Interesting from Joe Paterno

[VolunteerGeneral]

Here`s part of a post by 481 from the football board...

 

"Finally, I believe it was Joe Paterno that said in his book it is very difficult to find an athlete with the drive required to succeed at the Division 1 level that comes from an affluent family. A college education just doesn't mean the same to a student that knows his family is going to pay for it, as it does to the student that knows an athletic scholarship is his only way out."

 

Hmmmmmmmmmmmm.....I wonder if this holds true on the high school level as well? You`d have to think so.

 

Now who do I believe? One of the best college coaches or some whiners who say that affluent kids are just great athletes.

 

Ialk about things that make you go Hmmmmmmm!!!!!

[TheEgoHasLanded]

You would think that kids who werent born with everyone thing and had to work hard and really appreciate possesions would be able to work harder then kids from private schools who might take more things for granted.

[Chakra20]

Posted by TheEgoHasLanded:

You would think that kids who werent born with everyone thing and had to work hard and really appreciate possesions would be able to work harder then kids from private schools who might take more things for granted.

 

Well i will tell you this in my FAMILY we have a person that came from near poverty and made the most outta of their life. They said one of the most amazing things to me one day that i think holds true to this discussion.

"You Cant Blame where you came from or what has happened to you on your sucess today and tommorow". This was very inspiring to me and i think alot of people need to get rid of this ohh woe is me attitude and attack the world. It carries over into sports and to blame why we cant win on we dont have athletes we dont have the equipment etc... is a load of horse hooyey.

[ie3]

Chakra, VG,

May I offer a different perspective? Both of the statements you quoted are without a doubt correct to a point. Anyone can look around them and see individuals that prove that point. But, there is a flip side to those statements. In those not-so-affluent families, if there is a positive attitude about success, and a lack of willingness to accept defeat, the young people in them will most likely succeed. Conversely, if the young people grow up hearing that they have no chance, that there is no point to hard work, that the world is out to get them, then they most likely will fail. It is a matter of programming. Again, when speaking in generalities, there are cases that can disprove a point.

I look at my son's school, very small rural public school. Negligible weight room, no summer programs, and this year, only an interested party voluteering his spare time to be a trainer. Will they do well? Probably not. There are no expectations to do well on the part of the student body, most parents, the staff, and the community. You see, it's a basketball school, that is where the emphasis is.

Am I making excuses, "whining" in the words of others on these boards? No. Am I affluent, no. Neither am I poor. Does my education mean alot to me? I wouldn't have worked full time supporting my family while earning a degree if it didn't. I work in a factory, and see the differing attitudes everyday. I think I may have a bit of a different perspective on the attitudes of some of the kids than a lot of others here.

I see the better-off parents sending their kids to every camp imaginable, on every travelling team that is available. I also see many not-so-well-off parents scrapping every penny they can get just to buy their child some small piece of equipment that might keep them from getting injured.

We all can fall into the trap of generalizing to prove our idea of what the truth is. Just realize that everything may not fit into our neat little picture of reality. ELA is right, all the hard work in the world is no substitute for pure talent. However, all that the talent (without the hard work) will get you is a talented could have been.

 

And, may I say to all those on the other theads that keep quoting numbers of kids in college as a measure of the talent level of a team, remember that most of the small schools get totally ignored by the college recruiters. Even on a very bad team, there can be a couple of real gems.

[RealGoEagles]

That is the best post I've read on this board. This is not a black and white, good and bad, situation. There's an awful lot of gray here and we could ask the question to 100 different people and they would come back with 100 different solutions and even THOSE probably wouldn't solve things. But............ That being said.....

The bullets are live starting tomorrow night and we can forget this for at least three months. Good luck to all teams out there.

[scout]

ie3,

I agree with Realgo-a very thoughtful post. Please allow me to expand on your comments.

"...if the young people grow up hearing that they have no chance, that there is no point to hard work, that the world is out to get them, then they most likely will fail."

 

Well said. I grew up in a rural area. We were considered poor as were our neighbors. No TV or running water. Old beat up car. Hand made bats. You know the story. (Our family loves redneck jokes because they so colorfully describe our life. My favorite-You might be a redneck if your front porch collapses and kills more than five dogs).

 

But we were not poor! We didn't have any money but we had strong, loving family (big family with lots of cousins), great neighbors, great role models and "a positive attitude about success, and a lack of willingness to accept defeat".

 

Today, money is easier to come by. My kids go to private schools because it is the only place I where I find that "positive attitude about success, and a lack of willingness to accept defeat" in Metro Nashville. Even so, the culture my kids face says "that they have no chance, that there is no point to hard work, that the world is out to get them". They live in a big house, have seven TV's, and go to an expensive school. But in many respects, they have been born into a culture of proverty.

 

 

 

:confused: :confused: :confused: :confused: :confused: :confused:

[ELA]

Posted by ie3:

Chakra, VG,

May I offer a different perspective? Both of the statements you quoted are without a doubt correct to a point. Anyone can look around them and see individuals that prove that point. But, there is a flip side to those statements. In those not-so-affluent families, if there is a positive attitude about success, and a lack of willingness to accept defeat, the young people in them will most likely succeed. Conversely, if the young people grow up hearing that they have no chance, that there is no point to hard work, that the world is out to get them, then they most likely will fail. It is a matter of programming. Again, when speaking in generalities, there are cases that can disprove a point.

I look at my son's school, very small rural public school. Negligible weight room, no summer programs, and this year, only an interested party voluteering his spare time to be a trainer. Will they do well? Probably not. There are no expectations to do well on the part of the student body, most parents, the staff, and the community. You see, it's a basketball school, that is where the emphasis is.

Am I making excuses, "whining" in the words of others on these boards? No. Am I affluent, no. Neither am I poor. Does my education mean alot to me? I wouldn't have worked full time supporting my family while earning a degree if it didn't. I work in a factory, and see the differing attitudes everyday. I think I may have a bit of a different perspective on the attitudes of some of the kids than a lot of others here.

I see the better-off parents sending their kids to every camp imaginable, on every travelling team that is available. I also see many not-so-well-off parents scrapping every penny they can get just to buy their child some small piece of equipment that might keep them from getting injured.

We all can fall into the trap of generalizing to prove our idea of what the truth is. Just realize that everything may not fit into our neat little picture of reality. ELA is right, all the hard work in the world is no substitute for pure talent. However, all that the talent (without the hard work) will get you is a talented could have been.

 

And, may I say to all those on the other theads that keep quoting numbers of kids in college as a measure of the talent level of a team, remember that most of the small schools get totally ignored by the college recruiters. Even on a very bad team, there can be a couple of real gems.

 

ie3... very good post and perspective on the issue. It is a very complicated series of issues. The real answers will also be very complex and not everyone will agree with the outcome. Nevertheless, someone will have to make the hard choices and changes will be coming within two seasons. Thanks for your input.

[BDURHAM]

Volunteer General:

 

I would propose that the same type of young man a poster stated Joe Paterno said was more motivated than an affluent kid is the same type of kid that is excelling at private schools. For example, I know that one young man received a scholarship to Brentwood Academy, and went on to play college football. Paterno might say that this BA alumnus played harder because of the opportunities his education was providing.

 

Examples of athletes who excel at private schools are numerous. The best athletes at the private high school I attended where at the school on scholarship, and I enjoyed and benefited from their presence. I think scholarships are a valuable part of a private school's education, not simply what they (scholarships) mean to athletics.

 

Take the scholarship players away from most private schools, and the private school football teams will probably not be as successful. This is my opinion based on my own experience and on what I have seen and heard at other private schools.

[TheEgoHasLanded]

So why do 1a schools dominate why they do StannTrott?

 

And I think everyone who has half of a brain will agree that if you take the scholarships away from the kids the school won't be a good. Thats why there is a Division 2, so teams won't have to play against scholarship schools.

[VolunteerGeneral]

Posted by StanTrott:

Volunteer General:

 

I would propose that the same type of young man a poster stated Joe Paterno said was more motivated than an affluent kid is the same type of kid that is excelling at private schools. For example, I know that one young man received a scholarship to Brentwood Academy, and went on to play college football. Paterno might say that this BA alumnus played harder because of the opportunities his education was providing.

 

Examples of athletes who excel at private schools are numerous. The best athletes at the private high school I attended where at the school on scholarship, and I enjoyed and benefited from their presence. I think scholarships are a valuable part of a private school's education, not simply what they (scholarships) mean to athletics.

 

Take the scholarship players away from most private schools, and the private school football teams will probably not be as successful. This is my opinion based on my own experience and on what I have seen and heard at other private schools.

 

Stan...Do you realize that none of the private schools in 1A can give any type of financial aid to anyone who participates in sports?

 

Just wondering

VG