Question for 1A fans that want a split

[Indian]

Being able to deny admission to any individual puts the Division I privates much closer to a McCallie, Baylor, than to any public. Seq had a student move in this year, I understand he was a good football player at his former school, but didn't have the grades from his former school to even take part in a first practice. If that student had applied for Boyd, I'm sure the grades would have led to a rejection, but here he is at Seq, affecting school test scores and not contributing anything on the football field.

Edited December 19, 2006 by Indian

[G-ville]

Whats Flatt's agenda? He's now retired?

The problem w/ small private schools is they want to be like BA,Ensworth and MBA Mon thru Thurs and on Friday nite they wanna play Red Boiling Springs and Perry Co.!

[derek782]

Being able to deny admission to any individual puts the Division I privates much closer to a McCallie, Baylor, than to any public. Seq had a student move in this year, I understand he was a good football player at his former school, but didn't have the grades from his former school to even take part in a first practice. If that student had applied for Boyd, I'm sure the grades would have led to a rejection, but here he is at Seq, affecting school test scores and not contributing anything on the football field.

 

 

Having gone to Boyd I'll use them as my example:

Not being able to give financial aid, having average facilities, needing lots of volunteer parents to make any sports program go, having one gym for Jv girls, boys and varsity girls and boys, not having lights on a baseball field, needing the best athletes in the school to play every single sport so that any one sport can be competitive, and having coaches that are paid less than public coaches makes us a whole lot more like Sequatchie than we are McCallie.

 

In fact it could be argued that Sequatchie has several advantages over Boyd. Much better facilities (a great gym I played in a couple of times back in the day), and higher paid coaches are a couple that come to mind.

[Indian]

This conversation is beginning to go in the direction of "Why private schools do not want a total split" and I honestly believe we all know why.

 

 

Yes, imagine a team's winning percentage after going from a mostly public division into an all-private league. Look at Notre Dame, struggled in Division II but have had good success in Division I, 3A-and that's playing up a class because of the multiplier. I find it hard to believe a potential Division II small class final four of Friendship, Jackson Christian, Goodpasture and Knoxvile Catholic would have been so awful, for those teams, their fans or anyone wanting to watch good football played between similar schools. And like I've said before, with enough teams in Division II, logical classifications and regions could be formed, so "we'd have to play Brentwood Academy" wouldn't be an excuse.

[derek782]

Whats Flatt's agenda? He's now retired?

The problem w/ small private schools is they want to be like BA,Ensworth and MBA Mon thru Thurs and on Friday nite they wanna play Red Boiling Springs and Perry Co.!

 

 

I would love to hear some evidence on your theory that small privates want "to be like BA, Ensworth, and MBA". I know at the small private I went to the administration did lots of things to make sure the school was different from the big privates in the mission and goals of the school. I think that is an unfair and uninformed statement to make.

[Indian]

Having gone to Boyd I'll use them as my example:

Not being able to give financial aid, having average facilities, needing lots of volunteer parents to make any sports program go, having one gym for Jv girls, boys and varsity girls and boys, not having lights on a baseball field, needing the best athletes in the school to play every single sport so that any one sport can be competitive, and having coaches that are paid less than public coaches makes us a whole lot more like Sequatchie than we are McCallie.

 

In fact it could be argued that Sequatchie has several advantages over Boyd. Much better facilities (a great gym I played in a couple of times back in the day), and higher paid coaches are a couple that come to mind.

 

 

None of those things mentioned prevent Boyd-Buchanan from achieving great success on the fields and courts. You hit the nail on the head about needing the best athletes in the school to play, and I'm sure they do play. Compare that to public schools, when it's an achievement to get some to show up in the morning.

[derek782]

None of those things mentioned prevent Boyd-Buchanan from achieving great success on the fields and courts. You hit the nail on the head about needing the best athletes in the school to play, and I'm sure they do play. Compare that to public schools, when it's an achievement to get some to show up in the morning.

 

 

How do lesser facilites and lower paid coaches not directly effect perfromance on the field? Furthermore their have been lots of athletes through the years at Boyd who have only played one sport or not participated at all and sports have suffered because of it. When Boyd was good at basketball they were terrible in football and when football got good the basketball team has been pretty average since. Baseball has always been a rollercoaster, good some years, terrible others. I'm sure thats how it is at the publics of similiar size. Unless the best athletes participate in every sport other sports will suffer. Back to my original point, this makes small privates similar to publics because they have a lot of hurdles to jump. BA and McCallie don't have to deal with these issues b/c they have kids there to participate in specific sports year in and year out.

[G-ville]

Maybe you didnt have to wear the plaid skirts and the knee-high stockings, but your school does try to lure all the best talent.

I have a feeling Sequoayah can't compare to this list:

 

Player High School Sport College

Emily Broyles Boyd Buchanan Softball Chattanooga State

Chris Charles Boyd Buchanan Baseball Union CC,AL

Brittany Easton Boyd Buchanan Softball UT-Chattanooga

Matt Hale Boyd Buchanan Football UT-Chattanooga

Ryan Headden Boyd Buchanan Baseball Chattanooga State

Will Healy Boyd Buchanan Football Air Force Academy

Savannah Helton Boyd Buchanan Softball Carson-Newman

Brittany Hendon Boyd Buchanan Softball Covenant College

Jessica Ives Boyd Buchanan Softball Middle Tennessee

Kaiti Kelley Boyd Buchanan Softball Chattanooga State CC

Chris Payne Boyd Buchanan Football Austin Peay

Matt Peardon Boyd Buchanan Football Austin Peay

Andrew Pritchard Boyd Buchanan Men's Soccer Freed-Hardeman University

Brittany Thomas Boyd Buchanan Softball Covenant College

Ben Wilson Boyd Buchanan Baseball Lee University

Jenny Yother Boyd Buchanan Softball Tennessee Wesleyan

[derek782]

Maybe you didnt have to wear the plaid skirts and the knee-high stockings, but your school does try to lure all the best talent.

I have a feeling Sequoayah can't compare to this list:

 

Player High School Sport College

Emily Broyles Boyd Buchanan Softball Chattanooga State

Chris Charles Boyd Buchanan Baseball Union CC,AL

Brittany Easton Boyd Buchanan Softball UT-Chattanooga

Matt Hale Boyd Buchanan Football UT-Chattanooga

Ryan Headden Boyd Buchanan Baseball Chattanooga State

Will Healy Boyd Buchanan Football Air Force Academy

Savannah Helton Boyd Buchanan Softball Carson-Newman

Brittany Hendon Boyd Buchanan Softball Covenant College

Jessica Ives Boyd Buchanan Softball Middle Tennessee

Kaiti Kelley Boyd Buchanan Softball Chattanooga State CC

Chris Payne Boyd Buchanan Football Austin Peay

Matt Peardon Boyd Buchanan Football Austin Peay

Andrew Pritchard Boyd Buchanan Men's Soccer Freed-Hardeman University

Brittany Thomas Boyd Buchanan Softball Covenant College

Ben Wilson Boyd Buchanan Baseball Lee University

Jenny Yother Boyd Buchanan Softball Tennessee Wesleyan

 

Success isn't a basis for the split. If so you guys should want Trousdale Co, Alcoa, Knox Fulton, Maryville, and Riverdale all out of competition as well.

 

As for the list of athletes...impressive research G-ville. These are all very recent too. Unfortunately for your argument I know that at least 10 of these folks attended the school in elementary. The number is probably higher than that but I have a few years on these people and don't know all of them personally. So are you saying that we lure this talent in when they are 5 or 6 years old???? If the folks at Boyd have that good of an eye for talent they need to get out of education and go be scouts in the NFL because I promise you they would make a lot more money.

Edited December 19, 2006 by derek782

[Grunt]

This conversation is beginning to go in the direction of "Why private schools do not want a total split" and I honestly believe we all know why.

 

 

True, but they don't seem to be able to provide an answer directly.

 

Indirectly, they are saying they don't want to be in DII, because they would

be at a disadvantage. Same thing the publics are saying about them. Ok

for the publics to put up with it, but heaven forbid if they have to.

Truth is, if they were all put in DII, they would be in separate classifications

according to size, so no problem there.

They chose to go private, but complain about expenses, taxes, etc.Goes

with the territory. Should have looked before you leaped. They want the cake

& eat it too. Another thing they fail to mention about transfers, recruiting,

or whatever label makes it sound better, is the fact that when you get a

quality athlete at a private, you are taking away one from a public.

Edited December 19, 2006 by Grunt

[FadePattern]

Yes, imagine a team's winning percentage after going from a mostly public division into an all-private league. Look at Notre Dame, struggled in Division II but have had good success in Division I, 3A-and that's playing up a class because of the multiplier. I find it hard to believe a potential Division II small class final four of Friendship, Jackson Christian, Goodpasture and Knoxvile Catholic would have been so awful, for those teams, their fans or anyone wanting to watch good football played between similar schools. And like I've said before, with enough teams in Division II, logical classifications and regions could be formed, so "we'd have to play Brentwood Academy" wouldn't be an excuse.

 

 

True, but they don't seem to be able to provide an answer directly.

 

Indirectly, they are saying they don't want to be in DII, because they would

be at a disadvantage. Same thing the publics are saying about them. Ok

for the publics to put up with it, but heaven forbid if they have to.

Truth is, if they were all put in DII, they would be in separate classifications

according to size, so no problem there.

They chose to go private, but complain about expenses, taxes, etc.Goes

with the territory. Should have looked before you leaped. They want the cake

& eat it too. Another thing they fail to mention about transfers, recruiting,

or whatever label makes it sound better, is the fact that when you get a

quality athlete at a private, you are taking away one from a public.

 

And that gentlemen is thereason they do not want the split. They are all in competition with each other. The same people that claim that publics fear playing good competetion are the same people that fear facing it in and out week after week if they got put in an all private division. Why do you think that Davidson Acad. chose to go Div. II when they saw that the multiplier would most likely place them in the GCS, Ezell, FRA, CPA, DCA et al. league. (no slam against DA's accomplishments). Why are Ezell and FRA considering the same move. The multiplier did hurt some 1A private schools but did not hurt others. I assure you Goodpasture and Lipscomb are much happier with the current set up right now than they were before when they could not both advance to championship games because they knocked each other out in the quarterfinals (ala CPA and GCS this year I believe). It has absolutely nothing to do with "tax dollars and the right to compete against public schools". It is a competitive world in private education and if they cannot field competitive athletic teams (it about marketing) they will ultimately lose students. Particularly those schools that are not, for lack of a better word, religiously based. JCS had a great team this year as did FCS but I will stick my neck out here and say that neither advances to the state championships if they had to play with all privae schools (even if you took out the DIV. II schools)(and please JCS and FCS folks do not burn my screen name in effigy over that last statement, I have the utmost respect for you teams and accomplishments). And do not let them tell you that if the privates split then they will all recruit the best athletes. The fact of the matter is most privates do not have the money to go head to head with the money that backs BA, McCallie, MBA, Ensworth, etc. The current setup allows more privates to go deep into the playoffs and deep into tournaments ( this is not just a football issue but other sports as well, try winning baseball/softball in single A!) than would be allowed to happen in an all private playof format. And finally I do not think that anyone is against publics playing privates in the regular season. I think the support is for a split come post season time. So privates could still benefit from their tax dollars by playing publics during the year and not during the post season. I have seen public school supporter in favor of a complete split, of things staying the same and in favor of putting everyone back togather, but I have seen very very few private school supporters in favor of a split and that makes me wonder why (but in fact I really believe I know that answer.) Now I will batten down the hatches and prepare myself to be proven wrong by the more eloquent people on this board. I really do love the open, frank and honest discussions that we have on this issue.

Edited December 20, 2006 by FadePattern

[supersteve17]

Several times I have read someone say something like, "the privates don't want a split and I think we all know the reasons why..." What do you think are those reasons? It seems to me that many private supporters have articulated those reasons, but all I seem to read from some posters is "I think we all know the reasons why..." So what do you think are those reasons?

Edited December 20, 2006 by supersteve17