FargoStrut

SportsFan, I'm honestly not sure that any kid from Cavaliers Wrestling Club participated in TNAAU this year. I do know that Cookeville Youth Wrestling has a lot of kids and several of them are studs. Those are DEF 2 separate clubs. Ive heard there may be a CYW kid that furthers his education at McCallie but I haven't heard abt a Cavalier kid going there.

JoJo, Jose, Mason, Titus and Ryder are all freshmen

I would hate to think that Spencer quit bc he didnt win his semis match. He has accomplished WAY too much and fought through alot of adversity to give up and not wrestle it out for 3rd place. However, that same thought did cross my mind as well when I saw/heard he wasn't coming back on Saturday. To be fair, that is easy to do when you dont see an obvious injury, like what happened in the Munoz match. I hope that's not the case, but I guess time will tell. On a side note, I think the 2023 tournament was one of, if not the most historic tournament of all-time! You had Yianni become a 4-time champ (only 5th ever), Spencer upset in the semis trying to bc a 4 timer, RBY upset in the finals trying to bc a 3 timer, 2 wrestlers that won their 3rd and now have a chance to bc 4 timers in Starocci and Brooks (Starocci has 2 yrs left and can get to 5) and that's not including O'Toole who just won his 2nd as a true sophomore. I honestly believe that in 20-30 yrs we'll look back at this tournament and say it was one of the most historic tournaments of all-time!

Not sure who was coaching the Oline down there last season but CGR most likely upgraded his staff with this hire. If "Country" can't do anything else, the man knows how to coach up an Oline!

Looks like Askew isn't the only one who has pulled out of the match. Our lineup, especially through the middleweights, looks a little different with some movement in weight classes as well.

Here are a few facts... I said earlier that I thought either Desselle and Brenot (listed lightest to heaviest) should have won OW. I went back and looked at Lipsey's, Desselle's and Brenot's matches by round. 132- LIPSEY Rd 1- Pinned a blood round wrestler, Quarters- Majored a blood round wrestler (returning medalist) Semis- Teched 6th place finisher Finals- Majored 2nd place wrestler 138- DESSELLE Rd 1- Teched a blood rd wrestler Quarters- Pinned a kid that went 1-1 and didnt wrestle the 2nd day (possibly overweight on day 2) Semis- Majored 3rd place finisher Finals- Pinned 2nd place wrestler 182- BRENOT Rd 1- Pinned kid that went 0-2 Quarters- Pinned 4th place wrestler Semis- Teched 3rd place wrestler Finals- Majored 2nd place wrestler Of the 3, only Brenot beat the 2nd, 3rd and 4th place wrestlers in his weight class. I went through the other brackets as well. There are 2 other wrestlers who also beat the 2nd, 3rd and 4th place finishes in their brackets. However, the other 2 where NOWHERE near as dominant as Brenot. Along the way, Symborski escaped with (2) 2-1 victories including his finals match while Noah Todd had an overtime match, (2) 8-3 victories and an 11-2 major against a freshman 182 who has to weigh in wearing ankle weights to qualify for 220. With all this said, whomever votes for the OW got this one right!

Personally, I thought there were 2 obvious choices for OW in D1-AA, 1) Desselle and 2) Brenot in no particular order. No gripes here with giving it to the senior in this case. Both guys dominated the competition in their respective weight classes.

Why no love for Brenot??? He actually DID beat Alvazez at Who's #1! Granted it was preseason and abt 5 months ago but a win is a win... guess the real matchups have zero bearing on our "fantasy matchups".

I was watching the boys but was curious how those that follow and were watching the girls wrestle felt about 132lb championship match. Obviously it was ruled illegal, so I guess my question is...how egregious was it? Was it illegal 20 yrs ago or considered "good hard wrestling"?

Humpy, easy on ERgrad. We all know he's been a faithful follower of ER football for the past 30+ years. If you have the clout and can somehow arrange a meeting with Coach Brooks, I'll personally call Margaret and see if she'll let her old man have a sit down with Coach Brooks. If she says that he's allowed to go, then I'll stop by his house, pick him up and bring him to the meeting. I'm sure both ERgrad and Coach Brooks will both appreciate it IF you are somehow able to pull this off.

Yeah, that's more like it. My first thought was NO WAY, scorekeepers got their Aidens switched. Abt 10 seconds later, I thought if it were true, it would be one of the biggest upsets EVER in TSSAA history.

Smalling over Bouma does NOT belong here!

All good Bumpy, we wont mind if you stay up all night giving great insight and making projections for the next 10 weight classes. In all seriousness, it's good stuff and I enjoy reading them. Great work!!!

I think there was a misinterpretation along the way. I'm saying the public teams before the split had a tougher time at team duals and individual state due to having to contend with the private schools. Sounds like we're in agreement there. I was saying that I think the elite teams (not elite wrestlers) from the 60's and 70's would get taken behind the woodshed by teams in later years (late 90's and early 2000's). You mentioned a few kids who could have great careers post HS. As you previously stated, there are others as well attending VT, USMA, UTC in addition to other universities.

Cant think of any AA's of the top of my head since Marable but both Boykins, Oliver, Hooker are a few of the guys who had varying degrees of success whether it was NCAA'S or in FS/GR. I'm sure there are others I cant think of at this moment. Hopefully Brayden Palmer will be able to end our AA drought this season. Now we need to get back on topic.

Yeah, def would NOT consider Blackmon as a "hole" in the lineup. It had to elsewhere. Not sure where they were, but when he's added to the mix, it makes the holes even more glaring for a dual. Obviously Soddy that yr was a very good team as well and were a deeper team from top to bottom, but it's almost unbelievable that a team with 5 state champs, 3 other top 4 placers and a guy that was runner-up the following year didnt win the TN public school duals championship! We've had a few guys after the ones mentioned do fairly well at the next level. Also do believe that a few kids who have graduated in the past couple years and some who will graduate this year or in the next few years will have success on the next level too.

2002 Bradley had 5 state champs, a runner up, a 3rd place and 4th place kid. However, that team lost to Soddy in the team duals that didnt include private schools. This is NO WAY that you have 5 state champs and 3 more top 4 kids and lose a dual against another public school team in TN unless you have MASSIVE holes in your lineup. Obviously, that team wrecked shop at the individual state tournament. To my point about downgrading teams after the splits. Its obviously easier to win an individual championship now than it was 25 yrs ago (more classes = less competition). Not saying those 8 placer wouldnt have placed or the 5 champs wouldnt have won, but I'm fairly certain there were a few blue, red AND purple blooded kids that would have knocked off at least one of those 8 placers somewhere along the way.

Cobra, I had a few minutes and did a little research on 96 Overton team that got beat by Baylor in semis. You are absolutely correct that Baylor beat them. However, after looking at the box scores, Overton ABSOLUTELY DID NOT come to wrestle that match. Studs got majors or minors in place of techs and pins, state placers got beat by kids that didnt place, state placers got beat by other placers winners they beat at individuals (50/50 matches) and Eric Jordan (state champ) forfeited his match. All.of that and they only got beat by 7. All Jordan had to do was win (granted Baylor kid got 3rd) and Overton would've faced Ryan who had a bye. Almost like Overton overlooked Baylor AND had some bad luck that day. Sometimes Eli Manning and David Tyree's Giants do beat Tom Brady and Randy Moss' 16-0 Patriots. Why you play the game!

IMO, if you're looking at overall individual state placers when deciding about best dual teams, teams before the public/private split would supersede teams after that split. Even further down the line would be teams with more individual place winners that came after the small/large public split. That being said, I dont know when the cutoff would be, but no way you can compare teams from the 60's to teams from the late 90's, much less today. I know there were teams that were dominate in their own era who had a few guys throughout the lineup who would compete and possibly dominate in any era. However I think with advances in diet, exercise, conditioning, strength, etc; most of the "role players" would get worked by more recent team's "role players". I say that to say I don't think any of the elite older teams would compete top to bottom with more recent teams and the Bradley teams of early 2000's and recent Cleveland teams (all after splits) should get a slight downgrade. Those teams were all DOMINANT against who they had to wrestle and its not a knock on any of those EXCEPTIONAL squads, just my opinion.

Good stuff Cobra, Thank you for doing the research. I obviously didn't have time to research it, just going off the old "memory bank". I even said my years may be a little off. However, I do REMEMBER that during those few years, the Overton teams that I saw were the best public HS teams I remember seeing in TN, even to this day. Again, thank you for doing the research and you may very well be correct that the 97 team was better than the 96 team. All I know is they were FREAKIN STACKED for a public school!!!

Gotta say Pops, sentences 1 and 4 are ABSOLUTE FACTS that everyone SHOULD KNOW! Sentence #2 is a fact that only SOME people know. As I'm unable to foresee the future, I THINK and BELIEVE that you're correct on sentence #3. That being said, I "think" #3 will become a fact on Saturday evening. Good Luck to your boy!

Cobra, obviously I can read and I understand the stated topic. However, I dont know enough abt the private school teams, especially those before my time, to add my $0.02 to the conversation. This is why I explicitly stated 96 Overton is my top pick for public, even if they didnt win and the 97 team did. Sometimes, it's best to speak on things you know and let others comment on things you dont know as well, even if it only partially addresses the topic or question.

Cobra, you and I both know there is a difference between public and private. That's why I never mentioned anything about private schools and said that I cant remember any public school that would've wanted any part of the 96 Overton team. Someone else may come up with another public team that was outstanding in their own right, but 96 Overton is the best public school team that I personally remember seeing, even to this day.

Overton in 96/97 was a VERY GOOD team, but I believe their 95/96 team was their best team. That team was STACKED!!! It had some of the guys listed in a previous post in addition to McTorry. I may be wrong on my yrs but that's what I remember. Coach Gabe, if you're on here and read this, please confirm which team was your best. After the public/private split, Clarksville in 99/00 was loaded as well, but I dont think any public school would've wanted any of the 96 Overton squad. Just my opinion though.

Cougar, sometimes you gotta think outside the box. SMOKED didnt say she won her championship last season, he just said "she is good and is already a state champion". IF Papa Smoke is telling the truth, there are DEF other options than the 4 you listed. She may be 1-1 in state championship matches having lost a close decision last yr after winning it her freshman year. Idk PapaSmoke but I'm thinking he may have a "uncle Harold", who back in the day played MLB for several organizations, most notably the Chicago White Sox