Baylor

[NardDog]

Why do I hear so many people talking negatively about Baylor? The Baylor Athletic Department has to abide by rules just like every other school, but for some reason many people like to accuse Baylor of recruiting. Baylor got some key transfers this year, so be it. They have established themselves as a top school its no wonder that parents want their kids to attend. Who wouldn't want their kids to be part of a school with the best facilities, teachers, and coaches?

[foozballman]

Why do I hear so many people talking negatively about Baylor? The Baylor Athletic Department has to abide by rules just like every other school, but for some reason many people like to accuse Baylor of recruiting. Baylor got some key transfers this year, so be it. They have established themselves as a top school its no wonder that parents want their kids to attend. Who wouldn't want their kids to be part of a school with the best facilities, teachers, and coaches?

 

Baylor has finally realized that in order to have a chance at a state championship they will have to go into the public school system and recruit or offer "financial aid" in order to compete. There are a number of athletes on the football team that would not be at the Baylor school had it not been for their ability on the football field. Not condeming anyone looking to better themselves when given the opportunity to attend Baylor/McCallie, but its one thing when they come to you and its another when you go to them. There is a fine line between Recruiting and "financial aid". Its just taking Baylor longer than it did Signal Mtn to understand this.,

[mocs2011]

Why do I hear so many people talking negatively about Baylor? The Baylor Athletic Department has to abide by rules just like every other school, but for some reason many people like to accuse Baylor of recruiting. Baylor got some key transfers this year, so be it. They have established themselves as a top school its no wonder that parents want their kids to attend. Who wouldn't want their kids to be part of a school with the best facilities, teachers, and coaches?

 

There's already 13 pages on this topic, suggest reading them. Ok, I guess I'll poke a little more fun since there's an opportunity. Why would anyone talk negatively about Baylor? Hmm, a prep school that athletically chooses to act more like a public school, instead of competing against the big boys at the national prep level? While a great school with outstanding facilities, teachers and coaches, if I were a parent paying this kind of money, I would want my school to compete against the best (Blair, Wyoming Seminary, McDonough, Germantown and Georgetown Prep). Unless of course I was not paying all that money.... Also invite a few of these schools to Chattown, so all of us can watch the fun.

Edited September 13, 2012 by mocs2011

[mtnrasslin]

There's already 13 pages on this topic, suggest reading them. Ok, I guess I'll poke a little more fun since there's an opportunity. Why would anyone talk negatively about Baylor? Hmm, a prep school that athletically chooses to act more like a public school, instead of competing against the big boys at the national prep level? While a great school with outstanding facilities, teachers and coaches, if I were a parent paying this kind of money, I would want my school to compete against the best (Blair, Wyoming Seminary, McDonough, Germantown and Georgetown Prep). Unless of course I was not paying all that money.... Also invite a few of these schools to Chattown, so all of us can watch the fun.

 

To add some perspective-

 

The last time Baylor wrestled in the National Prep tournament, 1970, the year before joining the TSSAA due to the demise of the Mid-South conference, Baylor won the tournament. Baylor would wrestle in the tournament today were participation not outlawed by the TSSAA.

 

There is no question that Blair and WS have, arguably, year in an year out, two of the best wrestling programs in the country. It will be interesting to see what happens to Blair now that Buxton is gone. With that in mind, having a son who has volunteer coached at Georgetown Prep over the last few years, coached against McDonough high school wrestlers, and wrestled with McDonough kids on his team in college, I am told that on any given year, depending on match ups, GP would win 2 or 3 matches and McDonough might win a few more but with Baylor coming out ahead.

 

As long as Baylor is in Tennessee, (not likely to change since the campus is probably the finest real estate in the state) and there are no other options beyond the TSSAA, I guess we won't have a chance to see how well they would stack up. Maybe the TSSAA could change the rules so they could compete. Oh yeah, what am I thinking, that wouldn't be fair.

Edited September 14, 2012 by mtnrasslin

[mtnrasslin]

Baylor has finally realized that in order to have a chance at a state championship they will have to go into the public school system and recruit or offer "financial aid" in order to compete. There are a number of athletes on the football team that would not be at the Baylor school had it not been for their ability on the football field. Not condeming anyone looking to better themselves when given the opportunity to attend Baylor/McCallie, but its one thing when they come to you and its another when you go to them. There is a fine line between Recruiting and "financial aid". Its just taking Baylor longer than it did Signal Mtn to understand this.,

 

Why is "financial aid" in quotes?

[TNKO2]

Im a little confused, Didnt one or a few of our teams travel to Florida to compete in a national level duals against Brandon and other top teams a couple of years ago? Even Christian Brothers goes to Hawaii every now and then. In fact, they are always traveling out of state. So help me understand... is it because these out of state tournys are not considered National Invitationals so they can participate in them?

Edited September 14, 2012 by TNKO2

[NardDog]

It's pretty rediculous that Baylor gets this kind of treatment even though they haven't even dominated D2 for an extended amount of time. If you think back just several years ago Bradley had complete control of the D1 state tournament, every now and then another team would pop up to challenge them (Soddy, Franklin, maybe another one or two), but overall Bradley was the state champs year in and year out. If the Bradley coaches could do control the D1 tournament like they did without recruiting, then what does that say about the quality of the Baylor coaches if they can't even control the D2 tournament while stealing the other teams best wrestlers. Now I think the Baylor coaches have been great and are great currently; I don't think the Bradley coaches are/were any better. I think this just shows that Baylor is not bending/breaking the rules that everyone says they are, if they were then they should have many more state titles than they do (not that what they've won is not outstanding). I guess what I'm getting at is just as a Baylor alum I don't like to see all this criticism, I want credit given to the great coaches Baylor has had in developing their athletes and for opportunities the school offers that attracts all kinds of students.

[ccleveland]

Private schools in Tennessee cannot compete at Prep Nationals because they would be ruled ineligible by the TSSAA (couldn’t find the exact ruling on their website). In order to participate in the Prep Nationals a private school would have to break away from the TSSAA. That action would make them a non-sanctioned school, which would prevent them from wrestling TSSAA sanctioned schools.

 

Contests with Out-Of-State Teams and Interstate Tournaments

2.

Q. May a TSSAA school participate in interstate tournaments or meets that have not been sanctioned?

A. No. All interstate tournaments and meets must be sanctioned by TSSAA, the other state associations

concerned, and the National Federation. (p.55)

< http://www.tssaa.org/Handbook/handbook.pdf>

 

Though I’m not 100% sure I believe that individual sports can’t break away from TSSAA, it must be an entire school (i.e.: wrestling cannot become independent and the rest of the school remains sanctioned). It is either all or nothing!

[jcddmoon]

What was the reason for that ruling? That really restricts the states growth IMO. A smart/rich man would open up a nice wrestling academy and travel nationally with our kids to get them some national exposure. I applaud folks that are already doing this on their own dime and time by taking kids to Fargo etc.

[maj]

Private schools in Tennessee cannot compete at Prep Nationals because they would be ruled ineligible by the TSSAA (couldn’t find the exact ruling on their website). In order to participate in the Prep Nationals a private school would have to break away from the TSSAA. That action would make them a non-sanctioned school, which would prevent them from wrestling TSSAA sanctioned schools.

 

Contests with Out-Of-State Teams and Interstate Tournaments

2.

Q. May a TSSAA school participate in interstate tournaments or meets that have not been sanctioned?

A. No. All interstate tournaments and meets must be sanctioned by TSSAA, the other state associations

concerned, and the National Federation. (p.55)

< http://www.tssaa.org...ok/handbook.pdf>

 

Though I’m not 100% sure I believe that individual sports can’t break away from TSSAA, it must be an entire school (i.e.: wrestling cannot become independent and the rest of the school remains sanctioned). It is either all or nothing!

 

Facts will no doubt be lost on those with the visceral hatred of the preps. Why work on building a decent program when you can spend all your energy on message boards trying to tear down some of the best ones ?

[mocs2011]

To add some perspective-

 

The last time Baylor wrestled in the National Prep tournament, 1970, the year before joining the TSSAA due to the demise of the Mid-South conference, Baylor won the tournament. Baylor would wrestle in the tournament today were participation not outlawed by the TSSAA.

 

There is no question that Blair and WS have, arguably, year in an year out, two of the best wrestling programs in the country. It will be interesting to see what happens to Blair now that Buxton is gone. With that in mind, having a son who has volunteer coached at Georgetown Prep over the last few years, coached against McDonough high school wrestlers, and wrestled with McDonough kids on his team in college, I am told that on any given year, depending on match ups, GP would win 2 or 3 matches and McDonough might win a few more but with Baylor coming out ahead.

 

As long as Baylor is in Tennessee, (not likely to change since the campus is probably the finest real estate in the state) and there are no other options beyond the TSSAA, I guess we won't have a chance to see how well they would stack up. Maybe the TSSAA could change the rules so they could compete. Oh yeah, what am I thinking, that wouldn't be fair.

 

That is the point, compete fairly, get out of the TSSAA and wrestle against these top schools. Give parents more options, we already have public schools and private schools that compete in TN and take their one trip to a (nationally) significant tournament. Chattanooga needs an option that allows kids to go get tested at the national high school tournaments on a regular basis. The parent's are paying for it, what is everyone afraid of?

 

As for McDonough they are a top 50 team, Baylor was not. Kiski finished ahead of Baylor at the Prep Slam and then finished 16th at the national prep tournament last year.

Edited September 14, 2012 by mocs2011

[RedRobin]

That is the point, compete fairly, get out of the TSSAA and wrestle against these top schools. Give parents more options, we already have public schools and private schools that compete in TN and take their one trip to a (nationally) significant tournament. Chattanooga needs an option that allows kids to go get tested at the national high school tournaments on a regular basis. The parent's are paying for it, what is everyone afraid of?

 

As for McDonough they are a top 50 team, Baylor was not. Kiski finished ahead of Baylor at the Prep Slam and then finished 16th at the national prep tournament last year.

 

If you are so concerned about Baylor's faults (most of which exist only in your mind), then send your kids to Blair, Wyoming Seminary, McDonough, etc. No one ever forced the Tennessee publics to wrestle against Baylor, and some of them won't. I don't hear any serious complaints from Baylor about that. I also don't hear much whining from the Tennessee D2 schools that must wrestle against Baylor. As mtnrasslin said, if Baylor chose to compete against the "national programs" as you suggest, they would either have only a few meets each year or their travel costs (not to mention time out of the classroom which I suspect would be just as important to most Baylor parents) would soon exceed the cost of tuition. Your suggestions are totally unrealistic. If you are from a D2 program, I suggest you suck it up and work hard to make your program equal to or better than Baylor's. If you are from a D1 program, either suck it up or choose not to wrestle them. Improvement comes from focusing on one's own program, rather than from criticizing a rival program.