#1, D-I State Tourney Seeds beat or out.

[rigger101]

I don't remember a year that had this many #1 ranked kids beat this early in the State Tourney. I counted 6 beat and 3 going home.

 

Wow, this is what I love about D-I. You very seldom see this happen in D-II.

[JCHSblindrefson]

QUOTE(rigger101 @ Feb 15 2007 - 01:53 PM) 826373106[/snapback]

I don't remember a year that had this many #1 ranked kids beat this early in the State Tourney. I counted 6 beat and 3 going home.

 

Wow, this is what I love about D-I. You very seldom see this happen in D-II.

 

 

 

well its a good thing some1 likes it b/c three that lost in the round of 16 were my friends so it stinks

[TheGreatDevion]

QUOTE(JCHSblindrefson @ Feb 15 2007 - 12:57 PM) 826373113[/snapback]

well its a good thing some1 likes it b/c three that lost in the round of 16 were my friends so it stinks

 

 

 

 

Yeah dude, it really does stink. And those friends were ranked as well...the no double elimination thing kinda hurts the fact that people wrestle all season, and spend money to get there....just to get beat in the first round...

[JCHSblindrefson]

QUOTE(TheGreatDevion @ Feb 15 2007 - 02:05 PM) 826373132[/snapback]

Yeah dude, it really does stink. And those friends were ranked as well...the no double elimination thing kinda hurts the fact that people wrestle all season, and spend money to get there....just to get beat in the first round...

 

 

 

yeah it should be dbl elimination so the true skill will get the medals instead of lucky guys well most who medal are great wrestlers but some get kinda lucky that are just good wrestlers

[Tennessee Wrestling Magazine]

Yea, it's pretty ridiculous. And it's not just any old #1 seeds. Legitimate state championship contenders with impressive histories have lost early:

 

103-Noman (2nd in 06, 3rd in 05)

125-Meyers (3rd in 06, 4th in 05)

130-Johnson (champ in 05)--lost in first round

140-McCroskey (3rd in 06, 5th in 05)

171-Robbins (5th in 06)

275-Murray (3rd in 06)

 

I'm not so surprised that Johnson lost, but if you had asked me two years ago, I would be surprised at where he is now. It's got to be rare to win a state championship as a sophomore and not place the next two years, but that's what he's up against. I think his body just grew too fast for him to adjust to the higher weights. Hopefully, he will pick up a metal to redeem the loss.

[JCHSblindrefson]

QUOTE(Tennessee Wrestling Magazine @ Feb 15 2007 - 02:10 PM) 826373140[/snapback]

Yea, it's pretty ridiculous. And it's not just any old #1 seeds. Legitimate state championship contenders with impressive histories have lost early:

 

103-Noman (2nd in 06, 3rd in 05)

125-Meyers (3rd in 06, 4th in 05)

130-Johnson (champ in 05)--lost in first round

140-McCroskey (3rd in 06, 5th in 05)

171-Robbins (5th in 06)

275-Murray (3rd in 06)

 

I'm not so surprised that Johnson lost, but if you had asked me two years ago, I would be surprised at where he is now. It's got to be rare to win a state championship as a sophomore and not place the next two years, but that's what he's up against. I think his body just grew too fast for him to adjust to the higher weights. Hopefully, he will pick up a metal to redeem the loss.

 

 

 

all three of my friends were mentioned this tournament should be double elimination end of story

[best_of_the_west]

I agree. Technically, there is no perfect way to find the best 6 wrestlers in a group of 32. A round-robin tournament is the most accurate way to measure competition, but that's obviously not feasible for a state tournament. There are a number of good examples of how a medal-worthy kid can get robbed. Most are related to the lack of seeding, which should be addressed, in my opinion. For example, a 9th grader is ranked 4th in state at 103. The top-ranked kid is in his region, so he places 2nd at region. This kid now has to wrestle a region champ in the second round. Let's say he loses to the region champ who was ranked 2nd in state, but was also an unseeded freshman. That kid loses to the top-ranked kid in the quarters. Now the kid ranked 4th in the state is out of the tournament after losing one match to the #2 ranked kid in the state, and the #2 ranked kid is in the consolation bracket, because he got an unlucky draw. That seems confusing, but maybe some of you will get the idea. If you only placed 4, it would be less of a problem. When placing 6, it's much harder to avoid bracketing flukes. Too many kids that are seed-worthy don't get one, whether it's because they are freshmen, they came from out of state, they were injured for the previous year's tournament, etc. Also, many times, a kid gets an undeserved seed after winning at a lower weight class and bumping way up the next year. For example, Kent Johnson is seeded #1 at 130 due to his state championship two years ago at 103, but Matman doesn't have him ranked at 130. No doubt his championship was a great accomplishment, but it is less applicable when you move up 4 weight classes.

 

So I would make two proposals:

 

1. I would propose a seeding system for the top 8 or 16 kids in the state without throwing away the current system of arranging wrestlers according to region tournament results. This would be difficult to finalize, because many kids don't face each other very often. But if there were fair, coach-approved rankers in each of the 4 big cities (i.e., Hamm, CoachBray, etc.), that would cover most of the big tournaments and the area competition. There would be a seeding meeting similar to the ones held for the region tournament. If it came down to choosing between a few kids that hadn't wrestled before and didn't have much else to go on, names could be drawn from a hat. This wouldn't be perfect, but it's better than the current system that doesn't consider freshmen or kids that may have been hurt for the previous year's tournament. As it is, the brackets have too much room for "luck of the draw," or in some cases, lack thereof.

 

2. As has been proposed before, I think a double-elimination tournament would give medal-worthy wrestlers with unlucky seeding or an unlucky match a chance to medal. This would mean that there would be 16 more matches per weight class for D1. Wednesday, wrestling started at 4:00, so that would just be moved to 2:00 or noon. This would be hard to pull off, but as long as there is no consistent seeding system, there needs to be a way to more accurately move kids through the brackets and get as close as possible to the best 6 wrestlers. It's more fair than the current system.

[rigger101]

QUOTE(best_of_the_west @ Feb 15 2007 - 02:54 PM) 826373271[/snapback]

 

 

 

I've been at the hotel watching the history channel. I would rather be watching

D-I Wrestling. If TSSAA is going to have parents/kids miss work/school then I think most of us would rather have our hard working wrestlers get their chance in the sun!

There is a ton of wasted time at State.