Private school classification?

[KYdigsTN]

Just wondering something, and one post to answer it will be sufficient as I certainly dont want to end up in a public/private debate, but can somebody explain to me the difference in why teams like Father Ryan and BGA are in Div II and Knox Catholic is A/AA. Aren't they all private schools?

[CoachT]

Just wondering something, and one post to answer it will be sufficient as I certainly dont want to end up in a public/private debate, but can somebody explain to me the difference in why teams like Father Ryan and BGA are in Div II and Knox Catholic is A/AA. Aren't they all private schools?

Private schools that give scholarships are in DII, the ones that don't are in DI.

[observations]

Just wondering something, and one post to answer it will be sufficient as I certainly dont want to end up in a public/private debate, but can somebody explain to me the difference in why teams like Father Ryan and BGA are in Div II and Knox Catholic is A/AA. Aren't they all private schools?

 

Private school have the choice to offer financial aid based on income if they so choose or not. Father Ryan offers financial aid to anybody that qualifies for it, playing sports has nothing at all to do with it. Apparently Knox Catholic has chosen to not offer financial aid. You can call it a scholarship, but it is not based on grades, I can tell you from personal experience, its just to help the not so rich parents of students wishing to attend school there. Many students could not attend at all without this assistence. I hope this answer helps.

Edited July 31, 2006 by fieldman

[DaddyJuice]

Fieldman is correct, financial aid is based on need not scholastic abilty or athletic abilty as far as Knox Cath is concerned. BUT, if a student accepts financial aid he/she can not particiapte in TSSAA sanctioned sports in the public sector. Knox Cath does still offer financial aid, but none of its student-athletes can accept it.

[observations]

Fieldman is correct, financial aid is based on need not scholastic abilty or athletic abilty as far as Knox Cath is concerned. BUT, if a student accepts financial aid he/she can not particiapte in TSSAA sanctioned sports in the public sector. Knox Cath does still offer financial aid, but none of its student-athletes can accept it.

 

 

glad to hear they still offer financial aid. Here's to a great and healthly season in all sports for Knox Catholic and all the schools.

[cbg]

Private schools that give scholarships are in DII, the ones that don't are in DI.

 

Would the correct language not be financial aid and not scholarships?

[bratman]

I called Knoxville Catholic and asked what tuition was, A very pleasant lady said that it depended on whether or not I was Catholic. She said if I wasn't Catholic it was $7800 a year (roughly) and if I was Catholic it was $5200 a year (roughly.)

 

I asked why the difference. The answer I was given was that if I was Catholic my local parrish would make up the difference. She also said that it didn't matter if I was an athlete or not. If I was Catholic my local church made up the difference.

 

Here is my question. Rule 16 says that to play in Div 1 the only people that can pay the tuition is the parent or legal guardian. If someone else pays, (like the local church) then you go to Div 2. How can Catholic get past this rule when at least 25% of the players tuition is being paid by the church.

 

GLJ a rule interpretation would be good here.

 

By the way. The majority of the Catholic athletes at Knoxville Catholic take advantage of this benefit. Some get a bigger % of their tuition paid by having brothers and sisters in the system.

 

How is this legal.

[PHargis]

I called Knoxville Catholic and asked what tuition was, A very pleasant lady said that it depended on whether or not I was Catholic. She said if I wasn't Catholic it was $7800 a year (roughly) and if I was Catholic it was $5200 a year (roughly.)

 

I asked why the difference. The answer I was given was that if I was Catholic my local parrish would make up the difference. She also said that it didn't matter if I was an athlete or not. If I was Catholic my local church made up the difference.

 

Here is my question. Rule 16 says that to play in Div 1 the only people that can pay the tuition is the parent or legal guardian. If someone else pays, (like the local church) then you go to Div 2. How can Catholic get past this rule when at least 25% of the players tuition is being paid by the church.

 

GLJ a rule interpretation would be good here.

 

By the way. The majority of the Catholic athletes at Knoxville Catholic take advantage of this benefit. Some get a bigger % of their tuition paid by having brothers and sisters in the system.

 

How is this legal.

Wow!!!! WOW!!! Brat, you undercovering this is about like Pageman discovering you are putting tomato catchup on your brats and not telling anyone. One thing is for sure, after a major lawsuit with BA and TSSAA and after discovery after discovery of different counties having zoning rules which allow students to move from zone to zone and some counties with multiple HS that don't even have zones and after seeing all of the different nuisances which allow students, for every good reason, to transfer to different schools, now we are after the Knoxville Catholic Church and its students and their brothers and sisters.

Just how many care when there are so many other problems in teaching and educating students and why would a school of this stature even think about breaking rules. Being associated in the past with someone who ran a private school, most of their time is spent in trying to recruit students to keep the school open and pay the bills, much less break rules. I would suspect that if we delved deeply in to every school practice we would find something, even Anderson County.

Seems to me we might all just take a deep breath, dream of visions of a big plate smothered with onions and sour kraut, let the schools and the authorities take care of managing the schools, take a great interest in educating the kids and instilling the Tennessee values into their lives and let the extracuricular be managed by those who know something about the situation. Brat, you are a great slooth and I'm glad you are in East Tennessee cause if you were in the rest of the State it would worry you to death. You are a GREAT advocate of VB in this STATE. Just trying to keep us all from getting deleted off this board and we're getting close here.

[Cowboys Up]

Wow!!!! WOW!!! Brat, you undercovering this is about like Pageman discovering you are putting tomato catchup on your brats and not telling anyone. One thing is for sure, after a major lawsuit with BA and TSSAA and after discovery after discovery of different counties having zoning rules which allow students to move from zone to zone and some counties with multiple HS that don't even have zones and after seeing all of the different nuisances which allow students, for every good reason, to transfer to different schools, now we are after the Knoxville Catholic Church and its students and their brothers and sisters.

Just how many care when there are so many other problems in teaching and educating students and why would a school of this stature even think about breaking rules. Being associated in the past with someone who ran a private school, most of their time is spent in trying to recruit students to keep the school open and pay the bills, much less break rules. I would suspect that if we delved deeply in to every school practice we would find something, even Anderson County.

Seems to me we might all just take a deep breath, dream of visions of a big plate smothered with onions and sour kraut, let the schools and the authorities take care of managing the schools, take a great interest in educating the kids and instilling the Tennessee values into their lives and let the extracuricular be managed by those who know something about the situation. Brat, you are a great slooth and I'm glad you are in East Tennessee cause if you were in the rest of the State it would worry you to death. You are a GREAT advocate of VB in this STATE. Just trying to keep us all from getting deleted off this board and we're getting close here.

I'm ok with someone trying to find out what is going on. Fieldman and DaddyJuice both said that atheletes can't accept financial aid. Bratmav was just checking it out. It's possible that the nice lady on the phone was wrong.

 

When there are so many rules, people can get confused...case in point...the Ravenwood football team dressed out in pads before they were allowed to. They got sanctioned by TSSAA for it. It was simply a mistaken reading of the rules by the coach.

 

Perhaps more questions need to be asked to find out what the rules really are.

Edited August 2, 2006 by Cowboys Up

[observations]

uote name='Cowboys Up' post='826086898' date='Aug 1 2006 - 07:42 PM']

I'm ok with someone trying to find out what is going on. Fieldman and DaddyJuice both said that atheletes can't accept financial aid. Bratmav was just checking it out. It's possible that the nice lady on the phone was wrong.

 

When there are so many rules, people can get confused...case in point...the Ravenwood football team dressed out in pads before they were allowed to. They got sanctioned by TSSAA for it. It was simply a mistaken reading of the rules by the coach.

 

Perhaps more questions need to be asked to find out what the rules really are.

 

 

You need to read my earlier post again. I said that financial aid is based on need only, it doesn't matter whether you play sports or not. If you are Division I and want to play sports, you cannot accept financial aid from the school, if you are in Division II, then financial aid is there for anyone who applies and qualifies for it. The private schools who decided to stay in Division I cannot offer financial aid on tuition etc to athletes. There is a catholic rate with a parish card and a catholic rate without a parish card and non catholic rate in all catholic schools at least in the Nashville diocese and I suspect in the Knoxville diocese as well. The non-catholic rate is substanially higher then the catholic rate. This is due to most catholic students individual parishes contributing a set amount for each student that comes from that parish that is a contributing member of the parish and has a parish card. If a student's parents are not a contributing member of a parish, that student pays a rate approx twelve hundred dollars a year more. It doesn't matter what faith you are, it still costs just as much to educate a child. In the last eight or so years that I have been associated with private schools, I have seen many good students both athletes and non-athletes have to leave due to not being able to afford the cost of private school education.

Edited August 8, 2006 by fieldman

[patsfan123]

I am not Catholic but I believe part of the explanation is that tuition for Catholic High School (to use bratmans numbers for the basis of discussion) is $5,200, not $7,800. If non-Catholics choose to attend Catholic, they pay a premium above and beyond the regular tuition. Similarly, the University of Tennesse sets the amount for tuition for in-state students. Out of state students pay a premium. In both cases, Catholic familes or state of Tennessee residents are paying the base tuition, outsiders pay a premium.

[observations]

I am not Catholic but I believe part of the explanation is that tuition for Catholic High School (to use bratmans numbers for the basis of discussion) is $5,200, not $7,800. If non-Catholics choose to attend Catholic, they pay a premium above and beyond the regular tuition. Similarly, the University of Tennesse sets the amount for tuition for in-state students. Out of state students pay a premium. In both cases, Catholic familes or state of Tennessee residents are paying the base tuition, outsiders pay a premium.

 

Actually tuition at Father Ryan is 7,350 for a catholic student with parish assistence, without parish assistence, it is 8,650, non-catholic is 11,795, this does not include various fee's, books, etc which can easily run a couple of thousand more. The non-catholic student and catholic student is eligible for financial aid depending on income of parents. JPII on the other hand charges Catholic students appromimately 800 dollars a year more than Ryan to attend. But they charge non-catholic students over two thousand less to attend there. If I were a JPII parent, I would have some serious questions about that. St. Cecilia is higher still. Generally speaking tuition rises approximately 7% a year.

Edited August 25, 2006 by fieldman