Player gets ejected and suspended

[RHSBASEBALL99]

I do not know exactly what the rule states, but as a high school catcher I personally do not like the rule that states a runner cannot truck a catcher. The catcher is not supposed to be able to block off the plate unless he has, or is receiving the baseball. I think/feel that the runner has all the right in the world to plow right through any catcher (or position player for that matter) who is blocking a bag without the ball. I don't know exactly how I feel about ejections because it is always on a case to case basis.

Well, there's my two cents. I'll turn it back over to y'all.

[bigbadblue]

Gerry: It is obvious that you have the reading level of a high schooler. You never have to slide, but if you do, you have to slide legally. In a bam bam situation, decisions are made by instinct, not knowledge of the game. That is why there are collisions. Use your head buddy. You can read the rulebook online. Try www.nfhs.com.

[NWTNZebra]

I completely agree with RHSBASEBALL99. I mean if there is a man standing on first, it is perfectly legal to plow over him, because as the runner your only objective is to get to the bag, not worry about anything else. As a catcher myself, I believe that if a player does not "maliciously" go into the plate, intending to hurt the catcher, then there is no reason that he should have to slide. If the catcher is brave enough to block the plate when waiting on the play to develop, then he is obviously ready for the impact that could happen when the runner arrives.

[ghost]

The rule states that the runner has to avoid contact. He can either run around or slide. The instance that started this discussion, the catcher did not have the ball and was about three foot up the third base line. The runner dove into the catcher trying to get to the base. Now by rule obstruction of the base could have been called, but malicious contact supercedes obstruction. I would reall ylike for umpires to address obstruction and enforce it more to keep instances such as the one in the Gordonsville vs MJCS game from occuring.

[Gerry Bertier]

bigbadblue, since you are such an expert, where is the rule in the rulebook that states what you said?

[Gerry Bertier]

While the player does not have to slide, he either has to slide or ATTEMPT to avoid the fielder, and if he slides, he must do so legally. But not all contact is an out.

 

Example: Catcher has the ball and is waiting before the plate, just to his left of the baseline. Runner attempts to go around catcher to the runner's left. Catcher reacts and moves to his right (the runner's left), which puts them in the same place at the same time. There may be contact. It may be significant. But if it is not malicious, and if the runner did not do anything such as put his hands up into the catcher or lower his shoulder into the catcher, I've got nothing.

 

In FED, the burden is on the runner to avoid the fielder, but if he makes a legitimate effort to do so, contact can still occur, and it's not necessarily an out.

 

Now if he does not slide, does not attempt to avoid and decides he is going to play Pete Rose, he's out, no run (unless the contact occurred AFTER he had touched the plate), and he's ejected.

 

All of those exciting runner-catcher collisions you see on the ESPN highlights, sorry, that's not FED.

[Celinadawg18]

Jonathan Frazier of Clay County ran over Montereys catcher last week too,and the catcher dropped the ball from were he had just been plowed and the ref didnt throw Jon out because the catcher came up the line a good 5 foot. He just called him out but it almost started a big contoversey between the 2 teams.

 

SG#18

[bigbadblue]

Alright, I now break out the dusty rule book:

 

NFHS Baseball Rules Book 2004

Art. 8-4b. Any runner is out when he...does not legally slide and causes illegal contact and/or illegally alters the actions of a fielder in the immediate act of making a play, or in a force play, does not slide in a direct line between the bases.

EXCEPTION: A runner may slide in a direction away from the fielder to avoid making contact or altering the play of the fielder.

NOTE: Runners are never required to slide, but if a runner elects to slide, the slide must be legal.

 

Now that the sliding thing is clear, let's move onto the malicious contact.

 

Art 2-21b. Offensive inerference is an act (physically or verbal) by the team at bat when...a runner creates malicious contact with any fielder, with or without the ball, in or out of the baseline.

 

Furthermore:

Art 3-3n A coach, player, substitute, attendant or other bench personnel shall not...initiate malicious contact.

PENALTY: The umpire shall eject the offender from the game...In (3-3n) the ejected player is declared out unless he has already scored.

 

And finally:

Art 8-3-2 ...Malicious contact supercedes obstruction.

 

This is also a dead ball, but please trust me on that because I am not looking it up.

 

As I said earlier, the umpire has to judge whether or not the act was malicious. Keep in mind that in a bang bang situation, if a runner has not begun his slide and there is going to be a collision, naturally he will brace himself for the impact. This is where the lowering the shoulder thing comes from. This is not an act of malicious contact. Most umpires do not know this, probally because they don't read the rule book (sadly). So, from here on out, whoever reads this thread can know for sure that a runner does not have to slide in high school baseball, and lowering the shoulder is not always an act of malicious contact.

 

Gerry, you had the right idea, and you were about 90% right. As interested as you seem in the rules, you should try umpiring. You may like it, you may not. Just a suggestion.

 

The new umpire from Jackson: you need to read the rulebook. Keep it by the toilet and read it. Also, take advantage of opportunities like these that allow you to think about these weird situations, and most importantly, TALK ABOUT THEM WITH OTHER PEOPLE. And, of course, read your rule book!!!

Edited April 4, 2004 by bigbadblue

[wad]

Sorry guys, Under the new rule NO defensive player may block any bag(including the catcher) unless he is in possession of the baseball. Not about to get it, Not almost in the glove. MUST have possession. Until he has possession by rule the line and the bag or plate belongs to the runner. As far as sliding in h/s no rule says you have to slide. But if you do it must be legal.

Edited April 4, 2004 by wad

[BaseballFreak003]

When I was a catcher in h/s I had this similar thing happen...the player was ejected because the ball was almost to me (he would have been out if he slided, given it was a clean catch and tag) and ran me over in the process of catching the ball... I never had posession but it was one of those things where as soon as it hit my glove he hit me.... (I also wasn't really blocking the plate, he had the back of the plate to slide to)...but I really never understood that rule to the fullest extent... (I guess it is umpire's opinion) but I do know that you are supposed to slide when the catcher has possession of the ball.....

Edited April 4, 2004 by BaseballFreak003

[Gerry Bertier]

everyone states these are new rules, wher can they be found? I would especially like to know the possession of the ball rule and where it is at.

[bigbadblue]

Wad: buy a rule book or talk to someone who knows the game of baseball. This does not include William Robert the Umpire down at the local mens' softball fields. There is no rule, new or old, saying that a fielder, in any situation or under any weather, cannot stand in the basepath. There never has been a rule like that, and never will be. At least pretend like you know what you are talking about.