Speaking of good coaches

[VolunteerGeneral]

Here is a very good article/interview on Trey Teague who played at USJ, University of Tennessee, and the Denver Broncos. He has signed a contract to play for the Buffalo Bills this fall. It`s pretty interesting reading. Please note his comments at the end of the interview about his high school coach.

 

http://miva.jacksonsun.com/miva/cgi-bin/mi...200207213970464

 

I`ve been saying all along that it is coaching, coaching, coaching. And for the record, USJ did not "recruit" Trey. He went to elementary school there.

[ELA]

Volunteer General... you keep riding this same horse! I have been in this business for a long time and I have never (I repeat NEVER) heard any football coach say that COACHING always makes the difference in a football program. There is no doubt that we make a huge difference in the lives of many of the boys we work with, and that is what it is really all about; but to say a program wins or losses because of who the head coach is and that is the main contributing factor is simply wrong! IF YOU DON'T HAVE SOME TALENT ON THE FOOTBALL TEAM YOU CAN'T WIN GAMES! PERIOD! END OF STORY! To me, one of the greatest football coaches was Tom Landry. He was the master at finding hidden talent and building his program around it! But his last few years as a coach were terrible. You can take the best coaches in the world and place them into certain situations and you may not produce a winner. On the other hand, I have seen really "shallow men" take teams loaded with talent and win a lot of games! I have seen men who only knew a hand full of plays and only one system of football win a lot of games... not because they had any football "sense" but because they had the talent to execute plays. I have seen very unstructured coaches who lacked any sense of discipline win with teams that were loaded with talent. 75- 80% of the time, the team with the most talent wins the game. In the other 20- 25% of the time, coaching and hard work makes the difference! I'll make you a deal... you give me 3-4 kids that I can hand pick, and put them into my system, with the kids I already have in place, and I will finish in the top 4-8 teams in the state! TALENT WINS GAMES AT LEAST 75% of the TIME! If a coach ever takes a head coaching job and thinks he can turn a program around just by his presence, he is either crazy, or very arrogant! Coaching is important, but no coach can win championships with out talent!

[VolunteerGeneral]

ELA...first of all...Did you enjoy the interview?

 

Second...I don`t care how many years you have coached.Please quit bringing up the fact that you coach and that makes you more of an expert or that your opinion means more. This is a discussion board. If you have a differing opinion, then fine, but frankly I`m quite tired of hearing that your a coach. For goodness sakes ELA, I know your a coach. Why do you want to constantly bring that fact up??You are not the only one on here that wants to continually bring it up. So your a coach...big deal. Should the rest of us just quit posting on here because we are not coaches since our opinions don`t mean squat?? I speak of things that I know about. I don`t make stuff up. You are insinuating that USJ and other private schools get their 3 or 4 picks and I`m saying your wrong. Trey Teague was not "picked". He chose to go there at a young age (or at least his parents did). Did you even read the interview? He pretty much admitted that before he played under Marley that he knew very little about football. I can tell you the reason for USJ`s success and that is Coach Mickey Marley. Don`t argue about something that you know nothing about. The fact that you are a coach doesn`t make you an expert on what goes on at USJ. I`ve been around that program long enough to know what changed that program around. So take it for what that is and leave the "I am a coach" stuff for someone else.

You keep sayin and this is your quote..." IF YOU DON'T HAVE SOME TALENT ON THE FOOTBALL TEAM YOU CAN'T WIN GAMES! PERIOD! END OF STORY! Well there is another side to that story Ela. JUST BECAUSE YOU HAVE SOME TALENT ON YOUR TEAM, DOESN`T MEAN YOUR GOING TO WIN Look no further than the Univ.of Alabama who was picked to be #3 in the country and wound up winning 3 games. There was loads of talent on that team.

I posted the interview because I feel like it backs up my notion of what good coaching does, plus I thought it was a nice interview that folks here would enjoy reading. But you just want to tell me for the hundred millionth time that your a coach! Geez! If everyone who posts on this board that isn`t a coach quit posting, you`d be a fairly lonely person here.

But back to Marley...he is the one responsible for the success of that program. The school had never won a playoff game before he arrived. (they had only made the playoffs twice in about 20 years before he got there.)Lake County has all kinds of talent at that school. I`ve seen it. Yet they are a very disfuntional team. Sorry for the rant ELA but Im` just tired of people saying "I`m a coach....you`re not....so therefore I`m right and your wrong!" I don`t care if you disagree, but I also don`t give a hoot if you are a coach either. Here`s another little tid bit for the next time you get the urge to remind me that you are a coach...I`ve been around a lot of coaches during games and have seen my share of what I consider good coaches. I have also been right there on the sidelines with a lot of stupid, stupid coaches. So the fact that you are a coach means nothing to me. There are plenty of people that post here whom I respect their opinion regardless if they are a coach or not and regardless if I agreee with them or not. You are one of them. BUT PLEASE QUIT THE I`M A COACH STUFF!!!!

[nonews]

... hey hon, don't blow a gasket now! Relax, take a deep breath, count to 10 and go OOOOOOOOMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM several times. Give ELA a chance, he doesn't realize yet that holding the chains for years and years at Old Hickory, excuse me I mean Utopia School of Jackson qualifies you as an expert on coaches. Hey, it took a while for the rest of us to come around, give him a break, OK?...

[TheEgoHasLanded]

I think coaching is more important then we think.

 

Look at Maryville. How many of their players go D1? Not to many, but they are always favored to beat teams. Hillsboro, and East both had more talent then them last year and they would have destroyed anyone in 4A even if they didn't see them in the playoffs...They completely shut out Riggs, who was the most talented player in the state.

 

Ezell had some great players, but in the end it came down to coaching...

 

BGA had some of the youngest skill people in D2...they had a sophomore qb and a sophomore runningback, and a pretty young offensive and defensive line...Harding and BCS both had more all state players then they did, but both lost...BGA had 0 turnovers against both Harding and BCS, and even though BCS had more then twice the amount of yardage...BGA was the smarter team and executed in the red zone...WHERE COACHING COMES IN TO PLAY.

 

ELA you are right, if you get to choose 4 players then your team will be in the top 4-8 teams in the state...but so will any team...that doesn't mean you will win.

 

I don't consider anything great until you go to the state championship, win it,or semi finals, thats just how I was raised...

 

Talent will only get you so far, Coaching will win the title...were the lakers more talented then the Kings? Probably not, yeah they had shaq and kobe, but that was it, the kings were 8 guys deep and sometimes 9...its luck, hard work, determination, coaching and talent, all rolled in to one...I think both of you guys are right.

[VolunteerGeneral]

Posted by nonews:

... hey hon, don't blow a gasket now! Relax, take a deep breath, count to 10 and go OOOOOOOOMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM several times. Give ELA a chance, he doesn't realize yet that holding the chains for years and years at Old Hickory, excuse me I mean Utopia School of Jackson qualifies you as an expert on coaches. Hey, it took a while for the rest of us to come around, give him a break, OK?...

 

Thanks nonews...that helped :^)

 

Just expressing an opinion.

[ELA]

I have never said that talent alone wins championships, it does require good coaching... what I have tried to say is PLEASE DON'T PLACE ALL OF THE BLAME OR SUCCESS ON A SINGLE INDIVIDUAL! NO COACH EVER WON ANYTHING, not one game, without a good team! Volunteer General you are giving way too much credit to coaches. All I'm saying is you are making GODS out of simple men! I am also saying that MOST of us who do this for a living DO NOT WANT that demi-god status! Not even the great coaches like Clint Satterfield. HERE IS AN OLD QUOTE (paraphrased because I can't remember the exact words) FROM THE 1950's TO THINK ABOUT: "Give any good coach talent and he will win, give a great coach talent and he will win championships, give a great coach a team without talent and he will not win!" This came from Vince Lombardi's book, although he is not the one who came up with the saying. The point is being a coach makes me better qualified to talk about my fellow coaches. It doesn't give me a lock on anything, but I think I can fairly accurately inform you about how most of my fellow associates feel. We don't want to be treated like GODS when we win, and we don't want to be treated like DOGS when we lose. No one can turn a talent less team into a champion! Sometimes you simply "dance with the one who brought you to the dance." Its okay to pat a coach on the back and say, "Well done," or "Good job coach" but my God, don't place his name next to Jesus or Allah! These are just men! By the way, I keep hearing Coach Smiths name used as an example at Ezell-Harding as someone who worked miracles... what was his coaching record as a head coach at Greenbrier (a public school)? I'm not taking anything away from the great work he has done with the Eagles, but I think you must give that talented team a lot of the credit! If he had that much talent at Greenbrier he would have won at that level too, and probably have never moved to Antioch! The point is there are a lot of reasons for a team winning or losing and it is not always to the coach's credit or blame alone! Sometimes it is the assistant coaches who mold a team together, the administration and boosters play a role, and the talent pool (gene pool) makes up about 70% of the equation. Some areas are geographically superior to others for producing great and talented programs. I know some of you may not understand what I'm talking about, but my fellow coaches will understand what I mean, and they will agree!

[swamp]

ELA, calm down... we'll get all this worked out (to the satisfaction of no one) in 2005...

[VolunteerGeneral]

It`s obvious you don`t understand what I`m saying and don`t give me any credit in what I`m talking about. I`m not making anyone to be a deity. I`m simply saying that he is the one responsible for the turnaround at that school.ELA, I have no doubt that talented athletes at any school can and should make a difference.I don`t disagree with you on that.The point is that it`s coaching that makes them go. I don`t know if you`re familiar with Lake County or not. But I`ve seen them play and they do have several athletes on that team, always have, but they had no good coaching or leadership to speak of and they were horrible last year.This is what I`m talking about. This whole matter came up because someone suggested that private schools may have better coaches and you in your "holier than thou...I`m a coach" attitude said no that`s not it. Well I`m saying it very well could be a major part of it. I`ve seen it happen, so there`s no way you can convince me otherwise. I don`t care how much talent or potential talent a kid has, if he doesn`t have someone there to teach him how to play the game then it`s a waste. Was Cloudland loaded with athletes last year? Probably not. I`d say it was pujo`s brother who got the most out of those kids as possible. He got them to give their all, to play to the best of their ability, showed and taught them how to execute, andgot them to play as one instead of individuals. That`s coaching.

You never did say how much you liked the interview with Trey. In case you didn`t read it, hear is one of the questions and answers...

 

TS. Now you have had the upmost privilege of playing for some pretty famous coaches. Mickey Marley at USJ, Philip Fulmer at UT and Mike Shanahan in Denver. Now if you could pick one, which one would you enjoy playing under for the rest of your career?

 

TT: Marley. He definitely taught me the most, but of course, I was at a stage in my football career when I didn't know that much about the game, and was still learning. I am still learning now of course, but as far as friendship goes I am still very close to the USJ coaches. I think coach Marley is a rare case in high school football, because a lot of coaches with his success might have moved on, but he is still at USJ developing a great program. So, that makes it great to come back in the off-season and talk about football and reminisce a little bit.

 

Hmmmmm....here`s a guy that`s played college football at the top level and also is playing in the NFL and he credits Marley for really teaching him the most. Just trust me on this one ELA...Marley is the reason for USJ`s success. It may be a difficult concept for you to grasp, but it does happen.And your right...Marley doesn`t want to be put on a pedestal and I`m not doing that. I`m simply giving him credit for what he has done. Just ask Trey Teague..I`m sure he would agree.

[ELA]

WITHOUT TALENT, no coach wins championships! Very simple truth. The coach is just a manager, someone must be willing and able to follow his/her instructions.

 

I've known hundreds of great coaches who never had a team go beyond the second round of the playoffs, and yet, they were better coaches than some of those who won championships. As I review many of these games, the big difference I see is talent.

 

Volunteer General what your asking me to do is set aside a life-time of coaching experience and knowledge because in your vast experiences in the field you think you know the truth on this, and every other subject we debate. I'll stand by what I know to be true, and you can believe whatever you want about the "diety of coaching." Without talent, it is impossible to win the big game!

[Edited by ELA on 7/23/02 4:08P]

[TheEgoHasLanded]

You guys are great man, every few days this board starts to slow down...and then it just explodes, it brings a tear to my eye.

 

ELA, will you please comment on the math thing posted on the other thread...I am still waiting for you, and anyone else who comments on this board, like nonews,chakra, pujo, swamp,panfan, and the rest of you guys to tell me what is wrong with Volgen's plan. I admitted that what the "possible upcoming problems" that I saw were wrong, all I heard from most of you guys was that ELA's was better, never learned why though...oh yeah cus yall don't play the privates that way.

 

BTW, there are still two or three slots open for fantasy football, that might be the only way I can shut some of you guys up.

[VolunteerGeneral]

ELA....I`m posting on what I know is FACT. Why is that soooooo hard for you to grasp? I also said that I`m NOT treating Marley as a deity, so why would you stoop to calling him names ELA? I`m just giving someone credit for something that he did. You`re the one acting like a deity with your holier than thou attitude. Geez...All I`m saying is that he turned the program around. Do you not think a coach is capable of that??? Obviously not because you want to keep arguing about it.

 

 

You still didn`t say whether or not you enjoyed the interview.

[Edited by VolunteerGeneral on 7/23/02 5:11P]