Robyn

Every band director has his/her own idea of etiquette at a game. Some alternate songs with the other band, some ignore the other band completely and play whenever they'd like, still others like to compete back and forth across the field during the game to try and one-up each other. It's all in good fun. The standing rule of thumb is that a band should limit it's playing to when it's own team is on offense or when the ball is not in play. There are actually rules in the TSSAA handbook regarding "organized noisemakers" that allow an opposing coach to ask the ref to silence a band during the game. It is at the refs discretion after a warning to decide whether to assess a penalty for further playing. The only time a team will be penalized because of the band is if the band is playing during the snap of the opponents offensive possession. Regarding the initial post, if Smyrna band was that distracting, the Lavergne coaches simply needed to ask the refs to quiet the band. If the band refused to stop, the refs could assess penalty yards. I'm of mixed feelings about this. I personally feel like the team should get over themselves.... if the band is too much of a distraction, maybe the team is not good enough to begin with. I do understand the rules, however. I give the band credit for being a force in the game, and if the ref or opposing coach don't say anything, play on!

Interesting question, montague1! I'm sure if it were easy, every band in the country would be great. As with trying to turn around a football program, it will take years of dedication by both director and students. It will also take a focused, driven, goal-oriented and highly analytical director to effect this change. Just as it probably took years for the band's slow decline, it'll take time to build it back up. I'm not familiar with the Lexington program, so I'll speak more generally.... Most good school bands have good middle school bands. A middle school director who is a solid recruiter, teaches sound fundamental playing, and promotes high school band is the key to starting a re-building process. As with a football team, having quality players from the bottom up helps the strength of a consistently strong program. Every band director toes a fine line between "content" and "entertainment". There's an ongoing debate in the band world (and on football message boards!) about what music a band should play. That debate is largely irrelevant in this topic except to say that the band should play music that is exciting and entertaining to the musicians. Doing so will help retain good players and recruit younger players to band in the first place. A large part of recruitment is perception. Everyone wants to be a part of a winning tradition. This is true of football or band. Once a band has sunk below the "poverty line", it's tough to bring it back. Some ideas might be to emphasize some points of strength in the program. If the band is small, but has a fun or exciting drumline, the director should make that drumline a point of emphasis. As that portion of the band gets stronger, the director can begin to use that popularity as an opportunity to recruit more kids to the band. Expanding the color guard or adding a dance team are other ways of improving the size/image of a program to help in recruiting. Another way to increase the size of the band is to increase their involvement in pep-rallies and other activities. If the band is a integral part of many school functions, more people will want to be a part of it and therefore it will grow as an ensemble. I've seen many small bands who play with excitement and energy to a very enthusiastic crowd. I've also seen many young and enthusiastic bands entertain at half-time. Every band has it's own formula. One thing that seems to be consistent in good bands, though, is recruitment and retention.

It's too bad that a thread on the "BAND" forum about which bands folks like to see has to be hijacked by folks who seemed threatened by the marching band. What part of this thread was about football? What part of this question was "are football players tougher than band members"? What part of the initial topic was about "is band a sport"? It would be great fun to solve the "Which is tougher?" question once and for all. I say give all the band members pads and helmets for two weeks of football practice and give the football players marching uniforms and instruments for two weeks of band practice. At the end of two weeks, have the band members play a football game, and have the football players play a half-time show. A panel of impartial judges can be selected to see which group was able to do the other group's activity better. A winner will be declared! In the meantime, I'd like the rights to the video of the football players playing the halftime show, as I'd like to market it and become a youTube millionaire!

Interesting comments from a poster named after a school with one of the best bands in the Chattanooga area. In fact, seems like the Cleveland band usually wins more contests than the Cleveland football team each year.... I've got to agree that the Dobyns-Bennett Band program is in a class of it's own. It's amazing what that program is able to accomplish.

A good idea. It is telling that a board full of high school football "experts" -- certainly rabid fans -- doesn't know the answer. Could be that's why there's so much confusion. If you do find the answer elsewhere, please post it!

I really like this post. Excellent work!

Can't find it online, but I do know that I saw it in writing a few years ago. My school's AD showed a list of rules to all coaches, sponsors, and directors prior to each football season. Have seen officials issue warnings, though never actually saw a penalty enforced. Sorry I can't be more help.

What was just described is indeed poor sportsmanship. The offended coach simply has to ask the refs to enforce the rule. Though I can't seem to find it online, I know it is there. As with anything, each reffing crew is allowed certain leeway in determining what is acceptable.

Not sure where "around here" is. Have you been to any of the Saturday competitions? I have, and the crowds are often the same size as the football crowds. Band contests, like football games, run from very crowded to very poorly attended, based on the size or prestige of the competition. As to affecting the outcome of the game due to weather....... how often does this occurence really come up? Usually, if it's storming, that band has already left. Woodwinds shouldn't play in the rain, and brass is just plain dangerous in lightning.

It's interesting to see all of the back and forth between fans of bands and those who prefer the band not be there. I would guess that most of the differences would depend on what type of band each poster has experienced. I'm constantly amazed, though, at the lack of information, and even the misinformation put out on this board about bands. Let me set some of these issues straight: "those bands could sustain themselevs without the football team, highschool bands cannot" -- The single largest expense of a high school band is attending football games. Between uniforms, marching equipment, many bands having to provide their own busses, etc. The band would save quite a bit of money by not attending. In fact, many school's football teams rely on the gate and concession revenue that their larger bands provide. Ask the coaches why they tolerate those bands..... they know. "bands that don't go to away games" -- Many bands, particularly in the state of Tennessee, have to pay for their own transportation. Football teams, on the other hand, are almost always provided busses by the school for which they play. The further the trip, the more expensive the bus. The bigger the band, the more busses necessary. Sometimes, it just isn't practical to take the band to the more distant away games when the result of the game is a foregone conclusion. I am a football fan AND a band fan -- wish the band could go to every game. It's not usually a lack of school spirit, though, but a budget constraint. "wish the band wouldn't play during offensive drives" -- TSSAA rules (and those in most states) explicitly say that is the only time the band is ALLOWED to play. Bands (rather the team of the offending band) are given penalties if the band plays during the opponent's offensive drives. For the rule to be enforced, the opposing coach simply has to ask the ref to enforce it. When this request is made, the ref is usually more than happy to oblige, as is the offending band director. "band and their parents take up too much room in the stands" -- Gate and concessions....... I don't know a band out there that receives a percentage of the gate. Those band parents have paid the football team for the right to support their child. The band doesn't pay gate, but those kids can EAT! And they do. Schools with bigger band programs (and band parent attendance) can thank the band for the extra $1000s in the football budget. "band takes off after halftime" -- The football team takes their break during the halftime performance. The band, traditionally, takes their break during third quarter. Seems fair. Gives the band time to support the football team by spending their money at concessions. "football has a special program during halftime, band plays too long" -- The band, as has been mentioned before, is required by most schools to be at the game. Given that, it seems that half-time should be the opportunity for the band to perform. Many schools coaches understand this, and do their "special presentations" as pre-game or post-game activities. I think most coaches prefer NOT to have half-time activities, as they prefer to use half-time to prepare themselves and the team for the second half. Band directors have been more than willing to entertain the crowd during this time so that the players and coaches can take care of the business of getting ready for another half of football. I've been fortunate to be a part of programs where the team and the band get along. If the coach wants certain things done a certain way, there's plenty of time during the week to speak with the band director. Throughout my experience, most of the band members and band directors I've known have had great relationships with the football players and coaches. It's simple, really. If everyone understands that the band is there to support the school and that the team AND the band benefit from supporting each other. That said, let the complaints roll! What's the point of a football message board, anyway, of we can't talk about the band!

Yup! And it was the attempt to keep up with those mid-90s teams from Marion County that led to the powerhouse '97 RAMS. Better competition in the region will benefit all of the teams. Rather lose a few regular season games and make it to the 'boro because the team has been tested and found their strengths... It'd be good to see MC get back up to (slightly below -- ) where they once were!

Just want to congratulate MC on making it to the second round -- seems like it's been a while. hoping and expecting Tyner to win, but looking for a good game and possibly a closer rivalry in the future!

Bledsoe County has great facilities and a very friendly fan base. The fact that they usually let the opponent win as well is only an added bonus!

I'm a big TYNER fan, and would love to see them win, but it's tough to pick against McCALLIE. Let's hope some of these guys remember how they hung their heads in the second half last season after playing a tough first half. I'd like to see the guys stay in there, if they do then it's anybody's game....

hehehe... Glad to see people noticing the band! Tynerfan99! pretty much nailed the response. I'm a big band fan and can also say that MOST bands take third quarter off. If you consider the game to be 5 quarters, the team plays 1, 2, 4, & 5 while the band plays 1, 2, 3, & 5. Talk about the entire entertainment package! As for growing up, etc, it is actually against TSSAA regulations to play while the opponent is on offense. The rule is only enforced if the opposing coach makes a complaint. With the first complaint the team gets a warning, with the second it's a penalty. Above all, though, the bands usually respect the wishes of the coach. If Turner wants quiet, he deserves quiet.

A loss *IS* a loss, that's true. All accounts, however, seem to agree that SEQUATCHIE played a strong game and had some nice players. Just like TYNER was not hanging their heads over a loss to FULTON, SEQUATCHIE should not hang their heads over a loss to TYNER. The nature of the game is that someone has to lose. Playing a good, hard fought, well coached game is a sign of good things to come for SEQUATCHIE.

Congrats to TYNER and good luck to both teams the rest of the season. Sounds like SEQUATCHIE is for real. Would love to see the rest of the conference improve like they have this season. As was mentioned, strength of schedule always seems to hurt TYNER when they run into the privates in post-season. Good to hear the band played well. Does SEQUATCHIE have a new band director this year?

The band *IS* about the game. Good bands know when to play to pump up the team, and when not to play. Good thing about Tyner is that the band and the team work so well together. Ask the players if they'd rather play when the band is there or when they're not. Also, a lot of the football players are -- or were -- in the band. Synergy..... Not to mention a lot more hungry mouths for concessions and proud parents buying tickets.

Ultimately Brainerd vs. Tyner is the definition of a true rivalry. Doesn't matter how the teams look on paper or what their records, it will always be a game that can go either way and means more than any other game of the season. No denying that Tyner has had the upper hand recently -- I think Tyner is the better team -- but this is a game where pride is on the line more than any other. A lot of these kids live in the same neighborhoods, went to the same elementary schools, go to the same churches, etc. Imagine how much more intense the game would be if it were a division game!

I think a lot of it has to do with the mismanagement of the Hamilton County school system as a whole. Since coming in, Jesse Register has cut all "non-essential" programs, including athletics (assistant coaches, buses, uniforms, etc), arts (unless specifically designated an "arts magnet"), and even bookkeepers, support personnel, and teacher salaries. Eventually, everything in the system is running on overload and something has to give. Maybe things will change now that the good doctor has "retired".

Sorry to hear about the dance team. Agree 100% about tough non-region games. This may be the year we have the worst regular season record in a long time but go further in the play-offs. Sometimes the guys go so long without a good test that once they get hit they fold too quickly. Thanks for the response!

I'd just like to say as a Tyner fan that I'm pleased to be associated with posters who know so much about the game and aren't afraid to acknowledge getting beaten by an opponent who earns the win. Proud to be a Tyner fan, even in our loss last night. How was the band?

This may be OT, but if a band is referred to as "just pimp" is that a positive or a negative? Do I want to be "pimp"? Thanks in advance for the answer.

How is Knox Fulton's band?

Polk County has got a horrible bleacher section that should have been condemned years ago. Bledsoe County has a very nice field.