Best Coach in the State?

[raider rumble]

Being a bradley fan all my life and having an open mind about this discussion, i can see both sides to this. here is my problem with this though: is it fair to wrestle guys that are being recruited to baylor or Mccallie that are nicer than most colleges and known around the world. Not only that, bradley has had guys to go through there school systems to have one of these schools give a scholarship to a kid to play a sport and they are not offering a JV kid this same oppurtunity. here is an example: if given the same oppurtunity to have a full ride to nebraska or carson-newman where would you go. there is so many advantages by going to nebraska. this is why the ncaa has set divisons for these kinds of things. on the other hand, i myself never got to wrestle phillip simpson who has raised the bar of wrestling in the state of tennessee. me and phillip have known each other for a long time. He won the state the same year as i did at 135. does it tarnish our accomplishments. NO thats the cards we were delt and we did what we had to do. when i look back on it I know it could have changed the outcome for one of us.(probably me) but it something to see guys i have wrestled or watched do so well in college. Also dont get me wrong cause not all of the best wrestlers were recruited (to my knowledge).

 

Al Morris

Coffee County Wrestling

[walkenvol]

Al - I think you've expressed a reasonable argument for the side that supports the split in the D1/D2 state tourneys. If I conceded to you that your assumption concerning "athletic scholarships" were true (which I only know that to be false with myself and the fellow parents who sacrificed to finance that same tuition who had children attending with my children) would you still refuse a dual meet with those same schools, especially if you had the better team anyway? Can I assume that you're not in favor of opening up the TN D1 state tourney to teams from VA, but you would still travel to VA to dual with those same teams. Why would you wrestle a team from GA or any team not in the D1 state tourney? This is why logically it is hard for a non-Bradleyite to understand. I loved your hard nosed style when you were competing and would have really enjoyed watching you strap it up with Geismer or Krug of Baylor or Finnel or Hagan of McC. Those would have been the matches you remembered today in place of those hundreds of guys who didn't make it past 1 minute with you. I watched you play football against McCallie while in HS? How was that different? If it had been your choice to make when you were in HS, I'd find it hard to believe that you would have not been in favor of those dual meets.

[Brickhousechick]

Chick,

 

Thank you for the reasoned discussion. I agree with the majority of your points.

 

Einstein knew math, but that knowledge alone didn’t make him a great teacher. A great teacher has a passion to transfer their knowledge to the student and can inspire the student to want to learn. In sport, that knowledge transfer typically takes place during practice. All coaches hold in season practices – that’s what they’re paid to do. The better coaches are great communicators and stay current with the sport’s evolving techniques and training methods. IMHO, the best coaches are the ones who give this same effort out of season when they’re not being hired to do so. Shane Turner does more of this then anyone the walkenvol knows. Wendel Weathers is working hard to create opportunities also.

 

Certainly, a coach can do negative things that tarnish his efforts. You ask if I feel that the Legman should be ranked with the coaches named? I have no clue. I’ve never attended one of his practices and I don’t know the extent of his out of season efforts. When I occasionally run into him, he’s never been anything less then cordial to me. There have been some outstanding wrestlers graduate from the Bradley program under his watch and the Bear nation appear to be very happy with him so as stated before - he must of done a whole lot of things right. Based on his quotes in the papers and on this board, I would venture a guess that he would consider it an insult to be ranked with some of those coaches named and based on what I know I would agree with him.

 

You also asked if not wrestling the private schools lowers his status – from my perspective yes. I understand that he has some specific beefs with 2 of those programs and took a firm stance but from my perspective the ramifications of those actions were not to the benefit of his wrestlers, wrestling in the Chattanooga area in general, and lastly his program’s reputation. Like you, I don’t agree with the folks who paint that stance as “dodging the competition” and the examples of other tough opponents on the schedule validate that point. Those dual meets would have been memories that your sons would have carried a lifetime and it’s a shame that the men involved can’t find the common ground to make them happen. The privates will line up for the opportunity to dual Bradley, but the Bradley staff chose not to allow those events to happen. The D1/D2 split is a completely different issue and no wrestling coach can put that humpty dumpty back together again.

 

The one Chick point with which I don’t agree is that “people just can’t get by the fact that Bradley has been the benchmark”. The folks I know feel just the opposite and respect the Bear program for setting the bar. The single issue they don’t respect is the refusal to dual Bay/McC. Surely you can admit that those events would be enormously more exciting/competitive then mopping the mat with the Rhea and Daltons (no offense intended) of the world?

 

I can GUARANTEE you that Logsdon was a Great teacher of life as well as wrestling. He talked to his wrestlers regularly about being citizens on and off the mat and lived what he preached. He does not drink, smoke, is a model husband and father(which is why he is not coaching today). In other words all the Coachspeak that all coaches say he actually abides by. He lives what most of us talk about to our kids. He has had a tremendous impact on his wrestlers lives. His wrestlers have many memories. They visit him and call him on a regular, almost weekly basis. Guys like Keller and Blackmon still consult him very often. He has more respect than almost any one I know with kids.

 

He is a guy who lives his life as mentioned and lives by his principals regardless of opinion.

 

I do understand that many disagree with the principle he stood by. But he took what he believed was a correct stand and had the guts to stand by his belief.

 

His wrestlers got more than most get from a coach as far as what I have seen and I have heard none of them lament their experience. No wrestler from Bradley has ever mentioned to my knowledge that "Man, Im glad I wrestled but gee, I'll always regret I didnt wrestle McCallie or Baylor." It just wasnt as important to Bradley fans or wrestlers as it was to the rest of you all this time. They knew what kind of a Coach and person they had leading them, and they were extremely thankful that guy was Steve Logsdon. Its others who were not involved in the program and could not see what those inside saw who complained.

 

He touched many lives, lives his life with high morals and many kids look at him as a role model and consult him often. He turned many average wrestlers and average teams into state champions.

 

He just didnt wrestle D2.

Edited December 12, 2005 by Brickhousechick

[walkenvol]

That's certainly a glowing endorsement for a coach to get from a parent of one of his wrestlers, but I don't recall where those issues were being questioned. Consider yourself fortunate as I wish I could offer the same for someone from our experience. You asked if in the general public's perspective did refusing to wrestle D2 taint his accomplishments. Obviously to the Bradley faithful the answer would be a great big NO, but to those not to have been on the receiving end of his leadership then the answer is probably a small yes, just a little bit. I seriously doubt the Legman cares a lick how the non-Bradley faithful view his tenure.

 

I submit the same question to you. If you were the decision maker would you dual Bay/McC? If not, can you offer a logical reason that will help folks understand so as to bring to an end this biweekly argument that keeps popping up? Do you think your sons would have enjoyed being a part of the event - would it have been one of those fun memorable matches like a state duals? Remember, we're not talking abut the D1/D2 split - only a dual meet.

[Brickhousechick]

That's certainly a glowing endorsement for a coach to get from a parent of one of his wrestlers, but I don't recall where those issues were being questioned. Consider yourself fortunate as I wish I could offer the same for someone from our experience. You asked if in the general public's perspective did refusing to wrestle D2 taint his accomplishments. Obviously to the Bradley faithful the answer would be a great big NO, but to those not to have been on the receiving end of his leadership then the answer is probably a small yes, just a little bit. I seriously doubt the Legman cares a lick how the non-Bradley faithful view his tenure.

 

I submit the same question to you. If you were the decision maker would you dual Bay/McC? If not, can you offer a logical reason that will help folks understand so as to bring to an end this biweekly argument that keeps popping up? Do you think your sons would have enjoyed being a part of the event - would it have been one of those fun memorable matches like a state duals? Remember, we're not talking abut the D1/D2 split - only a dual meet.

 

Your right he probably doesent give a lick.

 

My son might enjoy it but he would also enjoy a newer car and a million bucks but he does not have it and is not consumed by it as the current experiences are many and fulfilling.

I did not live the personal experiences that Coach Logsdon did. Had I, I could answer your question about whether I would have or not. Humpty Dumpty that you referred to earlier broke for ethics reasons and someone took a stand. I may have done the same had I been faced with it but can not tell you for sure.

But I do know that I respect Coach Morgan and Coach Connell despite them having some of the advantages that others dont. I would not allow that to tarnish their accomplishments one bit in my mind.

[MasterBlaster 1]

So when does Little WV hit the HS mats?

[raider rumble]

Al - I think you've expressed a reasonable argument for the side that supports the split in the D1/D2 state tourneys. If I conceded to you that your assumption concerning "athletic scholarships" were true (which I only know that to be false with myself and the fellow parents who sacrificed to finance that same tuition who had children attending with my children) would you still refuse a dual meet with those same schools, especially if you had the better team anyway? Can I assume that you're not in favor of opening up the TN D1 state tourney to teams from VA, but you would still travel to VA to dual with those same teams. Why would you wrestle a team from GA or any team not in the D1 state tourney? This is why logically it is hard for a non-Bradleyite to understand. I loved your hard nosed style when you were competing and would have really enjoyed watching you strap it up with Geismer or Krug of Baylor or Finnel or Hagan of McC. Those would have been the matches you remembered today in place of those hundreds of guys who didn't make it past 1 minute with you. I watched you play football against McCallie while in HS? How was that different? If it had been your choice to make when you were in HS, I'd find it hard to believe that you would have not been in favor of those dual meets.

just curious are you saying athletic scholarships are not given. It doesn't bother me either way, i will wrestle anybody, any where, i have a first year team traveling to baylor this year against the #1 team in the state. thats just how i am. in my mind coach steve logsdon has always had his team in position for the best. he did what he believes in and he did it. i would never question his motives and i wouldn't want any of my wrestlers to question me. this is the first time i have ever said anything about this but its up to the captain to make that call. some people believe in a different religion, does that make them a bad person for choosing to make a stand. if anything, i believe that we should commend coach logsdon for standing so strong and taking the heat he did for it. as for the football thing i know there were a few out of state players on that team. where was penn garvich from.. he was a play maker...

Edited December 13, 2005 by raider rumble

[intothechance]

coach morris you're rubbing off on us...im ready to wrestle baylor...the 28th is marked on my calendar

[Sommers]

BillVol

post Dec 8 2005 - 09:00 PM

Post #29

Camper

Sommers: Curious about the "Blosser - Hixson" next to your name. That wouldn't be Mike Blosser, would it? Mike Blosser, who pinned his way through the state championships in 1982, winning state tourney best wrestler that year, was a buddy of mine back at Hixson. Mike Blosser could have kicked my butt in about 1/10th of a second had I ever made the foolish decision to fight him for whatever reason, but he was the nicest guy you would ever meet. A real gentleman and credit to the sport of wrestling. We actually used to hit tennis a lot and he was pretty good. I remember he went on to BYU to wrestle.

Yep, that would be my little brother. Good memory!! I got him started in 4th grade. Pat Murphy was most influential as was Jonathan Smith. Coached Martino and Copeland were great supports. You may remember me as David Blosser, now grandpa.

 

BTW, Mike just took Natl's in Jiu Jitsu 2004 and Pan AM 3rd place. Now at age 41.

[walkenvol]

Chick – I’m trying hard to understand but you didn’t give me much to work with on that last post. I still believe if you could share a sound logical reason for not having those duals, then you wouldn’t get those biweekly frustrating posts on the subject. People tend to question things they don’t understand. I respectfully disagree with your point that the D1/D2 split resulted from an ethics violation in wrestling. The D1/D2 split is for all sports and most agree was driven by football and I predict will ultimately result in even non financial aid privates being pushed into D2 if they continue to capture too many state titles. The referenced ethics violation resulted in the death penalty for the violating program, but again what does any of this have to do with having those dual meets today? Surely the Bear program is driven by what is best for the athletes today, not the personal experiences of the prior coach 15 years ago. Originally, the Bears continued to compete with Bay and Notre Dame so the stand wasn’t to not wrestle the privates. It must have been to only not wrestle the ethics violators. At some point the policy evolved to include not wrestling Bay also. As I see it, all that is water under the bridge now when it comes to explaining the merits of not having those dual meets today.

 

BTW – Are you saying that the Blue’s TSSAA death penalty doesn’t tarnish your view of their coach’s accomplishments?

[rawn]

Some folks can't quit throwing chairs.

Thats the truth! Edited December 13, 2005 by rawn

[walkenvol]

Al – The TSSAA rules are online for anyone to read and they are clear that for an athlete to be eligible to compete in D2, they can only receive aid on a financial need basis. I know there is a current Baylor wrestler who is ineligible because he is on an academic scholarship so the rules must be enforced in some manner. If you are implying that the rules are systematically skirted then I can only say in my experience that is not the case. If you know its happening then it should be reported to the TSSAA and based on how they dealt with the Blue in 1994, they must take their rules very seriously. As for Penn, I don’t know his history.

 

It is rare that a coach enjoys a smooth tenure without being a good leader. From my studies and life experiences, leaders don’t tend to be very successful with the “I’m in charge so do what I say without question” attitude. The most successful leaders that I’ve known and worked for had the ability to communicate a vision/mission and inspire you to partner with them toward accomplishing that vision. The best ones were humble and open but still relentless toward moving forward. If your wrestlers don’t understand, you should want them to question you in an appropriate manner so that you can help them understand the reasoning of your actions. If your reasoning is sound, you’ll save yourself a lot of heartache.