Rules Question

[o21putt]

Here is a question for all of you rules experts. What can the holder on PAT's do once his knee is down? Can he get up and run or throw? I know he can get up and catch the football and then return to his holding position. Can he then get up and run after coming back down? Lets see some discussion or someone tell me the rule as it applys to the high school game.

[o21putt]

No one knows the answer or is that no one cares?

[dpemberton]

The holder can have a knee on the ground if it is a routine PAT or FG. If the snap is high, the holder can raise up, thus lifting his knee off the ground and come back down, knee goes back on the ground for a kick, all is good.

 

Here is where it gets complicated. If you have a high snap and the holder raises up to get the ball, goes down to fake the kick and THEN get back up to run or pass, he is down and the try is no good.

 

I may be wrong on this. If there is a whitehat reading, please correct me. If a try or FG is a fake from the start, the holders knee can not be on the ground. This situtation is the only case where I am not sure.

[bigwes68]

NFHS 4-2-2: The ball becomes dead and the down is ended:

a. When a runner....allows any part of his person other than hand or foot to touch the ground.

EXCEPTION: The ball remains live, if, at the snap, a place-kick holder with his knee(s) on the ground and with a teammate in kicking position:

1. Catches or recovers the snap while his knee is on the ground and places the ball for a kick, or if he rises to advance, hand, kick or pass.

2. Rises and catches an errant snap and immediately returns his knee to the ground and places the ball for a kick or again rises to advance, hand, kick or pass.

NOTE: The ball becomes dead if the place-kick holder muffs the snap or fumbles and recovers after his knees have been off the ground, and he then touches the ground with other than hand or foot while in possession of the ball.

 

So -- the holder can have a knee on the ground. He can rise and catch a bad snap and put his knee back on the ground. After he catches the snap in either situation, he can then rise again and run, hand off, kick, or pass. He cannot, however, hand off or pass while his knee is still on the ground. If he does, the ball is then dead at that spot.

 

Even if it is a fake all the way, the knee can still be on the ground as long as they are in legal scrimmage-kick formation (holder/kicker at least 7 yards behind the line of scrimmage).

[Bighurt]

Well alrighty, I was wrong again.

[Eddie]

So you're saying the holder couldn't flip a Utah-pass forward to one of the wing blockers coming across the formation. I always thought that would be a heck of a fake -- if it's legal.

[o21putt]

The holder can flip the Utah pass to one of the wing blockers provided his knee is not on the ground when he passes the ball. He can either get up from the holding position or he can catch the ball without his knee on the ground and then throw it.