State Duals Attendance

[soms]

QUOTE(cobrakid8 @ Feb 5 2007 - 06:48 PM) 826359655[/snapback]

I think if they could get the gym at MTSU to host the state duals it would be great for the whole state. The Murphy Ctr is a nice facility and host the basketball tournament already so why not the duals. The traditional needs to stay at UTC and in Chattanooga. I go at least 2 days worth of the state while I am not able to do the same with going to Clarksville. Even though I have relatives there. The traditional at UTC is a great venue and has grown the years that it has been there. I hate the fact it is being done on Wed, Thursday, and Friday this year but it happens and I will be there at least one of the days. Sorry but I agree with the fact that alot of if not most of those at the state duals this weekend were from Chattanooga. Sorry but although closer to Middle TN even when I wrestled in the late 90's more Chattanooga fans were there than the others combined. You can just look at the teams and tell me who has more fans show up than these schools. Baylor, Soddy Daisy, Bradley, McCallie, Ooltewah, and Notre Dame? But I do think that the duals should be somewhere like at MTSU if they could get the gym there. I would make that drive.

 

 

Very good post.

 

BTW - BB, I didn't know Justin certified for 145, will we see him at 145 this weekend; or was that move just to make things interesting this past weekend and perhaps make him elligible for post season competitions?

[satnitride]

There was never a wait in the bathroom and they were very clean.

 

You must not of tried using the restrooms at the aux gym!!!

 

I agree we need a larger site for all divisions to be able to sit comfortable. I have no complaints of the way the staff handled this tourney.

[cbg]

QUOTE(suddensam @ Feb 5 2007 - 07:02 PM) 826359666[/snapback]

Well after reading the Chattanooga Free/Press last Friday and read that Ronnie

Carter said that last years state duals lost money and that he was thinking about cutting the teams from 16 back to 8. Then I think it is important that we look at finding a better place to have it instead of cutting the number of teams just so we can continue to hold the duals in Clarksville. By the way Clarksville does a good job but maybe there is more to it than just the fact that the Clarksville folks are good people.

 

 

 

You can bet the farm that if wrestling is not paying it's own way the TSSAA will make some changes and cutting the number of teams is one option. Now that we have D1, D2 & D1 A-AA it's no wonder that the TSSAA is loosing money on the state duals. While I don't have the exact financial figures I would be willing to guess that the TSSAA does not make money on the individual tournament like they did before the D1 & D2 split. When everyone was together the TSSAA changed the championship finals starting time from 7:00pm to 4:00pm so they didn't have to pay for an extra night of hotel rooms. While the crowd was not has large in the afternoon the net profit was greater.

 

If the TSSAA wants to make money on the state duals they could do the following:

 

Place D1 & D2 back together and have a small school and large school tournament with 4 schools wrestling in the small school tournament and 8 schools wrestling in the large school tournament. By doing this you would reduce the number of teams from 28 to 12. That would be more than a 50% reduction in expenses plus you could wrestle the whole tournament in one day.

[tnmat]

Has anyone discussed having Belmont University host the State Duals? The Curb Event Center is a facility that is not too small or too large (seats about 4000), is brand new and state-of-the-art, and well located (across from Music Row, Broadway, and several hotels; and right off the interstate). Belmont is right in the heart of Nashville, which provides the closest distance for the maximum number of people. I could ask the director about it if it were a serious consideration. They are always looking for ways to show off the campus.

 

As for moving the Duals to Chattanooga, I am highly opposed. In spite of being a former resident of Chattanooga and loving the area, I have to say that middle Tennessee is the best location. First, because of the driving distance. We have to remember that the State Duals is NOT for the spectators - it is for the participants. West Tennessee teams already drive 7-8 hours for the Individual Tournament. To force them to do this twice is insensitive and cruel. Clarksville is already a drive for the Nashville spectators (as much as an hour depending on where you live), not to mention Cookeville, Memphis, Chattanooga, Knoxville, and upper East Tennessee.

 

Also, we are mistaken if we think that moving this to Chattanooga is good for Tennessee wrestling. A move to Chattanooga would certainly be beneficial for the Chattanooga area of wrestling, but not for the state as a whole. Indeed, this would be counterproductive for the sport in Tennessee. In order to further promote this sport and increase the competitive level, we must focus on moving the sport to areas where it is not as much of a focal point, as well as a place in which it can be marketed to the maximum number of people. Moving this to Nashville would do this. Nashville is the state's largest populus, it is central, and it has plenty of "peripheral" things to do while between sessions (Broadway, tourist attractions, etc.).

[Lucas is my idol]

Well said tnmat. I agree 100%

[CoachDelgado]

QUOTE(tnmat @ Feb 5 2007 - 11:15 PM) 826360003[/snapback]

Has anyone discussed having Belmont University host the State Duals? The Curb Event Center is a facility that is not too small or too large (seats about 4000), is brand new and state-of-the-art, and well located (across from Music Row, Broadway, and several hotels; and right off the interstate). Belmont is right in the heart of Nashville, which provides the closest distance for the maximum number of people. I could ask the director about it if it were a serious consideration. They are always looking for ways to show off the campus.

 

As for moving the Duals to Chattanooga, I am highly opposed. In spite of being a former resident of Chattanooga and loving the area, I have to say that middle Tennessee is the best location. First, because of the driving distance. We have to remember that the State Duals is NOT for the spectators - it is for the participants. West Tennessee teams already drive 7-8 hours for the Individual Tournament. To force them to do this twice is insensitive and cruel. Clarksville is already a drive for the Nashville spectators (as much as an hour depending on where you live), not to mention Cookeville, Memphis, Chattanooga, Knoxville, and upper East Tennessee.

 

Also, we are mistaken if we think that moving this to Chattanooga is good for Tennessee wrestling. A move to Chattanooga would certainly be beneficial for the Chattanooga area of wrestling, but not for the state as a whole. Indeed, this would be counterproductive for the sport in Tennessee. In order to further promote this sport and increase the competitive level, we must focus on moving the sport to areas where it is not as much of a focal point, as well as a place in which it can be marketed to the maximum number of people. Moving this to Nashville would do this. Nashville is the state's largest populus, it is central, and it has plenty of "peripheral" things to do while between sessions (Broadway, tourist attractions, etc.).

 

 

 

TNMAT,

Look into it at Belmont. I agree that Artie and his gang at Clarksville do an excellent job of running the event with the space they have available. A setting with 6 mats in one room would be beneficial to all. There were numerous times when I wanted to watch both the championship and consolation matches and had to choose. In the same room I could watch the key matches I wanted without having to move.

 

The TSSAA is usually open to anyone willing to run a cost effective and improved event from the previous year. My understanding is that the state duals is open for bid every year. If Belmont and the Nashville community could pull it off, I don't see why the TSSAA would not seriously consider it. With no other alternative plans put forward, we will be back in the cozy confines of Clarksville High again next season.

[rigger101]

QUOTE(BayouBear @ Feb 5 2007 - 03:28 PM) 826359469[/snapback]

Where were those Nashville fans this past weekend? It's easy to say there is support but the proof is in the number of butts in the stands.

 

 

3pm matches were standing room only. They were 3 deep on the rails.

[SuperZ]

We certainly understand that at times it is crowded at CHS and at McKenzie it is like watching from the moon but with plenty of seating. The closeness of the CHS gym during the peak period, during D2 semi and D1 semi rounds, is not comfortable but does add to the excitement. Before and after that crowding is not an issue. Clean bathrooms can be a problem, but its the way we, the people who use the rest rooms, treat them that is the issue and you all have seen what I am talking about not the number of seats in them.

 

We also understand that adding the Regions # 2 teams and a small school class have not increased the fan load. That is not related to the weather or the gym size. What is says is that the Chattanooga region supports its programs for some reason, success has a lot to do with that. I don't think taking the duals back to Chattanooga is the answer for improving support in other areas. It actually adds to the downward spiral of wrestling in the other areas.

 

Maybe all the wrestling gurus in Chattanooga can share what they do to generate such athletic success that leads to such fan support.

 

Those of us at CHS are willing to drive to Chattanooga for the individual tourney and we would drive to Nashville or Murphreesboro for the duals. But until you generate more fans for the stands that may not be economically feasible. At CHS the building is rent free, TSSAA pays for the police and the custodial staff the rest of the cost items would be the same anywhere else, ie. rooms and officials. Would Lipscomb or MTSU or any other venue do the same? The school system in Clarksville supports us and TSSAA and we appreciate it in these tight budget times. The individual tourney has been shifted because of basketball priorities will the same thing happen to duals? Taking the kids out of more days of school is not very good for wrestling either.

 

Lets get over the Chattanooga is the best so lets do everything here mentality and grow successful programs in the other areas because having competition is more fun than beating everyone 76-0 (not Soddies fault) or some of the other lopsided scores that occur because other areas aren't there yet.

 

We will drive if we have to to make the sport better. Make no mistake though, we love hosting the duals and will do it every year that TSSAA and CMCSS lets us and we will continue to look for ways to make it more comfortable in the space that we have

 

Whats the secret guys?

[maj]

QUOTE(cbg @ Feb 5 2007 - 10:47 PM) 826359866[/snapback]

You can bet the farm that if wrestling is not paying it's own way the TSSAA will make some changes and cutting the number of teams is one option. Now that we have D1, D2 & D1 A-AA it's no wonder that the TSSAA is loosing money on the state duals. While I don't have the exact financial figures I would be willing to guess that the TSSAA does not make money on the individual tournament like they did before the D1 & D2 split. When everyone was together the TSSAA changed the championship finals starting time from 7:00pm to 4:00pm so they didn't have to pay for an extra night of hotel rooms. While the crowd was not has large in the afternoon the net profit was greater.

 

If the TSSAA wants to make money on the state duals they could do the following:

 

Place D1 & D2 back together and have a small school and large school tournament with 4 schools wrestling in the small school tournament and 8 schools wrestling in the large school tournament. By doing this you would reduce the number of teams from 28 to 12. That would be more than a 50% reduction in expenses plus you could wrestle the whole tournament in one day.

 

 

 

I don't accept your hypothesis TSSAA is losing money on the duals tournament and that reducing the # of teams results in a 50% savings. Even if you are correct, so what ? How about doing what is beneficial to the kids and the sport for a change ? TSSAA rakes in big money for very little effort on football games, the orginization as a whole seems very profitable so it shouldn't be a big deal IF they had to subsidize one tournament occasionaly. The answer is to GROW wrestling and that means provide more not fewer opportunities for wrestlers and wrestling teams to compete in state wide competitions. The small schools division should be expanded to at least 8 teams ands the AAA+ division should be looked at for expansion as well. The third best team in some regions would likely place higher than region champs in others. Add a couple of pig tail brakets and let some of these teams try and wrestle their way into the tournament.

 

Look at what the shrink until you are profitable ( and title 9 ) mentality has done to college wrestling. Fewer programs, fewer weight classes, tournament berths slanted so only the current eltite programs have realistic shots of qualifiying etc.

I for one would like to see Tennessee do everything they can to EXPAND wrestling. It might mean moving the duals out of Clarksville to a bigger building, but one measure of success should be the number of PARTICIPANTS in a sport. Did it help or hurt NCAA basketball when they expanded to 64 teams ?

[soms]

QUOTE(SuperZ @ Feb 6 2007 - 06:01 AM) 826360100[/snapback]

We certainly understand that at times it is crowded at CHS and at McKenzie it is like watching from the moon but with plenty of seating. The closeness of the CHS gym during the peak period, during D2 semi and D1 semi rounds, is not comfortable but does add to the excitement. Before and after that crowding is not an issue.

 

I don't think taking the duals back to Chattanooga is the answer for improving support in other areas. It actually adds to the downward spiral of wrestling in the other areas.

 

Maybe all the wrestling gurus in Chattanooga can share what they do to generate such athletic success that leads to such fan support.

 

Those of us at CHS are willing to drive to Chattanooga for the individual tourney and we would drive to Nashville or Murphreesboro for the duals. But until you generate more fans for the stands that may not be economically feasible. At CHS the building is rent free, TSSAA pays for the police and the custodial staff the rest of the cost items would be the same anywhere else, ie. rooms and officials. Would Lipscomb or MTSU or any other venue do the same? The school system in Clarksville supports us and TSSAA and we appreciate it in these tight budget times. The individual tourney has been shifted because of basketball priorities will the same thing happen to duals? Taking the kids out of more days of school is not very good for wrestling either.

 

We will drive if we have to to make the sport better. Make no mistake though, we love hosting the duals and will do it every year that TSSAA and CMCSS lets us and we will continue to look for ways to make it more comfortable in the space that we have

 

Whats the secret guys?

 

 

Good post!!

 

Sometimes you have to consider the source...Some guys, although having some very insightful and helpful observations, cannot be content. They love to create a discussion that can benefit oneself. I know I can create no small stir too, but at least it's clear who I am and who I stand for…. That’s the betterment of wrestling for all of us throughout TN, not just in my former home town, Chattanooga (where I love to go – BTW). I try to be a fan and support “the sport” in all areas whether it be d1 or d2 - all over.

 

Now, let’s remember that the sport of wrestling is growing statewide and does not revolve around any one person, the TSSAA, or Chattanooga only. The weather and maybe some past discomfort due to overcrowding were likely the main reasons for a smaller crowd this year.

[LovinIt]

QUOTE(kdxdude @ Feb 5 2007 - 09:01 PM) 826359734[/snapback]

I would have loved to have stayed and watched the 2nd half of D1 bracket Friday night but we graciously left so that we made room for the other teams fans. I would have liked to have seen the A/AA and D2 competition but I knew it would be too crowded to comfortably view these matches and I am quite sure there were folks who felt the same as I did. I would say that there were A/AA and D2 folks who may have came to watch on Friday night but I am sure that they knew it would be too crowded. There are quite a few wrestling fans who just love to watch wrestling whether it's A/AA, D1 or D2. If you had a bigger venue you might even be able to make an extra dollar or two. So, I guess I am replying to you by saying I already love and appreciate this sport and if we had a bigger venue I might get to appreciate all of the Tn. wrestlers. I am not disagreeing with you about the Clarksville folks doing a good job, we just need a bigger site.

 

 

 

 

Ditto!!! Would love to have hung around and watched other mathces, but we gave up our seat to the fans and relatives of the next match. And it was a little too hot and crowded to stand up at the top.

[BenStiller23]

QUOTE(LovinIt @ Feb 6 2007 - 11:11 AM) 826360398[/snapback]

Ditto!!! Would love to have hung around and watched other mathces, but we gave up our seat to the fans and relatives of the next match. And it was a little too hot and crowded to stand up at the top.

 

 

Yes Clarksville did a great job. Tournament has out grown the clarksville gym. Need to have bleachers on both sides pulled out. Maybe have the division II at another site or another weekend. Have the team regions for division II wrestle while the rest of us are wrestling our qualifying region tournament to make the state.