Does this seem right?

[sly]

CoachGonyeaSHS, I was looking at the TSSAA website and wanted to see what the breakdown was for the regions in wrestling. It showed the following:

Region

I. 13 teams

II. 20

III. 11

IV. 10

V. 22

VI. 18

VII. 18

VIII. 15

 

What if we took the existing regions as they are and adjusted the numbers something like this....Leave Region 1 as is; Region 2 move the 4 most southern schools(Greenback,Heritage,Maryville,and William Blount) into Region 3;Region 4 add 1 team from Region 3(Marion Co.)and 3 teams from Region 5(Franklin Co.,Tullahoma,and Warren Co.);leave region 6,7, and 8 as they are. Then the number of teams per region would look like this...

Region

I. 13 teams

II. 16

III. 14

IV. 14

V. 17

VI. 18

VII. 18

VIII. 15

(Of course, as new programs are started then these numbers would continue to change.)

I believe we've had the 16 and 24 man brackets for the state tournament in the past and that is the reason we're at a 32 man bracket now. It is in my opinion the best format for the DI state tournament. What ya think?

[Edited by sly on 2-6-03 1:03P]

[Edited by sly on 2-6-03 2:00P]

 

[timj]

[this was sent to me from ER Coach Brad Jackson]

 

Tim,

 

I got an e-mail about the brackets at our region. Please post this for me. I think everyone should know some of these facts. I do not know how to do this forum talk. HAHAH

 

 

To all wrestling coaches, fans, and other people interested in wrestling:

 

I do not read these articles that many people write about on these websites. Some are very controversial issues that I would prefer not to get into. People have very good arguments on both sides of very difficult issues. This is why and how all of us learn and grow. This might be the reason that I am not as well knowledged as many of you. And that I havent grown for many years except in my waist line which is very obvious. There has been a question about the Brackets in Region 4. I agree they are weak in numbers and quantity. But our region has been, and will still be very strong in quality. I do not have the time to research everything but I will put alot of money that our region is either at the top or close to it for many, many years in the state place finishers that we put out. There can be arguments about team scoring because of first round matches but there is really no argument about place finishers. I can argue that at the state duals the best 8 teams are not represented. I am sure that Al Miller feels this way at Cleveland. I know that I do. There will always be controversies over what is fair and what is not fair.

Once our region quits producing state champions like we have and place winners like we have, then those opponents can argue as much as they want. I will then agree with you 100 percent. Here are the facts:

 

2002 State Team Place Finishes

 

2. Soddy Daisy

5. East Ridge

10. Hixson

13. Red Bank

 

103-1st- Kyle James (SD)

112- 3rd Chris Brown (SD)

112 -5th- Tike Gooden (RB)

119-2nd- Justin Gooden (RB)

125-2nd-Matt Bird (ER)

130-2nd-John Lane (SD)

135-no one

140- 1st-Jimmy Frederick (ER)

140-5th-Jon Dress (Ool)

145 -1st- Jake Yost (SD)

152- no one

160-6th-Jonathan Sharp (Hix)

171-3rd-Matt Elliott (SD)

171-4th-Adam Rowe (Hix)

189 -1st- Matt Graham (ER)

215-4th-Andrew Strain (SD)

275 -3rd- Will Lynch (SD)

 

total-15

 

State Champs-4

Runnerups-3

Thirds-3

Fourths-2

Fifths-2

Sixths-1

 

2001 Team Finishes

 

2. Soddy Daisy

4. Red Bank

6. East Ridge

 

INdividual

 

1st-103 - Shawn Cordell (RB)

6th-112-Chris Brown (SD)

119 -5th- John Lane (SD)

119- 6th-Will Furman (RB)

119-2nd-Josh Craft (ER)

125 -1st- Darren McKnight (RB)

125- 3rd-Mat Bird (ER)

130 -5th- Jonathan Adams (SD)

135-4th-Jimmy Frederick (ER)

135-5th-Jeremy Gooden (RB)

140- 1st - Jake Yost (SD)

145-4th-Moose Smith (SD)

145-2nd-Andrew Carver (RB)

152-1st-Kevin Ward (SD)

160-No one

171-No one

189-no one

215-4th-Brian Arnold (SD)

275-6th-Parks Harding (ER)

 

totals-16

 

State Champions-4

Runnerups-2

Thirds-1

Fourths-3

Fifths-3

Sixths-3

 

Team Finishes 2000

3. Red Bank

7. Soddy Daisy

9. East Ridge

14. Hixson

 

Individuals

 

Total-15

 

State Champions-3

Runnerups-2

Thirds-0

Fourths-5

Fifths-2

Sixths-3

 

1999

 

Team finishes

 

2. Soddy Daisy

4. Red Bank

8. East Ridge

14. Hixson

 

Individuals (total 16)

 

State Champs-4

Runnerups-4

Thirds-3

Fourths-0

Fifths-4

Sixths-1

 

1998 Team Finishes

3. Soddy Daisy

4. Red Bank

17. East Ridge

 

Individuals (Total 12)

 

State Champions-3

Runner ups-2

Thirds-4

Fourths-1

Fifths-1

Sixths-1

 

I did find time to research this. I hope I didnt

offend anyone but the facts are here. I would be

willing to hear any arguments that someone might have.

Thanks for listening.

 

Coach Jackson

East Ridge High School

[sly]

This was a post I made before the start of this season regarding the success of all region at the individual state tournament.............

 

 

After reading several post concerning "regions"(and being bored) I decided to do a little research on how the regions performed at the state tournament and this is what I came up with.

 

These facts are complied from the results of the last 5 state tournaments posted on tssaa website.

 

Regions with the most top ten team finishes at the state: tournament.

R1-5

R2-2

R3-8

R4-14

R5-4

R6-6

R7-9

R8-5

Regions with the most top 5 team finishes at state:

R1-1

R2-1

R3-7

R4-9

R5-1

R6-2

R7-4

R8-0

Regions with the most team runner-ups at state:

R1-0

R2-0

R3-1

R4-3

R5-0

R6-1

R7-0

R8-0

Regions with the most team championships at state:

R1-0

R2-0

R3-4

R4-0

R5-0

R6-0

R7-1

R8-0

 

Like I said I was bored but thought this might be fun for some to read....sorry its sooooooo long. If you're not sure who is in what region you can go to www.tssaa.org and go to Clssifications for DI wrestling for the list.

[takedown3]

In the early the late '60's and '70's, Chattanooga teams would cannibalize themselves. With the most intense competition in the state, it was tough to send a large contingent to the state. Father Ryan would show up regularly with their entire team intact. What they lacked in quality, they made up in quantity. Chattanooga would dominate the individual champions. In 1969, Notre Dame had 4 individual champions and came in 2nd to a Father Ryan team with 2. FR had brought their entire team.

[Guest goodsport]

OK. Let's be realistic; Coach G has opened a can of worms that's been opened before, and no changes have been made. The Chattanooga area has a deserved reputation as the strongest wrestling area in Tennessee, but is that helping wrestling in the state?

 

When will some of the other schools in the area start programs? Or are we only concerned about the good programs getting better - or at least staying ahead of the pack. I saw on another post someone else asking what chance Copper Basin would have if they ever started a wrestling program. How many times has Lookout Valley ever made it to the state?

 

This same question has come up in the public/private debate. There is no way to level the playing field without artificially playing favorites. That's what has happened with Chattanooga wrestling. Playing favorites.

 

Call it what you want. When you have 20+ schools in one region and 10 in another, you're playing favorites. You can base that favoritism on any criterion you choose: past performance, etc. At least be intellectually honest enough to admit it.

 

Coach G asked an honest question, and regardless of the explanation (more state champions than anybody else) the Chattanooga area still seeks an advantage. Come on, if the wrestlers from Region 3 or 4 are going to place in the state, don't you think they'd qualify for the state from a 20 team region? Duhhhh!

[cchulk]

Are there any teams in this discussion that are volunteering to jump into Region 3 or 4? or do you just want to be heard?

[Guest somethingCLEVER]

i think that although it seems unfair to have the brackets so small,i think that region 4 is the toughest in the state.....its already been noted,but this region has east ridge,red bank,soddy daisy,and hixson.....i know as far as duals go,there is a changing of the guards in this region quite frequently because of the intense competition,whereas most other regions have teams that are shoe-ins for the state duals tournament.....as far as individual state is concerned,region four wrestlers always make noise at state,so,ill start complaining when region four wrestlers start taking other,better wrstlers place in the first round of the state tournament.....and on a side note,this is an unbiased opinion. im from nashville.....

[cw160]

You're right . Region 4 and 3 have the most state placers.

 

But you still didn't answer goodsport's questions:

1. aren't you playing favorites and giving an advantage to those regions.

2. if they win in region 4 now, don't you think they'd probably win in region 5?

 

I guess I hadn't thought about it that way before, but you are playing favorites. You just call it something else. I'm biased and from Nashville.

[timj]

ok region V coaches, send your requests in:

who wants to switch to region III?

-

-

-

and who wants to beef up region IV with your team?

-

-

-

 

none?

but i wouldn't be surprised if some of you wouldn't like to vote some OTHER teams out of your region down to chattanooga, tho.

[gumbi1031]

Looking at the stats concerning state placing teams, Region 7 seems to be closest to regions 3 and 4 despite having 18 teams. Region 7 (containing Clarksville High and Kenwood, both ranked teams) would do much better at the state tournament if there were fewer teams because the top teams in the region would have easier first round draws. As it is now, a Clarksville or Kenwood wrestler who might finish first or second in a weaker region will finish third or fourth. It makes an impact on state scoring, and makes the gap between Bradley, Cleveland, Soddy, and everybody else look that much bigger. It is also difficult to make a program better when half the season is spent wrestling the same regional teams year after year when a region 3 or 4 team can schedule a variety of opponents. I know there is no clear answer to the problem, but as it stands there are the haves and have-nots in Tennessee wrestling, and it will remain that way until the sport gains some popularity and tradition in this state.

[sly]

No you won't find any takers for moving into region 3 or 4. What they really want is to combine region 3 and 4 so we can beat on each other, something they obviously haven't been able to do. While we're at it we might as well bring Clarksville, Brentwood, Overton and Houston into the same region too. Lets move all the top teams into the same region and according to the thinking of some that should make wrestling better for our state???????????????????? If numbers are the real issue then all that is needed is to move a few teams from region 2 and 5 into regions 3 and 4 and we would solve the numbers issue, but what I am reading is that for the rest of the state to get better then the Chattanooga area teams are supposed do their dirty work for them and beat each other up before the state tournament. Good luck at state.

[CoachGonyeaSHS]

Smyrna would jump at the opportunity to join region IV. Although we would probably get slaughtered the first couple of years, we would free up our schedule with fewer region matches and thus be allowed to wrestle more dates that don't necessarily involve region teams, not to mention we would get to wrestle these high quality teams in region IV that probably wouldn't put us on their schedule unless we were in their region. There is no doubt that region IV has more strength...I still say that having fewer teams in your region allows you the luxury of being able to fill your schedule up with teams all over the state or out of state if you choose. But when you have to wrestle 21 teams just in your region, your looking at taking up major chunks of the 20 dates allowed, not to mention a major portion of our budget due to all the travel involved with just region teams.

 

Middle TN is really starting to grow in this sport. We finally are getting wrestling coaches rather than Football coaches who use wrestling as a conditioning tool for their next season. We just want to be able to compete and are looking at all aspects of the sport.

[Edited by CoachGonyeaSHS on 2-6-03 11:19P]