A-AA State Soccer Tournament Format Proposal

[ref2coach]

This happens all over the state....Come to think of it, I just found out an interesting fact. In the city of Hendersonville, there are 3 teams headed to state. Hendersonville, JP2, and Station Camp... Kinda ironic.. Thats just from 1 suburban city... one AAA, one D2, one A/AA

 

 

It all starts with recreation soccer. HHS & BHS for many years had it's players volunteer to help the parent coaches in the youth city recreation soccer. When my Son was u5 we had an HHS player that helped out in training once a week. At that time Hendersonville had only HHS and BHS now there is BHS, HHS, JP2, MHMHS & SCHS. Recreation soccer now has Coaches from the TUSC club that does the parent coach training so that u5 through u8 players get good training on ball control and proper passing technique. Starting at u9 the better players are attracted into club soccer and trained by only USSF licensed coaches. The result of starting young is that ~80% of the players at 4 of the Hendersonville schools have been exposed 2 season per year of good training and competition, before arriving at High School and the "off" season during their 4 years in High School.

 

I for one served as a coach and board member in recreation soccer and also in Club/Select soccer.

The age group I started out coaching and finished up managing had players at all 5 Hendersonville High Schools as will as Gallatin, White House, McGavock & Hunters Lane. Do you want regular success in your town's HS soccer program? Many people need to get off of their butts and put their time, effort and money into 5 to 18 year old children so the High School Coach has a foundation to build on. Do the work over many years and you will not care about the classifications because your HS will be successful.

[osomuerte]

I like the idea of the merit system. I have always liked it. It would make travel tougher, but some schools have tough travel wherever they play (those are the teams that everyone else complains about traveling to once every two years). There is surely a way to mix the merit system with the regional system. Should Scott County really have to play CAK every year? I'm sure there are AAA teams that would love to play "down". It would also be nice if the teams having a sub-standard season had something to play for at the end of the season.

 

Now the downside. There is money in the mix for a European team to stay in the top league. What incentive does a team have to fight to stay in the top league when they could drop into the lower league and be dominant? I can think of nothing but pride.

 

So would a merit system work? I doubt it. It would be fun, but teams would settle out and a few would hop up and down season to season with only a rare team making a significant move.

 

I really think a wild card slot at some level might appease some discomfort. If you're in the district with Farragut and Bearden or CAK and Catholic, it would be nice to think you had a chance to show what your team can do in a tournament situation even if you can't get "out of the district".

 

I'm just thinking out loud. The current system definitely makes the best teams champions. That's supposed to be the point, isn't it?

[twinkles]

Alright, I haven't posted in a long time but I have to say something here. People are under the assumption that all private schools are loaded with money and can buy everything they want. This is not true. I played for a private school that did very well in the A/AA division and is still doing very well. Still, every year we are one of the top teams in the state and we hope to have enough money to pay the refs to officiate our games (not pay them off) let alone our coaches (I'm pretty sure he was getting paid in crackers). That means there was definitely no money to go out and recruit players. When I was on the team, the entire team had gone to that private school since 7th grade or earlier, no one showed up just so they could play on a good team. The best players in the state still go to the big AAA schools or D2 schools to get the most exposure. Even the best A/AA teams are not as respected as those schools even though they can and have beaten them. And as far as 8th graders playing on A/AA teams...are you kidding me?!?!?! this is a joke! If I found out there was a 8th grader on the other team I would push him all over the place and make sure to give him a big warm welcome to the "big leagues". How can you complain about the other team having someone who is physically and mentally less mature than every other player out on the field? Let's go over some of your suggestions to "improve" A/AA. If you go to a merit based system in A/AA for the state tournament you will have an upper division that plays very good soccer with the same champion you would normally have. And all of the teams that are just not quite good enough to beat the private schools will still get lumped into this division because they are just that: almost good enough. Still, they will be miles ahead of being in the lower division which will be filled with teams who are just mediocre, and what you will have then is some teams that are state champions who really aren't good enough to be called that and many teams that are better than them who still didn't get to go to the state tournament. So the only winners there are the mediocre teams. If you moved all private schools into one division this would place too much of a burden on these schools for one reason or another, as they don't have quite the financial backing of the other D2 schools to travel. And as stated earlier, this would greatly increase the number of schools that could recruit and you would see alot more of the best athletes leaving the public school systems. But, you would finally be able to crown a public school state champion in the A/AA division (and everyone would know the only reason why they won was because schools like cak and catholic and ccs were pushed out of the division). Then theres the suggestion that you have only 2 private schools make it to state since only 20% of A/AA is private school. Well this is just hypocritical. You are offering a solution to the problem but your solution is the same as the problem, its just aimed at the other schools. You say the "problem" is the private schools are too good and because they are too good they are "unfairly" beating the public schools and thus the public schools cannot compete in the state tournament. So your solution is to restrict the private schools from competing in the state tournament. This is like affirmative action applied to high school sports! And even if you did this, the private schools still win because of the last six years, the state finals in A/AA has been between two private schools 4 times (thats 67% of the time) and a private school has one all 6 of those. The system is not unfair. It has rules, and the rules must be followed. Let's look at this complaint in a different way. The complaint is that public schools don't get to go to the state tournament because private schools keep beating them, and that this is unfair. Lets just tweek the argument a little bit and say that the other teams in the CAK and Catholic sectional never get to go to state because CAK and Catholic always beat them (ignoring the fact that they are private schools). I know for a fact that there are teams in CAK's and Catholic's district, region, and sectional that are better teams than the ones that DO make to state from different regions, but the rules are that you must win or be runner up in your own district, region, and sectional to advance. So the teams have to beat the best to be the best! And guess what? Alcoa beat Catholic this year! So it can be done and when you do it you will know that you didn't cut any corners and you will feel much better about what you have accomplished. Because the bottom line of the state tournament is not to give as many good teams into the state tournament as possible, but to crown a state champion, or find out who is the very best team. Obviously bigger schools have a better chance of being better so they are in an upper division. Schools who give scholarships have a better chance than those who do not. Private schools (who already have their student population multiplied by 1.85, do not recruit, have more money for coaches/facilities) do not have an advantage over public schools.

This post is not meant to disrespect anybody although I'm sure people disagree with my opinion and that is fine. I just wanted to say something about this. These private schools are just victims of their own success.

[cnpitbull]

And as far as 8th graders playing on A/AA teams...are you kidding me?!?!?! this is a joke! If I found out there was a 8th grader on the other team I would push him all over the place and make sure to give him a big warm welcome to the "big leagues".

 

 

That's the first thing that came to mind for me as well. After giving it some thought, though, it's not necessarily the playing time that makes the difference. It's the practice time. That's essentially giving a high school player an extra year of eligibility after their senior season. I know I wouldn't want to see Mark Sherrod allowed to play another season at the high school level if I was on an opposing squad. Also, while I haven't seen him play, 8th grader Ben Holt scored the winning goal (I believe) against Alcoa. If that wasn't the game I know he had a big goal in at least one of the tourney games. Who's to say they would have gotten that goal if he was ineligible?

 

With that said, I'm basically just playing devil's advocate and throwing these arguments out there. I see both side of the debate and have yet to totally make up my mind one way or the other.

[Nashville Panther]

Oh by the way 3 of the final 4 are public schools in A-AA.

[manUforever]

I'm a player, whose played public school soccer in A/AA, and has had my season ended by a private school every year. However, I don't believe they should change it at ALL. Trophys don't mean anything to me personally. We are out there to play and to get better. SO what if they recruit, if they even do. BRING EM ON!!!! In my experience, winning against a team on your level doesn't feel anywhere as good as losing to a team by only 1 point or tieing a team that should of killed you. I looked forward to playing Baylor and McCCALLIE, BoYD, CAK whoever every year! I remember when the Mccallie keeper grab our poor public school chair and throw it cause he just got scored on. Did we win that game? NO, but we play our hearts out and every player on my team was happier then any win because we surprised them. My Freshman year, We lost to CAK in the semis, but i learn so much from just that one game, and took so much out of it. We played Boyd this year, and they ended our season. My senior year. BUT i wouldnt have it any other way. Every player took something from that game that they'll keep for the rest of their lifes. Trophys don't last forever. I think i speak for alot of public school PLAYERS, the people actually playing, when i say. THE PRIVATE SCHOOLS BETTER KEEP RECRUITING STRONG, CAUSE PUBLIC SCHOOLS ARE NEVER GONNA BACK DOWN!

[MVM]

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It all starts with recreation soccer. HHS & BHS for many years had it's players volunteer to help the parent coaches in the youth city recreation soccer. When my Son was u5 we had an HHS player that helped out in training once a week. At that time Hendersonville had only HHS and BHS now there is BHS, HHS, JP2, MHMHS & SCHS. Recreation soccer now has Coaches from the TUSC club that does the parent coach training so that u5 through u8 players get good training on ball control and proper passing technique. Starting at u9 the better players are attracted into club soccer and trained by only USSF licensed coaches. The result of starting young is that ~80% of the players at 4 of the Hendersonville schools have been exposed 2 season per year of good training and competition, before arriving at High School and the "off" season during their 4 years in High School.

 

I for one served as a coach and board member in recreation soccer and also in Club/Select soccer.

The age group I started out coaching and finished up managing had players at all 5 Hendersonville High Schools as will as Gallatin, White House, McGavock & Hunters Lane. Do you want regular success in your town's HS soccer program? Many people need to get off of their butts and put their time, effort and money into 5 to 18 year old children so the High School Coach has a foundation to build on. Do the work over many years and you will not care about the classifications because your HS will be successful.

 

 

Exactly....Couldn't have said it better.

[jtbatche13]

I think in an earlier post someone brought up the point of working hard, beating the big teams, and then not complaining. This is a great argument. If you look at AAA this year two teams from the west were playing in the state tournament for the first time (White Station and Kingsbury). Yes, I know this is about A-AA, but can someone tell me the last time Houston didnt make it to state since they've had a school or how many times Collierville hasn't been there either? Others might say that the AAA west was down this year, which may be true. Regardless, those two teams did what no one expected them to do. So, I guess that it can happen, whether its a down year or just hard work. According to the TSSAA new classifications, it looks like Kingsbury is actually moving down to AA as well. I think all you can do is work hard or just give up.

[rufus]

I'd love to see the A/AA combination dropped. If AA combined with AAA the private school domination would vanish. Not unheard of for A's (public and private) to use 8th grade and female players to fill the squad.

[NashFC]

you know, if this problem is ever settled (if public schools win the title several years in a row) im sure another will pop up. such as the western teams complaining that the eastern teams always knock them out. or that a certain urban or suburban district always sends its two teams to state shutting out three other rural districts. or as was said earlier the magnet schools might be targeted. I mean lets atleast be thankful we have a tournament formant and not the BCS determining our champions

[westtnman]

Oh by the way 3 of the final 4 are public schools in A-AA.

 

 

 

 

Funny how this little "fact" does not even get commented on. The argument just continues on how unfair it is for privates to compete with publics......does anyone see this???? 3 OF THE FINAL 4 ARE PUBLIC SCHOOLS !!!!!!

Enough already.

[Coniglio]

It's true. 3 of the 4 are public schools.

 

If A/AA was split into A and AA, then the same teams that usually dominate A/AA will dominate AA and class A will be a generally pitiful display of soccer, where the state tournament consists of all 8 schools in the class that have a team.