How do you get refs fired?

[TNSOCCER9]

What do you think? I'm not a ref, just a parent and was wondering about a situation from a game this season.

The ball is at the center mid's feet and he is moving towards the opponents goal. About 10 yards outside the box, he passes the all to his teammate running in from the right side. the onrushing player gathers the pass and takes two or three more strides moving towards the goal and in the penalty box. A defender hustle over and slide tackles the player as he is trying to shot. The shot went slowly forward with nothing on it and a PK is called on the foul. As the teams are moving around getting ready for the PK, the side ref tells the center ref that another player was offsides when the foul occurred. The center ref decided the offsides nullified the foul and thus the PK, giving the other team a free kick. I guess this is correct, but it sounds strange.

Any thoughts?

[spiritfighter500]

I know there is always going to be a problem with refs, but the best thing you can do is play or coach your game. Because you mess up, but the ref doesn't ask to fire you or try to correct you. That's the way I look at it. When you play or coach a perfect game, maybe then you can ask the ref to ref a perfect game.

 

I agree fully, when you can coach without any mistakes then you can talk about refs not being perfect.

[PinballWizard]

Im a four year referee which is actually very very in experienced, but I would have to agree with the call made. Since the player that was fouled was in an offsides position when he got the ball he is basically dead after he recieves the ball. Same as if he scored...it would be called back. Same with the foul, the offsides would over rule the foul that took place afterwards. The player that comitted the foul could still be carded and etc. but the play would resume from the spot of the offsides. Fellow refs agree?

[MVM]

What do you think? I'm not a ref, just a parent and was wondering about a situation from a game this season.

The ball is at the center mid's feet and he is moving towards the opponents goal. About 10 yards outside the box, he passes the all to his teammate running in from the right side. the onrushing player gathers the pass and takes two or three more strides moving towards the goal and in the penalty box. A defender hustle over and slide tackles the player as he is trying to shot. The shot went slowly forward with nothing on it and a PK is called on the foul. As the teams are moving around getting ready for the PK, the side ref tells the center ref that another player was offsides when the foul occurred. The center ref decided the offsides nullified the foul and thus the PK, giving the other team a free kick. I guess this is correct, but it sounds strange.

Any thoughts?

 

If the player that recieved the ball was offsides then that was the correct call (offsides). But If it was another player that was in an offsides position, then no that was not the correct call. You can be in an offsides position, but not be called for offsides.

[TNSOCCER9]

Im a four year referee which is actually very very in experienced, but I would have to agree with the call made. Since the player that was fouled was in an offsides position when he got the ball he is basically dead after he recieves the ball. Same as if he scored...it would be called back. Same with the foul, the offsides would over rule the foul that took place afterwards. The player that comitted the foul could still be carded and etc. but the play would resume from the spot of the offsides. Fellow refs agree?

 

 

I'm sorry, I stated it wrong. The player that received the ball was onside. He shot the ball and was fouled in the act. Another player, not part of the play was called offside and his offside position nullified the PK. Does that make a difference?

[PinballWizard]

Pk should then of been awarded. If you do not affect the play, then you can not be called for offsides.

[osomuerte]

Yes and no. The ref must have deemed that the player in offside position was "involved in the play", be it because he was positioned for a rebound, close enough to distract the keeper, or whatever reason. It is the ref's decision.

 

The ref does have the discretion to wave off the offside (since it wasn't a call yet) in favor of the PK, but that is getting very suspicious. The ref made the conservative call. The phrase "in the opinion of the referee" is very powerful and nearly irrefutable.

 

However now the slide tackle (presumably dangerous or poorly-executed) creeps into the area of a dead ball penalty, ungentlemanly at the least. (I know it's not technically a dead ball until the whistle, but we don't want open season on strikers every time a flag snaps, do we?) Depending on the severity of the foul, I'd likely card the offending player. Not red as it wasn't technically a goal-scoring opportunity, but nasty. If it was something that might slide at midfield, I'd likely do what the ref did.

 

This was a judgment call, so the ref won't be reprimanded from this description. He may, however, receive a medal.

 

(Disclaimer: I saw nothing but the posts, so if it was a hard-core take down, I apologize.)

[Canesoverhere]

Yes and no. The ref must have deemed that the player in offside position was "involved in the play", be it because he was positioned for a rebound, close enough to distract the keeper, or whatever reason. It is the ref's decision.

 

The ref does have the discretion to wave off the offside (since it wasn't a call yet) in favor of the PK, but that is getting very suspicious. The ref made the conservative call. The phrase "in the opinion of the referee" is very powerful and nearly irrefutable.

 

However now the slide tackle (presumably dangerous or poorly-executed) creeps into the area of a dead ball penalty, ungentlemanly at the least. (I know it's not technically a dead ball until the whistle, but we don't want open season on strikers every time a flag snaps, do we?) Depending on the severity of the foul, I'd likely card the offending player. Not red as it wasn't technically a goal-scoring opportunity, but nasty. If it was something that might slide at midfield, I'd likely do what the ref did.

 

This was a judgment call, so the ref won't be reprimanded from this description. He may, however, receive a medal.

 

(Disclaimer: I saw nothing but the posts, so if it was a hard-core take down, I apologize.)

 

 

Although I am in agreement, we have a long way before the high school refs are ready to handle "was the player in the off-sides position involved with the play". I am shocked by how many basic off-sides flags are raised when the ball reaches the last defender with the forward two steps ahead and not when it was originally struck and the forward was two yards on-sides. I see this at least twice a game.

[cronaldo]

I thought refs were supposed to not come to the game with any preconcieved notions and i think that there is way to much of that that goes on especially at the schools with less educated fans I think the refs come in to prove something

 

i agree and try to make their mark on the game!!!

[TNSOCCER9]

Thanks, the game was 0-0 and the referee probably didn't want to decide the game with a potential PK.

[SeymourSoccer5]

Ever watch American Idol? (Stay with me, there is a point.) You can usually tell who the judges' favorites are. Do they always win? No. Do they tend to do well? Yes, because the judges tend to pick the better singers as favorites. Still, if the favorite messes up, Simon lets them know it.

 

Now the point. I think refs have favorite teams and teams they particularly dislike. Will this influence their calls? Some, sure. Will it decide the game? Not likely.

 

The problem I've always seen comes from players (and coaches) not being able to deal with the (perceived) inequality. One or two "missed" calls put the team on the hunt for injustice. If you look for it, you can find it in any game. (Watch a game you don't care about on television and tell yourself the ref prefers the blue team; you'll find injustice.) Then everyone gets frustrated, the players start fouling more, the coach yells at the ref more, the fans cuss and call an optometrist, and now the ref can't help but make the calls and start pulling cards left and right. Is it a self-fulfilling prophecy? Maybe, but the slighted team certainly didn't do much to help matters, did they?

 

The best advice is to keep calm. A team that is respectful to the ref (even when he has a bad game) will eventually become a ref favorite, if not for this ref then others to come. Which side of things would you rather be on?

 

 

I agree with this post, there are so many factors that influence the refs, they are only human after all. I wish we as coaches would keep that in mind in the heat of the game. I wish even more that fans would keep that in mind. How does a 16 year old react when he hears Mom or Dad screaming at a refs decision, many times that young man is going to think he has been wronged and do something to "get even".

 

I know it is this way but I hate that some schools have the reputation of being hard on refs (especially if it is my school). This also must influence the mindset of the ref coming to those places.

 

In a perfect world, refs would be nonjudgemental and unaffected by the criticism and remarks they hear, but who are we kidding, they are. What can be done about it "the best advice is to keep calm. A team that is respectful to the ref (even if he has a bad game) will eventually become a ref favorite." I really like this idea, I feel that fans have had an impact on games with their negativity taking energy from the players. I had a former player tell me that it really affected him and the team when the fans stopped cheering the team and started "riding the refs".

 

We, the adults should remember we are supposed to be role models for the "Kids" that are playing, they will follow our lead, we must lead in the right direction.

 

I don't want to be accused of bashing but I do want to say that in all the athletic events and games I have seen and been a part of involving five different high school sports, over 23 years as a coach and player, the soccer officials I have seen, come to the field with a combative attitude and personality that does not help in most situtations. It is as if the refs, (not in all cases but in more than is acceptable) do not look to calm the situations but want to demonstrate their power and authority, and this only brings out the worst in people. I imagine (and maybe I am dreaming) that refs are like Peace Officers, whose job is to control the situation while keeping people calm and not there to instigate more upheaval.

 

Again we should all remember, true character is revealed in times of stress. what are we showing our kids in the stands, on the sidelines and on the playing field at soccer games????

[basehits]

My son has been a ref for years.....and he says you dont even think about the team that is on the field. He has been a ref so long that he said that you make the calls and dont even think about the team who has just made the foul it just comes natural. The ref's are just doing their jobs and guess what you cant play without them. You need to play by their rules. If one is calling off sides all the time be more careful not to be offf sides. If he is calling alot of easy fouls...guess what better not even come close to fouling. And you know if a ref is easy that the team is going to foul alot. Believe me I sure dont agree with them all the time....in fact I dont agree with them most of the time. But again we cant play without them and it is not an easy job......