Calling all rule gurus

[marcusy18]

First off this didn't change the course of the game and was not argued. It was MLK vs. Pearl Cohn with a final score of 17-1 (MLK). The umpires disagreed on the call but here goes:

 

Bases are loaded and it's a pop up to third base with 2 outs. The third baseman bobbles the ball in fair territory in the outfield. The runner on third scores and the runner on second is out due to the force from the third baseman getting to the bag with the ball before the runner does. The inning is over. The field umpire claimed that the run counted and the home plate umpire didn't agree because of the obvious force. The field umpire eventually conceded the run wouldn't count but he still made the argument that because of the error, the runner on third was given more time than the original play should have had and therefore scored. The run wasn't argued because of the obvious score difference.

 

I lean towards the run not counting because of the force but the umpire made an interesting point about the play being extended that I had to question. Is this a no brainer or does he have a point?

[riverdaleman]

First off this didn't change the course of the game and was not argued. It was MLK vs. Pearl Cohn with a final score of 17-1 (MLK). The umpires disagreed on the call but here goes:

 

Bases are loaded and it's a pop up to third base with 2 outs. The third baseman bobbles the ball in fair territory in the outfield. The runner on third scores and the runner on second is out due to the force from the third baseman getting to the bag with the ball before the runner does. The inning is over. The field umpire claimed that the run counted and the home plate umpire didn't agree because of the obvious force. The field umpire eventually conceded the run wouldn't count but he still made the argument that because of the error, the runner on third was given more time than the original play should have had and therefore scored. The run wasn't argued because of the obvious score difference.

 

I lean towards the run not counting because of the force but the umpire made an interesting point about the play being extended that I had to question. Is this a no brainer or does he have a point?

 

ok let me get the scenario str8...the 3rd baseman dropped the ball with bases loaded and 2 outs for some reason the runners did not run and before the runner on second touches third they throw him out for the 3rd out if this is the case of course the run doesnt count but if he touches third and going back to the bag he gets tagged then the run counts IF he has crossed the playe

now lets say there is 1 out and the ball is caught runner at third tags up and is legal the runner from second does not tag up they appeal but before the appeal is complete the run crosses the plate you have the third out on appeal BUT the run scores

[brookspw]

Run absolutely does not count.

[muffin]

If runner on third crosses plate before the force out occurs at third,then the run is counted,this is home plate umpires call as he should have been in position to see both bases.

[GCBSBLL9]

First off this didn't change the course of the game and was not argued. It was MLK vs. Pearl Cohn with a final score of 17-1 (MLK). The umpires disagreed on the call but here goes:

 

Bases are loaded and it's a pop up to third base with 2 outs. The third baseman bobbles the ball in fair territory in the outfield. The runner on third scores and the runner on second is out due to the force from the third baseman getting to the bag with the ball before the runner does. The inning is over. The field umpire claimed that the run counted and the home plate umpire didn't agree because of the obvious force. The field umpire eventually conceded the run wouldn't count but he still made the argument that because of the error, the runner on third was given more time than the original play should have had and therefore scored. The run wasn't argued because of the obvious score difference.

 

I lean towards the run not counting because of the force but the umpire made an interesting point about the play being extended that I had to question. Is this a no brainer or does he have a point?

 

The run does not count. It happened to us too except it was our leftfielder. It took 15 minutes to find the rule but the run did not count.

[riverdaleman]

If runner on third crosses plate before the force out occurs at third,then the run is counted,this is home plate umpires call as he should have been in position to see both bases.

 

no run counts on a force out no matter what...what puzzles me about this is if their is 2 outs why isnt he already on third espcially if the guy scored the guy at 2nd shohuld already be at third before they get a force out

[chuckm]

Run doesn't count. Same as if you got the out at first after the runner touched home. It's a force out, which doesn't change until the runner safely reaches the base they were forced to advance.

 

If runner on third crosses plate before the force out occurs at third,then the run is counted,this is home plate umpires call as he should have been in position to see both bases.

[davidlimbaugh]

Run doesn't count. Same as if you got the out at first after the runner touched home. It's a force out, which doesn't change until the runner safely reaches the base they were forced to advance.

 

 

chuckm - when I read muffin's comment I just figured he was fishing, like the good old days in rec.sports.football.college

 

What is fishing

 

http://www.rsfckers.com/faq.htm#fishing

 

you ask?

 

Q: What is fishing?

 

Fishing is an old, highly esteemed sport on RSFC, in which fishermen (usually RSFC regulars) post highly inflammatory or even incorrect statements (bait) in order to draw a lot of high-intensity flames, and/or scores of clueless newbies ready to "school" the poster. Fishermen are usually very wily, have few scruples to speak of, and would just as soon expose you as a foolish newbie as get up in the morning. In fact, many prefer it to getting up in the morning, and will play a victim with a zeal and determination otherwise reserved for BBQ.

 

 

I figured it had to be bait!

 

Bait you ask?

 

Q: How can I identify bait?

 

1. Look for statements that are obviously incorrect. People generally don't read or post to RSFC unless they know something about college football, and most RSFC regulars are pretty well-informed. So if you read that Florida State won the SEC championship last year, or that Nebraska tied Kansas, you can usually assume that you have stumbled across some bait. In general, misstating schedules and conference affiliations are the red worms and crickets of the RSFC fisherman's bait box.

 

2. Look for stubborn adherence to an argument that has been exposed as flawed. Anyone who, for example, insists in the face of contrary statistics that playing James Madison University and Akron makes up a "tough schedule" is probably baiting you (or is an idiot).

 

3. In some cases a slam against your school or conference may be serving a second purpose -- to get you to bite that hook! Many net.veterans use IYB as shorthand for the Rose Bowl, a.k.a. the Irrelevant Yawner Bowl [tm]. (Anything that is appended with [tm] is likely to be bait as well.) While many of these veterans sincerely believe that the Rose Bowl is irrelevant and boring, they also enjoy getting Big 10/Pac 10 fans riled up defending the "Granddaddy of Them All." In summary, bait may take on many forms and can lure even the most experienced net.users -- even Hall of Famers! Anything which offends your sensibilities stands a decent chance of being bait, so be careful.

 

 

I didn't bite /dry.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="

[chuckm]

I guess I nibbled.

 

chuckm - when I read muffin's comment I just figured he was fishing, like the good old days in rec.sports.football.college

 

What is fishing

 

http://www.rsfckers.com/faq.htm#fishing

 

you ask?

I figured it had to be bait!

 

Bait you ask?

I didn't bite /dry.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="

[Mi Kees]

I have a question. If a pitch bounces and hits the batter, does he take his base or not? I have seen this 3 times in the last 2 weeks and it has been different for different umps. This is JV ball which still should be HS rules. Twice the batter did not take his base and once he did. What is right?

[Iroot4vols]

I have a question. If a pitch bounces and hits the batter, does he take his base or not? I have seen this 3 times in the last 2 weeks and it has been different for different umps. This is JV ball which still should be HS rules. Twice the batter did not take his base and once he did. What is right?

 

 

Free base...just like if a batter swings and hits a ball after it bounces, the ball is still playable.

[Mi Kees]

Free base...just like if a batter swings and hits a ball after it bounces, the ball is still playable.

 

Thats what I thought, but twice umps said no. I just thought maybe the rules are different in high school ball. Thanks for your input and Iroot4vols2