Umpiring Question

[ibball44]

In the Notre Dame-Livingston Academy game, the score is tied 2-2 in the 8th. We have three umpires handling this game. One is stationed down the third base line about ten feet from the bag. Livingston Academy's batter hits a grounder down the left field line, and the third base umpire screams "foul ball" and waves his arms indicating the ball was foul. The home plate umpire points fair, but does not say anything. Notre Dame's left fielder, hearing "foul ball" does not play the ball. Livingston Academy runner takes second. Home plate umpire and third base umpire converse. Then they call over the first base umpire who had no angle whatsoever. They then say that the ball was fair and the runner remains at second. He, of course, scored the winning run on a balk. Thoughts?

Edited May 16, 2012 by ibball44

[Soxfan1]

In the Notre Dame-Livingston Academy game, the score is tied 2-2 in the 8th. We have three umpires handling this game. One is stationed down the third base line about ten feet from the bag. Livingston Academy's batter hits a grounder down the left field line, and the third base umpire screams "foul ball" and waves his arms indicating the ball was foul. The home plate umpire points fair, but does not say anything. Notre Dame's left fielder, hearing "foul ball" does not play the ball. Livingston Academy runner takes second. Home plate umpire and third base umpire converse. Then they call over the first base umpire who had no angle whatsoever. They then say that the ball was fair and the runner remains at second. He, of course, scored the winning run on a balk. Thoughts?

If the field ump waived his arms...dead ball.

[glock22]

It is the 3rd base umpires call.

 

In FED ball, if an umpire, either umpire, calls it foul, it's foul.

 

Sounds like they kicked it, but I wasn't there.

Edited May 16, 2012 by glock22

[Redog]

A grounder down left field? When did it start "grounding" in the infield? Over 3rd base? I "think" the homeplate/head umpire can over rule a call in the field. An umpire should signal fair or foul and not yell, since fair can sound like foul and vice versa. I would have my outfielder always play as if the ball were fair - especially in a 2-2 game. In this case, take nothing for granted. Wondering who called the balk? Tough way to lose a game unless the balk was obvious.

[FightinIllini]

It is the 3rd base umpires call.

 

In FED ball, if an umpire, either umpire, calls it foul, it's foul.

 

Sounds like they kicked it, but I wasn't there.

 

 

Umps blew the call, once called foul by third base ump, then always foul.... but was the ball past the bag at third?

Edited May 16, 2012 by FightinIllini

[crazzyness]

If ANY ump calls a ball foul, the play is dead, regaurdless of who calls it. Looks like they kicked it.

[ibball44]

I was standing about 15 feet from home plate looking directly down the 3rd base line. From that angle it looked like the ball crossed directly over the bag before going into foul terrotory, and thus, SHOULD have been called a fair ball. The problem is the umpire whose call it was screams "foul ball" and waves it foul. In my years of coaching, if any umpire calls it foul, it IS foul and a dead ball because the advantage gained by the batting team would be too great. As I mentioned earlier, the 3rd base umpire went running down the line calling it foul and waving his arms to indicate dead ball. While it would be ideal for the outfielder to continue to play the ball, I cannot fault a high school player for believing the closest umpire when he yells foul ball.

 

The balk occurred after that runner was bunted to 3rd. With an 0-2 count, Livingston Academy's hitter stepped in to the box, waited until the pitcher was mid-way through his delivery and jumped out of the box, waving his arms and screaming "TIME TIME TIME." Notre Dame's pitcher did not complete his delivery. Thus, the balk was called.

Edited May 16, 2012 by ibball44

[imontheline]

Close foul ball calls should be verbalized, the closer the call the more emphatic it should be. There can be a foul changed to fair in some rule sets. If the umpire inadvertently calls foul but immediately corrects himself and says something like "that's a fair ball, PLAY IT!" AND the play is not affected by it. But not in high school. Once called foul it is foul.

 

A batter cannot cause a balk by your description. That is a situation where everyone resets and you start over. But maybe the balk was called due to something else.

[buffbball]

Umpires are getting sorry. They are the biggest crooks in the world. They come strolling in right at game time for everyone to see. I am from northeast TN and they were terrible all year. I didn't see a game where there was not some form of controversy or a missed call. They need to be punished and pay cut it nothing more than a buddy system. Only job in America where when you screw up and cost someone nothing is done to you. They need to let the coaches evaluate them and if you miss an obvious call be fined and serve a suspension.

[ksgovols]

Idk. Meteorologists have it pretty easy.

 

Typically U1 has it to the base and then it's U3's. Over the bag and then foul is a tough call, but I think it's a dead ball once U3 hollers foul because of the advantage.

[TwoSix]

Idk. Meteorologists have it pretty easy.

 

Typically U1 has it to the base and then it's U3's. Over the bag and then foul is a tough call, but I think it's a dead ball once U3 hollers foul because of the advantage.

The unfortunate part is if they blow it as it sound like they did.... No appeal just be told do better job next time

[haebvols]

Umps blew the call, once called foul by third base ump, then always foul.... but was the ball past the bag at third?

Shouldn't matter, once the ump with the call makes the call, play is dead. TSSAA really should look into some of these guys and see what behind this crap. Might surface some unwanted findings. Clearly called foul, yet home make another ruling and leave 1st out of it. OMG!