itzme

Pretty much like all other no-rev sports at the next level. Great to see the growth of interest and excellence in TN high schools. Hopefully it never becomes a TSSAA sport and gets ruined!!

Thanks for the correction and information Redtwin. Were most of these in recent (as in past 5) years for the DI schools? Were they walk-on, partial or full scholly for the most part? Interesting about the DII v. DIII comparison. I was not aware of that either. Just trying to learn more.

If I'm not mistaken (which I could be) these guys would be the first from Tennessee to earn scholarships to DI Lacrosse programs. Is that right?

BRBB, you and Itzme can't even recognize when someone agrees with part of what you say. You just want to argue because you don't get total concessions. That actually was part of the problem the independent school leaders had in 1996 -- they had no appreciation for the fact that the actions of a couple of prominent independent schools were soiling their arguments for eliminating the quotas altogether. I got off of this board before because I was tired of exchanges like this. I think I will do so again. Politics is more interesting. Rick, don't gin up a false argument. Another nice piece of "flair", but disingenuous. Please point out where I was arguing for a change. I know better than that. No change will occur, except that which already has; i.e. a thawing of relations enough so that some publics are willing to play some privates. My posts were simply to point out the absurd contention that this was in any way a compromise in the common usage of that word. It was a very one-sided "compromise". I really don't have major issues with the current set up, as long as the DII teams aren't forced to travel 100's of miles to play a mediocre team in the preseason. I hope that eventually even Riverdale, Brentwood and even Maryville will come around and recognize that playing against the DII teams on a regular basis is not only good for their teams, but a lot of fun for their kids and communities as well. As for a full and complete reunion in the postseason, it will never happen

I think my analogy holds up. Thanks for playing.

I didn't think so much of Mr. Exum's opinion piece. He has been a bit sloppy with the facts in order to support his opinion. Some facts he missed: (1) there is one voting member of the TSSAA Legislative Council who is from a private school, Steve Harris of FRA; (2) there are several "ex officio" members of the Legislative Council and Board of Control who sit at the table and have equal input at meetings, although they do not have a vote, and one of those is a representative chosen by the independent schools; (3) there is a separate Division II Committee that meets regularly and provides input and recommendations to the Board of Control and the Legislative Council; (4) there are no independent school heads on the Board of Control in part because they do not seek a position -- these are elected positions, and the only way to get elected is to run; (5) there have been four occasions when independent school heads have run for positions on the Board of Control, and they won two of the four times; (6) there have been women who served on the Legislative Council or Board of Control, but again to do so one must run for election -- TSSAA does not appoint the members of these bodies, they are member school administrators who run for election within the nine geographic districts from which they are chosen; (7) there have been any number of African-American members of the Board of Control. He also is a little bit unfair with his criticism of TSSAA related to the creation of Division II. Before Division II was created, TSSAA had a "quota rule" that limited the number of student-athletes receiving need-based financial aid who would be eligible in the various sports. The quota rule actually originated with independent schools to deal with concerns that the larger and better financed independent schools would use financial aid to lure students away from the independent schools that were not as well financed. Over the years, the financial aid and quota rule issues became problematic for public and independent schools alike. The dominance of a couple of private schools in football (and to a lesser degree wrestling) led some public school principals to complain that financial aid was being used to lure talented athletes away from the public schools. At the same time, a number of private schools were complaining that the limitation of the quota rule was unfair because it forced students and their families to choose between aid and participation in a school activity, and it also was contrary to the missions of those schools to have broad participation among their students in interscholastic athletics. There were a number of "committee" meetings to address these issues in the early 1990s, but they made little progress. Eventually the loudest proponents of the various positions on these issues became more and more vocal, finding whatever ammunition they could to support their positions -- the position of some public school heads that there should be complete separation between public and private schools for athletics, and the position of some independent school heads that there should be no restrictions on the number of students who could receive need-based aid and participate in athletics. Ultimately, the creation of the Division II classification was a compromise of sorts, designed to avoid the extreme consequences of either position. There would be separation of sorts (although the schools still could compete in the regular season by choice) between schools that give need-based aid to students who participate in athletics and those that do not, and there would be no more quotas for those schools that went to Division II. This is not the best of results, not fully satisfactory to anyone, but that is in essence the definition of a compromise. It is something that no one fully likes but everyone can manage to live with. And it seems better than either of the more extreme alternatives would have been for the mass of member schools, both public and independent, that comprise the TSSAA. Personally, I would like to see the exploration of other more creative alternatives to facilitate bringing and keeping the various types of schools together rather than splitting them up. But in the meantime, I just don't think Mr. Exum's criticism of TSSAA, while offered with some journalistic flair, is justified or based in fact. Wow. I guess one could term the creation of DII a "compromise" in the same sense that it's a compromise when an armed robber draws a gun, walks up to someone and demands "your money or your life", then the victim gives them their money. Hey...they didn't choose to give them their life, so it was a compromise. Nice try Rick. Your rebuttal was rendered with some nice flair, reminiscent of what might be heard in a courtroom, but gives a truly inaccurate picture of what actually happened. The aid granting schools were forced into DII, against their will.

By the way, the correct usage is PPS, not PSS. Post means after, script means writing. Wouldn't want anyone wandering onto this thread to think we DII supporters aren't well educated.

1 post. Nice start.

Good luck to both teams. Great memories will be built, win or lose. ...and Roll Red Roll!! you can faint now

Public television. Guess that figures for DII.

USAToday is deemed most important because more people read it by far. There are no truly "accurate" high school football polls. Simply no way to compare that many teams in different parts of the country. Fun, nonetheless, and a source of pride for teams and fans. Any team that is ranked at all in any of these polls is pretty darned good!

First of all welcome to Williamson County, you'll find the Brentwood announcer to be "BRILLIANT" You'll see what I mean by this .haha He needs to chill out, and they need to turn the volume down just a bit on their PA. It's as loud as LP field, and I can hear him a mile away, even though I don't want to.

That is a good burger, but going to The Rendevous for ribs is a must for me in Memphis. Either way, you can't go wrong. Enjoy the meal, because I think the game is going to be not too great of an experience for the Irish faithful. I'm pulling for the Nashville boys, but MUS is the real deal this year.

that's murderers' row right there....there was some talent on the field that day. Tom Santi was a 4-year starter at UVA and at one point was on the Colts' roster. Fisher went on to a successful baseball career at GA Tech, and spent time in the Braves organization. I always that Koban was one of the great RB's of this decade and he was a BACK UP in that game. Obviously that MBA team peaked the following year. Interesting that Kent Austin was an assistant on that team. He's now OC at Ole Miss (and had quite the weekend I might add). Yeah, that MBA team the following year was very, very good. I believe they were ranked in the top 5 nationally by USAToday until...well...you know! Kent Austin clearly has a future as a DI head coach. Made Lane's daddy look pretty 1980's.

I certainly remember that 2002 game, and not too fondly. That one came down to who was hungrier. I have never seen a Carlton Flatt coached team so overconfident and under-prepared. Although I don't think that upset was quite as shocking as the one last Friday, both of those teams were much better and more talented than any team in the state this season, including MUS. If you look at those rosters and see how many of those guys ended up playing DI football at the next level, it's pretty amazing. BA alone had 6 DI signees from that senior class, I believe. I do not see how those teams could have been much better than MUS, at least according to the current rankings. MUS is now ranked #10 in the nation according to Rivals. I have great respect for this year's MUS team...they are very good. But take a look at these rosters... http://www.tssaa.org/2002Champions/Stat ... osters.pdf Just on BA's team, 7 offensive starters, 6 defensive starters (albeit a few going two ways), and 3 kicking game players played DI in college. Most played at very good programs (Auburn, Alabama, Nebraska, etc.) and started. Ironically, maybe the most talented player on that team was David Holbert, who never got much of a chance to play at UT due to some decimating injuries. The best kicking game in the state of Tennessee that year was BA's...and I'm including the Titans in that comparison. Trust me...a very talented team. That BA team was more talented than MUS this year, (not even claiming they would beat them...just more talented) and MBA's 2002 team was far more talented than the 2009 version. I'll let some Big Red booster let you know where there guys went.

I certainly remember that 2002 game, and not too fondly. That one came down to who was hungrier. I have never seen a Carlton Flatt coached team so overconfident and under-prepared. Although I don't think that upset was quite as shocking as the one last Friday, both of those teams were much better and more talented than any team in the state this season, including MUS. If you look at those rosters and see how many of those guys ended up playing DI football at the next level, it's pretty amazing. BA alone had 6 DI signees from that senior class, I believe.

The rep still exists. Personally, I don't care - I'd say most programs have a nitpick or two about how they play the game - but that is still considered to be a calling card in many circles. In fact, as an MUS fan, you may appreciate this. If memory serves, another fan told me on this board that CBHS and FRHS were in a tussle a few years ago (some time within the past five years) and, after yet another play in which FRHS had some extracurricular activity, a CBHS player pulled a FRHS player aside and said, "You guys give all of us Catholics a bad name." Right story...wrong schools. It was a Catholic player for BA that said that to a CBHS player. Ryan does have that same rep however. I just thought that was a very funny anecdote, and the BA player that told me thought it was pretty funny too. Stuff happens in football games. Not that big a deal.

I write from long and usually bitter experience. Overlooking the Big Red is not a wise thing to do. BTW...some of y'all should re-read your posts here. Embarrassing. Do you even recognize what elitist jerks you come across as? Have some pride.

We use ultrasounds...get with the program loser!

They're the best. Win or lose, just pure hospitality and class.

That obnoxious commie is still here. You need to to read more often.

Amen brother! Sometimes feels like a prison riot on the DII board. We may be fighting tooth and nail in here while the rest of the world really is oblivious.

#! - MUS v. CBHS. Great rivalry, one awesome team against one excellent team. #2 - MBA v. BA. Great rivalry. Two good teams.

MBA doesn't "let kids in for academic reasons" like Ensworth does, thus, having to actually qualify and meet the same standards as everyone else that chooses to apply, I don't think Orleans would be accepted. Okey-Dokey!

I think most people understand what you are saying, and you are right. The point of independent school education is that every school is different. We certainly need to respect and celebrate what each school has to offer.