oceansize42

33 minutes ago, ArtusCimber said:

It appears you have your years muddled. Science Hill beat D-B twice in 2021, both in the conference dual and the region dual finals, explaining why they got Collierville instead of Cleveland. See, D-B was in second place. The 49-24 was in 2022. Science Hill didn't even go in 2022. There is a more complex explanation for why Bradley drew Wilson Central but I'm not sure I could explain it to you. I just mostly hope you haven't been upset over this for too long. Regardless, I think the draw they have this year atones most generously for any other perceived injustice they've been done regarding other years.

I’m not upset about this at all as I’m not affiliated with DB in any way and never have been.   Regardless of the complex explanation those matchups shouldn’t have happened.  

I also remember when the worst case of flu ever hit Science Hill and they couldn't show up for a dual against DB because the entire team (except for one guy) was disabled. LoL.  Nothing to do with all of this, just something that popped into my head when thinking about DB vs SH.

1 minute ago, CHSBLUE said:

Where are you guys seeing the bracket.  I went to TSSAA and don't see it.

Brackets

Reminds of 2021 when DB, who killed Science Hill 49-24 at regionals, then draws Cleveland in round one. Science Hill gets Collierville.  Yeah, that happened.  To top it off Bradley got Wilson Central in round one.

9 hours ago, TotallynotLEO said:

Buddy called me with the results.

AC got by Crockett 36-33. Some line up changes but nothing that matters in the end.  

That’s twice in the last three years mere points have kept them from going. The good news is they should be right back in the mix again next year.   

The problem is the hypocrisy.  Wrestlers, coaches, and parents of wrestlers like to think of themselves as "different". "Built different" as they frequently and loudly proclaim. This just shows you, your sport, your team, and the parents around it aren't different.  You are just like everyone else in every other team sport.  Might get whipped? Don't wrestle.  Might get injured then we don't wanna wrestle.  Smells like every other sport to me. 

15 minutes ago, cowcatcherII said:

Crockett and Pigeon Forge should both beat Signal after what I saw last night. Those are probably the most likely candidates to meet Soddy in the finals next weekend. 

Crockett has to get by Anderson County. I'm pulling for Crockett but that matchup is actually tough.  Anderson beat them earlier this year (39-33) and gave up a FF at 132 while doing so.  See if lineups change or what modifications are made...

This whole thread is like toddlers running around singing I know you are but what am I.  Jesus.... 

14 minutes ago, FR615 said:

Score?

Dual Match Scores here.

I do not care that it happened but in the land of incoming transfers no public school can top Greeneville.  Actually it was freaking incredible.

1. Hunter Mason (Flo Ranked) now at VT
2. Kodiak Cannedy (Flo Ranked) now at Little Rock
3. Carson Dupill (Flo Ranked) Still in HS
4. Colin Dupill (Flo Ranked) now at SDSU

Good luck beating that group. 

Cooper Hilton by a landslide. I realize he isn't competing at a high school this year but he is the current best P4P wrestler in TN.  Second I'd go JoJo with the acknowledgement that JoJo an Mason might split matches 50/50 if they wrestled ten times.

1 hour ago, cowcatcherII said:

I think that's the main difference with how people view Cleveland v. Baylor or even McCallie for that matter. 

Baylor and McCallie fans aren't trying to tell anyone they're great because they work harder than everyone. Unless I have missed something I haven't seen any Baylor or McCallie folks try to tell you they don't have built in advantages being a boarding school and having the ability to pluck talent from other schools every year. 

I would be interested to hear @durdon 's , @oceansize42 's, and @cbg's thoughts on all this.

I'll give some of my background which will probably explain my point-of-view.

My nephew attends McCallie.  What they have as a school have is phenomenal (I'm sure Baylor is awesome too).  I'm impressed, however, I think I'm too pragmatic for most to take seriously with regards to sports and high school.  Not being a great athlete myself and not being a rah rah guy I view sports as a means to an end.  My kids had fun, truly they did.  I would give most anything to relive the vast majority of it. They went to a county school and a decidedly mediocre one at that.  Could they have had more fun at a private school like McCallie? No. My kids most likely wouldn't have started.  Don't get me wrong they were great in my eyes but facts is facts.  My son was a solid team wrestler, trained hard, and worked hard. Understood his role.  My daughter was a solid athlete, same goes for her. Trained hard, worked hard.  I then think what more could they have gotten out of it if they had went further or been on a team that was super good? The answer is nothing.  They made friends, discovered the value of work, had some realizations about themselves, and then that was it. 

I can imagine the immense sense of satisfaction that must come with winning and competing at those big tournaments and meaningful duals, but that is all I can do.  We weren't there. I think its important for all to remember those are what they are, moments.  Nobody cares within a few short years other than the coaches who work their tail off to make sure each new group is prepared to repeat those same feats.  More power to them, I love their dedication.

With my background out of the way, I think kids should go where they want without restriction. I think schools should be able to recruit, both public and private. Why?  Because there is only so many really good kids, particularly in wrestling, to go around.  The vast vast majority of parents don't care because we are having fun watching our kids.  Does it suck to get whooped by a far superior team who has either worked harder than you or simply recruited? Yes, lol, yes it does. Been there, but I understood the bigger picture.  My kid's teams, and therefore me as well, have received some whoopings.  So to the point @cowcatcherII made about McCallie not talking there is definitely some truth.  However, Cleveland can't control dumb parents, they just can't (and you all are dumb, really really dumb).  I've got no problem with a program tooting it's own horn either.  Having money (whatever that means) is great but you still have to practice hard and practice right. They obviously do that. Kudos.

I've said this before but everyone really should understand this. Most parents don't sit around discussing Cleveland, McCallie, and Baylor.  We just don't. I promise you this topic never came up between parents. We went to the duals and for the most part loved being there win or lose. There is a bubble that some are in where all this matters, like really matters. It doesn't matter.  Parents, with any brains, know what's up when you wrestle a handful of these power house public/private schools.  I get that it is very easy to get caught up in "winning", I get it, but man it's just moments in time. For the current mediocre wrestlers out there who might read this, remember, where you went to school and how good a wrestler you were (or weren't) means nothing in life, absolutely nothing.  If you personally worked hard and were a student of the game then you received everything you ever needed.

It doesn't matter whether they do or don't (I have no idea). Real life kicks in after sports have ended and then the rubber meets the road.  Success in sports, contrary to what many believe, doesn't correlate to success in life. I was a tall skinny nerd (still am) and so were my friends way back when. Within my circle of friends (and my brother) we are to the man financially successful, zero divorces, raised productive children, and do/did so with a high quality of life.  Sports teach some lessons very quickly and harshly. Hopefully the kids gain some friends that are long lasting, but believe it or not all of that is attainable outside sports.  None of my friends or family were athletes, not even close.

I love wrestling, best thing my son ever did. Gosh I loved it, but it was for him and not me (as stated I was terrible in sports, anything he accomplished was more than I did). I'm immensely grateful but sports mean nothing beyond the age of 25.  I was going to write 22 or 23 but then I remembered how things are...

I see Seymour beat Gibbs 46-22.  Region two will certainly be interesting to watch.  Spells trouble for Region 1 teams.   I hadn’t looked at Seymour until you mentioned them. 

3 hours ago, TotallynotLEO said:

 

Hard to tell much about Pigeon Forge.  They brought a few varsity but I think they had 7 or 8 starters up at the Fandetti individual tournament.  I think if they bring full varsity,  they might have beat DB. I think they're that good.  Foreman was with them,  I bet he was getting a look at AC and Crockett.  

 

Interesting about PF, I was wondering where they were heading with some of the lineups I've seen.  Sounds like PF and Anderson might be the favorites out of region 1 since Anderson beat DC and did so giving up a FF at 132.

11 minutes ago, WrestlingGod said:

If they weren’t capable of succeeding at the next level they wouldn’t be being recruited.

 

With all due respect, I’ll take the judgment of an ncaa div1 coach over your skepticism. 

I think you are misinterpreting my statements. They deserved to be signed.  The next steps, i.e cracking the lineup and winning more than you lose, are infinitely harder. 

6 hours ago, WrestlingGod said:

Tennessee as a wrestling state IS growing. Regardless of what the trolls on here would have one believe. And while you're correct, high school success doesn't mean a whole lot in the grand scheme, I think what you fail to mention is IN STATE high school success doesn't exactly measure long term division 1 success. I don't remember the last time TN had 7 or 8 kids ranked in the country. I don't remember the last time we had MULTIPLE medalists at Powerade, Beast of the East, Brecksville etc and the other tournaments that have tradiationally been reserved for the St Paris Grahams, Blair, Clovis, Wyoming Sem, St Eds, level teams. The fact that our kids are starting to medal at these semi regularly now I think is a great indicator of where we are headed as a state and a good measuring stick as to what this current group of kids are capable of doing at the highest levels. 

 

I think to tell these kids who not only have dreams of going D1 but have already signed commitment letters (Fowler, Desselle, Hilton, Hart, Little etc) that "Sorry, despite this universtiy telling you they want you on their team and they value what you can bring to the program, you're better served going D2 or D3 or NAIA". Isn't just doing them a disservice its doing Tennessee Wrestling a disservice as well. We should be promoting these kids getting out to major programs. Not discouraging it. 

I'm saying chase it but be aware all is not what it seems.  Parents and sometimes coaches have a slightly unrealistic view concerning what it really takes to be successful, and sustain that success, at D1.   It is a lot of hard work to get signed but it is incredibly difficult to do more than just be on the team within D1 and we all know it.   That is a negative statement. No doubt everything I said is negative with respect to most young men's ability to "make it" once signed, but I stand by it. I've watched the D1 ranks and it isn't pretty.  You are wrong however about my statement concerning lesser college divisions, that isn't a put down, that is what most should do.

If the clock on the live stream was in sync with the real clock then Father Ryan's 157 just got robbed big time. The take down was seconds after the period expired.  Wow, but I can only assume the two are not in sync.   

Edit: The announcer said the buzzer is the official time which is "automatic".  I guess that is the case.

Keep in mind only two young men in the last five to seven years have had any sustained success at the D1 level. Brayden Palmer and Cody Chittum (granted one season but he is definitely the real deal). Trae McDaniel was just hitting his full stride when he got injured.  Hunter Mason appears to be on the path to success.  Mason Reiniche at Oregon seems to be having himself a pretty good year as well.   I think Jackson Hurst might be the starter at 157 for UTC (well done Jackson).  

What I've learned is that High School success means absolutely nothing, other than a door may open.  I think the vast majority, almost all to be honest, TN wrestlers would be better served going D2, D3, or NAIA if wrestling is something that is really important to them.    If the goal is simply to be on the team while getting a good education then that's fine but success within wrestling in D1, as I would define it, is very rare.  The next logical question is what defines success.  For me, if a wrestler can crack the lineup and start plus have a five hundred or better record then they made it.  

I'm not going to reel off the long list of names of current TN college wrestlers who currently have a very small chance of cracking their starting lineup as things stand, have sub five hundred records, quit before they ever got started (maybe injured), or don't ever seem to get the opportunity to wrestle.

As far as who I think might make an impact at the next level, have sustained success, and actually wrestle more than a handful of times per year on a D1 college team, hmmm, none. I'll believe it when I see it because D1 college wrestling is INSANELY TOUGH.   I hope that statement fuels some kids (and not their parents) to prove doubters like me wrong.  What I've seen in college wrestling is simply ridiculous.  Excellence at the highest level. 

At levels below D1 I think many could be quite successful. 

Crockett over Greeneville tonight by a score of 58-14

Crockett is in far better position than I thought in preseason. Greeneville appears worse than I even suspected, which I didn't think was possible. Gibbs and PF don't seem (at this time) to have complete rosters.   If this really is what each team has then the bottom has truly fallen out for PF, Gibbs, and Greeneville.

10 hours ago, FargoStrut said:

Villars wrestled a very good, even if it wasnt long, match. He just got caught by an ELITE wrestler. He didnt back down for a second! I think Villars finishes that takedown on all but 2 kids (both have the last name Raney) in the building, one being a 4X Fargo Champ and the other being a U17 WORLD CHAMP! He just happened to be wrestling the U17 World Champ. Way to come out and wrestle hard Dylan, regardless of who the opponent was!

That chin whip Raney hit was crazy good.  Villers was in how he should have been and you're right, anyone else and Villers is getting points.  Villers definitely attacked.

I don't know the family and I doubt many here do, but none of us have to.  We all understand the depth of despair this brings that immediate and extended family as we all are involved parents, coaches, and admirers of these young athletes.  Man I hate this with every fiber of my being.  I only hope nobody else played any role in what happened.

Picture of the young man on twitter.

Mason wrestled the same kid (Seidel from PA) in the semis that he just wrestled in the finals at the Dobyns Bennett Indian Classic.  Funny how stuff like that seems to happen. He lost both but improved greatly at beast of the east against him. Kid is a VT commit.

54 minutes ago, fooseball95 said:

Trae is done for the year 

Man that really really stinks. He was doing so well.