Father Ryan

[MHubbuch]

Define "recruit" please.

 

 

If you do not know what Recruit means I will not help you

[itzme]

recruit: to enroll somebody as a worker or member, or to take on people as workers or members.

 

A perfectly legal activity according to the TSSAA handbook, by the way. The TSSAA "recruiting rule" one may not use "undue influence" to attract new players. Leaves it a bit open to interpretation and uneven enforcement, don't you think?

 

The real question is what constitutes "undue influence"?

[Baldcoach]

recruit: to enroll somebody as a worker or member, or to take on people as workers or members.

 

A perfectly legal activity according to the TSSAA handbook, by the way. The TSSAA "recruiting rule" one may not use "undue influence" to attract new players. Leaves it a bit open to interpretation and uneven enforcement, don't you think?

 

The real question is what constitutes "undue influence"?

 

I believe the current working definition is any approach by a staff member to a potential athlete when the athlete or his/her family has not shown interest in the school. Interest is any action that is undertaken by the athlete or family to obtain information about admission from the school.

 

Dunno if that is official, but that is what the TSSAA communicates to us here in the 'nooga. Of course, it is REALLY vague. And worse, it is unenforceable. Thus the reason for all the controversy.

[Baldcoach]

Sure. Like at any Private School, You recruit. one of the best Schools at it today is Brentwood Academy and MBA. They have the facilities and they have the prestige. Something Ryan had for 30 years or more.

 

Tell ya what, there are 100 or so privates in Tennessee, list someone you know at all of them and then we can talk...heck, for that matter, without going to a website just list all the privates. Can't? Then how could you know that "Like any Private School, You recruit"?

 

Quit insulting good people all over the state. It gets tiresome, and it is just bad manners. Call your mamma, she'll tell ya.

[itzme]

I believe the current working definition is any approach by a staff member to a potential athlete when the athlete or his/her family has not shown interest in the school. Interest is any action that is undertaken by the athlete or family to obtain information about admission from the school.

 

Dunno if that is official, but that is what the TSSAA communicates to us here in the 'nooga. Of course, it is REALLY vague. And worse, it is unenforceable. Thus the reason for all the controversy.

It actually gives several examples in the TSSAA handbook. I do think it's important for the general public on this board to understand (as you do) the distinction between "recruiting" and "undue influence" and how murky that gets.

 

For example, here in the midstate, I have seen MBA commercials on TV and heard BGA commercials on sports-talk radio soliciting for applications. I remember some years ago when my son was playing pee-wee football seeing an MBA ad (signed by Ricky Bowers) in the league program, touting their football success. All of this is perfectly within the rules.

 

In the now infamous BA case, it was (primarily) about sending a letter to kids who had already signed enrollment contracts, yet TSSAA considered it undue influence. Hard for schools to figure out what crosses the line.

Edited October 15, 2005 by itzme

[Indian]

It's not hard to figure out what's ethical, or not. Middle school games shouldn't be recruiting grounds. For years on this board, we've been told students are accepted at private schools because of academics only, and if they happen to be good athletes, or have potential for size, that's just an extra. Have we been misled?

[Indian]

It actually gives several examples in the TSSAA handbook. I do think it's important for the general public on this board to understand (as you do) the distinction between "recruiting" and "undue influence" and how murky that gets.

 

For example, here in the midstate, I have seen MBA commercials on TV and heard BGA commercials on sports-talk radio soliciting for applications. I remember some years ago when my son was playing pee-wee football seeing an MBA ad (signed by Ricky Bowers) in the league program, touting their football success. All of this is perfectly within the rules.

 

In the now infamous BA case, it was (primarily) about sending a letter to kids who had already signed enrollment contracts, yet TSSAA considered it undue influence. Hard for schools to figure out what crosses the line.

 

 

The schools can ask what's acceptable, before acting upon it. I'm certain McCallie didn't ask before sending wrestlers to Georgia high schools to get more experience, that was a big concern here, or having roughly 40 football players on aid when the formula allowed for about a quarter of that.

[itzme]

It's not hard to figure out what's ethical, or not. Middle school games shouldn't be recruiting grounds. For years on this board, we've been told students are accepted at private schools because of academics only, and if they happen to be good athletes, or have potential for size, that's just an extra. Have we been misled?

I would say if you have heard that, you have been misled, yes. Students are accepted based on a variety of factors, depending on the school. At most schools (not all neccessarily) academic potential is a prerequisite, but other abilities such as music, debate/speech, art and yes, athletics are also considered.

[Indian]

The last sentence was sarcasm, but yes it has been said on here many times, "the private schools don't look for athletes, the athletes look for the private schools," in one form of phrasing or another.

[big red big blue]

jmo, but the point here is that FRHS needs to re-sell itself to its natural constituency: kids playing in the parochial leagues. I know that folks at Ryan get upset when talented catholic kids (academically and/or athletically) choose to go to MBA, BA, etc...The "recruiting" effort he's talking about is convincing catholic families that they can have the catholic experience without missing much in the way of academics, and/or athletics at FRHS...

 

as for "recruiting" vs. "undue influence," what does it all mean, now that the USSC has ruled that the TSSAA is in fact a state agent and cannot impose rules that restrict free speech? Do we have to follow any rules at all? The NCAA's rules are based on voluntary membership in an intercollegiate athletics association (what we thought the TSSAA was). By my accounts, any restraint the private schools exercise is simply by choice. No recruiting rules can hold up to 1st amendment scrutiny. Esp. things like the hypothetical coach going to a pee wee game and talking to parents. Probably even buying a new car for a 6th grade prospect would be "legal." the rule was "undue influence" with the BA case, and it still is "undue influence." How have things changed, if at all?

[Indian]

How about being ethical, and just not recruiting? Would that be difficult, with or without supervision or rules on it?

[std]

How about being ethical, and just not recruiting? Would that be difficult, with or without supervision or rules on it?

 

I do not think that recruiting is the issue at all because it is not generic to the just the private schools. Recruiting occurs in public as well as private, possibly more so for athletics. Privates have to recruit a full student body just to stay in business, publics don't recruit spelling bee champions.