Top keeper in the past 10 years? (Middle Tennessee)

[flashgordon]

Sounds like a few parents have children who didn't make ODP. You might want to get your facts straight before you make a claim that "almost all of them [odp coaches] have club teams that pay them and you can't get away from some 'special treatment' related to thier club." While there are a few club coaches involved in ODP, there are probably more college coaches involved than club. Both the head and assistant coaches at MTSU, the head coach at ETSU, the head and assistant coaches at Vanderbilt, the head coach at Austin Peay, and the head coach at Ole Miss have all served at one point or another as coaches in the TN ODP program over the last several years. As far as I know, none of them coach club teams. According to the TN Soccer website, the ODP staff for '06-'07 (head and assistants) consists of 8 college coaches and 6 club coaches. Of the 6 club coaches, none of them are coaching a club team in the same age group as the one they are coaching for ODP. The reality is that the "top" players and the "bottom" players are easy to identify. It is the middle group that is the most difficult to sort out. And who ultimately gets chosen from that middle group could change from day to day. I'll get off of my soap box now...I just get annoyed with the whole "it's political" excuse for why someone's child didn't make "the team."

my facts are straight ...42% in your example is much mre than a "few club coaches"...and your 42% number is down from what I have experienced....I have often seen "most" (not sour grapes just a lot of disappointment in a very flawed system. I have yet to find a participant who told me they liked ODP, or felt they gained significantly from it, and most felt their was a strong sense of favoritism implicit)...and it sounds like you might be a little defensive to reality...for what it's worth...maybe the process and mix has improved over recent years.... Do you really want to tell us that the club coaches will not promote certain kids (those in the middle you want to reference in your post) to the other coaches??? If you are paid by a club and you watch those kids more often you will be biased in favor of that club and those players...In any case...the only way you get it right is to get the club coaches out.....The college coaches should have a vested interest in these kids....they should be able to fully staff ODP with college coaches. AS I SAID, if you need club coaches have them swap states...

Edited October 2, 2006 by flashgordon

[papa-K]

Didn't have any exposure to the TN ODP scene until my daughter's last year of elligibility (she's an '89). Didn't know if she would get a good look, but being in the mix and training with and against the best talent in TN & surrounding states was good for her. As a keeper, she got to be around one of the best in Kelly Dyer, and take her licks (and give some) in the process of selection. That said, the program is for development, and she surely has done that. As a result of the experience on through the Region camp, she is getting college interests that may not have happended had she not gone through the process for both development & exposure. I can't imagine it was political (both coaches from local colleges), seeing how we had never been in the program the prior 4-5 years eligible. In the end, if an athlete wants to be courted by colleges, they MUST play on a club team that plays in "exposure" tournaments and stay in the ODP mix if possible. If the state only takes 23 girls in each birth year, surely there should be know shame or hard feelings if you're not in that mix. i know we were not counting on being on the state team when we started. That said, maybe the system is getting better.

[cakes]

my facts are straight ...42% in your example is much mre than a "few club coaches"...and your 42% number is down from what I have experienced....I have often seen "most" (not sour grapes just a lot of disappointment in a very flawed system. I have yet to find a participant who told me they liked ODP, or felt they gained significantly from it, and most felt their was a strong sense of favoritism implicit)...and it sounds like you might be a little defensive to reality...for what it's worth...maybe the process and mix has improved over recent years.... Do you really want to tell us that the club coaches will not promote certain kids (those in the middle you want to reference in your post) to the other coaches??? If you are paid by a club and you watch those kids more often you will be biased in favor of that club and those players...In any case...the only way you get it right is to get the club coaches out.....The college coaches should have a vested interest in these kids....they should be able to fully staff ODP with college coaches. AS I SAID, if you need club coaches have them swap states...

 

I guess you haven't talked to many "participants". If no one liked it I would think we wouldn't have teams.

 

I think you don't really understand the process for players to be chosen for ODP. It is next to impossible for a club coach to do what he wants. If he is showing favoritism, the other club coaches can not only call him on it , but complain to the Tn. DOC. For example , the TNFC coaches aren't interested in having the Brentwood coaches get all their players in . Neither are the Fury coaches, Impact , Redoubt , etc. Not to mention the fact that most of the head coaches are college coaches ( or have been ).

 

And the college coaches who are involved don't care. They want the best players available for recruiting purposes and pride when they go to the region camp.

 

The club coaches have to be involved because they encourage the players to come try out. They also know who the better players are in general. No one if Ky. knows that . The college coaches struggle with that info. just on the upper classmen.

 

ODP certainly is improving in Tn. but it doesn't sound like you know much about it.

[BigG]

I guess you haven't talked to many "participants". If no one liked it I would think we wouldn't have teams.

 

That's not necessarily true... many people I have talked to didn't like their experience with ODP, but knew that it was a "necessary evil" they had to put up with to advance where they wanted to go.

 

Is it political? Sure, to some extent. But so is highschool, club, middleschool and even ayso. Anytime someone has to pick a team, and people get left behind or not chosen, people are going to accuse you of picking favorites. Different coaches look for different things in different players. I might view someone quite differently than another coach, but maybe a LOT differently than their parents. This is something that will never change.

 

It is a LOT better than it used to be.

[cakes]

That's not necessarily true... many people I have talked to didn't like their experience with ODP, but knew that it was a "necessary evil" they had to put up with to advance where they wanted to go.

 

Is it political? Sure, to some extent. But so is highschool, club, middleschool and even ayso. Anytime someone has to pick a team, and people get left behind or not chosen, people are going to accuse you of picking favorites. Different coaches look for different things in different players. I might view someone quite differently than another coach, but maybe a LOT differently than their parents. This is something that will never change.

 

It is a LOT better than it used to be.

 

I do think if "many" equaled majority then we wouldn't have ODP teams. Arkansas doesn't field much at the region camp. Or Miss. Their ODP situation is not good.

The ones that have a negative experience will always be louder. I don't know what would constitute a bad experience for someone. Sometimes it's just that this is the least involved that a parent is allowed to be with one of their child's soccer teams. No sense of control. That's tough for some to deal with.

 

We have more players involved with Tn. ODP than at any other time in the past 10 years. Tn. ODP is more successful right now than at at other time.

[cakes]

I'll state up front that I don't know much about ODP, but I'm curious about something. Is there any truth to the notion that players from Middle Tennessee have a greater likelyhood of getting picked than others in East or West Tennessee? I know you need to go where the talent it, and middle tennessee is certainly loaded with talent, but I've heard more than once that your chances of getting picked, all other things being equal, decrease the farther way from Nashville you live.

 

 

Not true. Great players will be picked no matter where they are from. Good players run the risk of being one of 10 players at the same level. 8 of them may be from middle tn.

 

The player pool in middle tn. is just much bigger than anywhere else in tn. so it ends up being represented more. And truthfully, more players come to tryouts from there.

 

No one ever asks where is that player from with the idea that it will matter as to whether they are picked up or not. There is no "geographical bias".

 

It really is base on playing ability. Hard to believe isn't it?

[xqqqqme]

Not true. Great players will be picked no matter where they are from. Good players run the risk of being one of 10 players at the same level. 8 of them may be from middle tn.

 

The player pool in middle tn. is just much bigger than anywhere else in tn. so it ends up being represented more. And truthfully, more players come to tryouts from there.

 

No one ever asks where is that player from with the idea that it will matter as to whether they are picked up or not. There is no "geographical bias".

 

It really is base on playing ability. Hard to believe isn't it?

 

Goegraphy *is* a bit of a factor in determining ODP participation. Not in regards to player talent, but simply from the standpoint that a majority of ODP events take place in the Nashville area. I would suspect that many players from the East & West parts of the state have dropped out because it is a hassle to travel 3-4 hours to ODP events, while for the Nashville players it is just a short drive, and many of them can even go home between morning & afternoon training sessions if they wish.

[flashgordon]

[quote name='cakes' date=

 

ODP certainly is improving in Tn. but it doesn't sound like you know much about it.

Cakes...it may be improving...that would be a good thing. You have teams because of the push by the club coaches for participation and the myth that you can't go play at a d1 level if you do not participate....may help.....isn't required...there are too many examples of good college players never making it on the state or regional treams. My facts are straight....and as far as knowing what they're talking about....think I do....think you don't ...you just seem a little too defensive of something tha has been criticized for years, and foolish in your thoughts on club coaches and their influence. I'm not faulting the club coaches for their bias and the flaw in the system....I'm faulting a system that could/should be improved. Now I'm done ...I'm tired of repeating the same thing that you simply don't get or are too defensive to grasp....I'm not going to change it...and you obviously like a flawed system!

[cakes]

Goegraphy *is* a bit of a factor in determining ODP participation. Not in regards to player talent, but simply from the standpoint that a majority of ODP events take place in the Nashville area. I would suspect that many players from the East & West parts of the state have dropped out because it is a hassle to travel 3-4 hours to ODP events, while for the Nashville players it is just a short drive, and many of them can even go home between morning & afternoon training sessions if they wish.

 

 

Last year there were events in Chattanooga, Knoxville, and Memphis. 2 in Nashville.

[mjuhb]

Last year there were events in Chattanooga, Knoxville, and Memphis. 2 in Nashville.

and 2 in murfreesboro

 

1 on mothers day i think

2nd was the mini camp in june during a rain storm that i got stuck under the pavilion at siegel

[cakes]

and 2 in murfreesboro

 

1 on mothers day i think

2nd was the mini camp in june during a rain storm that i got stuck under the pavilion at siegel

 

those were the two I was thinking about. that was all in the Nashville area , right ?

[mjuhb]

those were the two I was thinking about. that was all in the Nashville area , right ?

i guess

 

at 1st they had all the girls events scheduled for siegel park in murfreesboro for 06/07

 

but now the november training is at ezell park in nashville and the 2nd before christmas in cookville