs taking place at another school. I believe most HS coaches would be more willing to recommend their kids to freestyle/greco and other offseason clubs at other schools if they didn't have to worry about recruiting.

[durdon]

I didn't think about kids from other states but that a real one off.

 

You can't include club coaches because the vast majority of club coaches don't have any affiliation with any HS. If you look at basketball and volleyball those club teams will practice at multiple HS all over their local area whenever they can get local gym space so how would you decide which HS to link that club team to. Even in wrestling the vast majority of our club programs are area clubs that pull HS kids from multiple HS and send youth kids to multple HS. There is one club wrestling team in my area that practices at 3 HS cause they can get only get mat space certain nights at certain HS.

 

If you do extended the rule to include clubs then all of the clubs will quickly be banned from using HS facilities. Let's say HS A is the host club for the local area wrestling club and then HS B has a lot of wrestlers that practice at that club, then a lot of the kids decide hey let's all go to same HS because it be fun and team would be great. Guess what they would all end up transferring to HS B because they would have to sit out of practice for a year at HS A. HS A isn't going to allow other schools to be able to recruit their kids so they are quickly going to ban all clubs. Luckily, the TSSAA already realized this fact and didn't try to extend this rule to the clubs and club coaches.

 

One area where I think you are wrong on is our summer wrestling travel teams. This rule isn't going to enhance our summer travel teams, it is going to hurt them dramatically because we are going to lose all of our HS coaches from being associated with them. HS coaches are not going to coach our travel teams anymore when other programs can send kids to those teams and encourage them to try to get that HS coaches kids to transfer to their programs. It puts them at a huge competitive disadvantage.

Edited September 6, 2015 by durdon

[deadlift]

I didn't think about kids from other states but that a real one off.

 

You can't include club coaches because the vast majority of club coaches don't have any affiliation with any HS. If you look at basketball and volleyball those club teams will practice at multiple HS all over their local area whenever they can get local gym space so how would you decide which HS to link that club team to. Even in wrestling the vast majority of our club programs are area clubs that pull HS kids from multiple HS and send youth kids to multple HS. There is one club wrestling team in my area that practices at 3 HS cause they can get only get mat space certain nights at certain HS.

Link them all. The idea of the rule is to curb transfers of HS athletes.

[deadlift]

If you do extended the rule to include clubs then all of the clubs will quickly be banned from using HS facilities. Let's say HS A is the host club for the local area wrestling club and then HS B has a lot of wrestlers that practice at that club, then a lot of the kids decide hey let's all go to same HS because it be fun and team would be great. Guess what they would all end up transferring to HS B because they would have to sit out of practice for a year at HS A. HS A isn't going to allow other schools to be able to recruit their kids so they are quickly going to ban all clubs. Luckily, the TSSAA already realized this fact and didn't try to extend this rule to the clubs and club coaches.

All these HS athletes would be ineligible for a year even without a coaching link. You still can't just transfer to a new school because you all want to be together.

Edited September 7, 2015 by deadlift

[deadlift]

One area where I think you are wrong on is our summer wrestling travel teams. This rule isn't going to enhance our summer travel teams, it is going to hurt them dramatically because we are going to lose all of our HS coaches from being associated with them. HS coaches are not going to coach our travel teams anymore when other programs can send kids to those teams and encourage them to try to get that HS coaches kids to transfer to their programs. It puts them at a huge competitive disadvantage.

Interesting reason why you believe HS coaches wouldn't want to coach offseason teams anymore. Could also be that those coaches would lose a transfer advantage themselves.

[durdon]

there is a huge huge difference between transferring and being able to practice and play JV sports and transferring and not being able to practice your sport for a full year. This will keep kids from transferring to schools with a coaching link.

 

Schools and coaches aren't going to let other schools get there transfers when they can't get any if their coaches are involved in club sports and travel teams.

[durdon]

Sorry I posted right as you did.. But yes, teams will lose a transfer advantage so they will quickly pull their HS coaches out of travel and club teams.

 

This new rule really won't effect football and basketball which are the 2 sports that this rule was designed to impact but it a killer for wrestling where we need those HS coaches to sustain our club system and travel teams. In football and basketball there are a multitude of qualified coaches who are not affiliated with any school who are ready and willing to coach club teams so those sports can quickly have a complete separation of HS and the club teams without a drop in quality.