Public v Private -- Why Not Rich Schools vs. Poor

[DonCChatt]

Let me pose a slightly different question in this debate. Before I do so, and in the interest of full disclosure, I am a Parent of 2 Notre Dame Students. Notre Dame chose to give up the limited scholarships/support for Athletes, and moved from D2 to D1 (AAA for Football, A/AA for other sports). In doing so, we've accepted the 1.8 multiplier.

 

I’ve read much of the debates about private vs. public, and unfair advantage or not. My question is whether or not public schools in “rich” districts have an unfair advantage over all other regular or “poor” districts. I’ve seen some of the facilities at some of the richer public schools, and I know they are much better than anything we’ve got at my private school, and way better than a lot of the other public schools.

Edited September 10, 2006 by DonCChatt

[flashgordon]

I’ve read much of the debates about private vs. public, and unfair advantage or not. My question is whether or not public schools in “rich” districts have an unfair advantage over all other regular or “poor” districts. I’ve seen some of the facilities at some of the richer public schools, and I know they are much better than anything we’ve got at my private school, and way better than a lot of the other public schools.

Do not get me wrong...I love the Tim's Ford area, and the people of Franklin County are great but no one is going to accuse Winchester of being Beverly HIlls....or Bellemeade, etc. However Franklin County/Winchester (public school) has as nice a facility as can be found in Tennessee....I would only consider Baylor and Ensworth as superior...but that is based on what I have been privileged to see...there may be others.....the point is Winchester found a wa to put a state of the art school and athletic facility in a rural area that is not considered "wealthy".....a split off of the question is.....do the facilities really "make the team"???

Edited September 10, 2006 by flashgordon

[DonCChatt]

Agreed facilities are just part of the equation. There is also money for JV coaches, support for the secondary sports (i.e. -- everything but Football). In Girl's soccer, there seem to a disproportional number of good public schools in "rich" (or "richer") areas, and less in the rest of the state. There are a number of notable exceptions, but these seem the exception and not the rule.

[TMA123]

Agreed facilities are just part of the equation. There is also money for JV coaches, support for the secondary sports (i.e. -- everything but Football). In Girl's soccer, there seem to a disproportional number of good public schools in "rich" (or "richer") areas, and less in the rest of the state. There are a number of notable exceptions, but these seem the exception and not the rule.

 

 

 

Most high school soccer players have also played travel soccer for years and still do during the high school off season. It is a very expensive sport because of all the travel involved. You can include volleyball in this also. I feel that is the main reason you see the "wealther" counties with the extra money for these sports. Parents demand it! It is known, that soccer players are noticed by college coaches, not in their high school games, but in the travel tournaments.

[flashgordon]

Most high school soccer players have also played travel soccer for years and still do during the high school off season. It is a very expensive sport because of all the travel involved. You can include volleyball in this also. I feel that is the main reason you see the "wealther" counties with the extra money for these sports. Parents demand it! It is known, that soccer players are noticed by college coaches, not in their high school games, but in the travel tournaments.

Travel soccer (particularly girl's) probably skews soccer...it is expensive and many of the strong programs are getting to the point that it is hard to get on the field unless you're a travel player, but football doesn't have a travel program and there are some very strong football programs in some relatively "lower or average income" areas (Jo Byrns comes to mind this year!) that can wear out the "high income schools".....the facility does not effect this as much as the mental toughness and the mentality that "all the guys play football". Strong participation in football can certainly overcome top flight facilities...the best of both worlds is both! Ask MBA,MUS, and soon to be there.....Ensworth! And you can"t say enough about a really good coach....they are not always easy to find!

Edited September 11, 2006 by flashgordon

[big red big blue]

Travel soccer (particularly girl's) probably skews soccer...it is expensive and many of the strong programs are getting to the point that it is hard to get on the field unless you're a travel player, but football doesn't have a travel program and there are some very strong football programs in some relatively "lower or average income" areas (Jo Byrns comes to mind this year!) that can wear out the "high income schools".....the facility does not effect this as much as the mental toughness and the mentality that "all the guys play football". Strong participation in football can certainly overcome top flight facilities...the best of both worlds is both! Ask MBA,MUS, and soon to be there.....Ensworth! And you can"t say enough about a really good coach....they are not always easy to find!

 

I'd say that makes a lot of sense. Back in the 80s up through the mid 90s, the dominant football programs were teams like Gallatin, Lincoln County, and Jefferson County, while Brentwood HS and Hillsboro HS--in two of the wealthiest zip codes in all the US--were horrible. MBA used to play Gallatin regularly in the play-offs. It was amazing to see how that community supported its team. I don't think it hurts to have lots of money, but parental involvement from an early age, deep community support--those are the real "difference makers" imo.

[BigG]

Also curious to know how much comes from the local Athletic Booster Clubs. Some of those clubs are run seperately from the school as a whole.

[cbg]

Also curious to know how much comes from the local Athletic Booster Clubs. Some of those clubs are run seperately from the school as a whole.

 

I have been told that any school that is a member of the Southern Association of Schools must have their booster clubs directly inside the schools. I do know that only a small % of the public schools are a member of the association.

[uncfan13]

With the adoption of the Basic Education Program (BEP) by the legislature you have the four wealthiest counties receiving the smallest amounts per capita of all the counties in the state. Hamilton is dead last, a tremendous tribute to our stellar legislative delegation. I go by rural schools and see new facilities. I go over to watch Tyner play and take my life in my hands climbing up the visitors bleachers. I think the BEP has been a great leveler among schools in relatively wealthy areas and rural.

[flashgordon]

With the adoption of the Basic Education Program (BEP) by the legislature you have the four wealthiest counties receiving the smallest amounts per capita of all the counties in the state. Hamilton is dead last, a tremendous tribute to our stellar legislative delegation. I go by rural schools and see new facilities. I go over to watch Tyner play and take my life in my hands climbing up the visitors bleachers. I think the BEP has been a great leveler among schools in relatively wealthy areas and rural.

I'd put Franklin County's (Wincester) facilities up against any school this isn't in a "Beverly Hills" zip code that has an endowment (MBA, Ensworth, Baylor)!!!! Their Athletic facilties are super!