Baylor v McCallie ending

[WRESTLERX]

I would bet every year since CoachT was started - after every State Tournament people post complaints about the Officials.

I know I will get ripped for this but NO Officlal is out to get any wrestler. Most make very little after expenses- $65 to TSSAA $35 to a local association, travel, uniform Etc. there is very little money in it.

I know its been said over and over- it everyone here thinks they can do better- step up- pay the money take the test- buy the uniform- go to the state meeting and a half dozen local meeting and make it better- if your not part of the solution your part of the problem- with officiating 50% at best will always be unhappy.

But learn the rules b4 you come here clueless!

[TO338]

I, like many...have been traveling to matches and tournaments all over the country for several years. TN refs are inferior to most referees that I've seen. They just are. I believe they can get better, but they've got to lose the attitude and let it be about the wrestling. Try not to be the difference. Sometimes you're forced into making a call with a huge impact. Just don't go looking for it...try to go unseen.

 

Every TN tournament I go to, I get the sense that most of the referee's feel a need to take control of the action and be the focal point of the match.

 

TN refs are like an over-bearing girlfriend. They try too hard, and the harder they try...it just makes it worse.

[olebule34]

ghouse-

 

http://matref0.tripod.com/Articles/NFHS_Rules_Photos.pdf

 

Scroll down to pic 92.

 

 

92. (7-1-5p) The chicken wing is

illegal when the pressure is

parallel to the long axis

 

There are many reasons to dislike Baylor, but I think you are grasping at straws with this one. The parent I talked to said that the Baylor 120lber wanted to give it a go and his dad wanted him to try to wrestle for the team. It was his choice. CBHS proved they are the best team in the state.

[heresyourstupidsign]

Also an interesting anecdote / funny story from this year that is somewhat germane to the discussion occurring here around team points and penalties, etc.

 

When CBHS was winning the tournament in Granite City, IL earlier this year it became obvious to many in the crowd from several teams that CBHS might win the tournament with a score of 666. As anyone who has spent time with the Book of Revelations or someone knowledgeable about pop-culture number references, there is clearly some significance to that number.

 

The CBHS staff was encouraged by many groups in the stands to do something about the score as they just didn't want that to be the final number. When their last wrestler competing lost his final match, assuring the score would not change, the CBHS coach went to the table and asked the official to deduct a team point. The official declined saying they couldn't do that without an actual rules infraction. At that point the CBHS coach chose to argue a judgement call (the pin) from the match that had just ended until he was hit for a penalty by the official.

 

The result was a standing ovation from about half of the gym and CBHS finishing with a final score 665.

 

Wow! Thanks for enforcing our perception of your holier than thou persona.

You remind me of something I read about Nick Saban. My favorite football player was interviewed after Saban visited him at home for recruiting purposes. His answer in reply to what he thought about Saban was " Theres not much to him except that he sure can talk, he just goes on and on and on even when nobody is listening".

Edited February 6, 2013 by heresyourstupidsign

[matman3]

That Ref needs to be banned!!! Can not believe anyone would make that call!

[texas23]

Also an interesting anecdote / funny story from this year that is somewhat germane to the discussion occurring here around team points and penalties, etc.

 

When CBHS was winning the tournament in Granite City, IL earlier this year it became obvious to many in the crowd from several teams that CBHS might win the tournament with a score of 666. As anyone who has spent time with the Book of Revelations or someone knowledgeable about pop-culture number references, there is clearly some significance to that number.

 

The CBHS staff was encouraged by many groups in the stands to do something about the score as they just didn't want that to be the final number. When their last wrestler competing lost his final match, assuring the score would not change, the CBHS coach went to the table and asked the official to deduct a team point. The official declined saying they couldn't do that without an actual rules infraction. At that point the CBHS coach chose to argue a judgement call (the pin) from the match that had just ended until he was hit for a penalty by the official.

 

The result was a standing ovation from about half of the gym and CBHS finishing with a final score 665.

 

that is the funniest story in awhile. The voodoo that may come with the number 666 and the superstition that those in the crowd felt the need to applaud a deliberate change. LOL.....love it.

[smwwrest]

Wow! Thanks for enforcing our perception of your holier than thou persona.

You remind me of something I read about Nick Saban. My favorite football player was interviewed after Saban visited him at home for recruiting purposes. His answer in reply to what he thought about Saban was " Theres not much to him except that he sure can talk, he just goes on and on and on even when nobody is listening".

 

Actually if you knew ghouse which many in the TN wrestling community do, you would know that its not a "holier" than thou persona, it just the fact that he's a heck of a lot smarter than most of us. He studies the sport as much as anyone I know and when you add it to an extremely bright person its a powerful combination. His rankings are unbiased and meticulously researched and given alot of credibility across the state. His posts are intelligent and well thought through. What have you done?

[ghouse]

Ms Finebody has an opening for you SirGhomer...Bet you kicked arse in those 5000 word essays!

 

Bcb iii

 

Nope always had trouble staying under the word limit... but if you think I am verbose you should try prrof-reading one of my wife's papers!

 

ghouse,

 

I am stunned you would make that comment about respect for the Baylor staff. Was this necessary?

 

Realistically very little (if anything) that is stated on this message board is necessary.

 

I doubt the fact that I made that statement stunned too many people that know me. I will pretty typically given an open and honest evaluation of what I think.

 

ghouse-

 

http://matref0.tripo...ules_Photos.pdf

 

Scroll down to pic 92.

 

 

92. (7-1-5p) The chicken wing is

illegal when the pressure is

parallel to the long axis

 

There are many reasons to dislike Baylor, but I think you are grasping at straws with this one. The parent I talked to said that the Baylor 120lber wanted to give it a go and his dad wanted him to try to wrestle for the team. It was his choice. CBHS proved they are the best team in the state.

 

That website is one I refer to often if my case book and rule book aren't around (like when I am at work) and is precisely what I consulted again before making my post. It actually proves my point so not sure why you would bring it up in a manner that seems contrary.

 

There was no pressure parallel to the long axis of the body (spine). The pressure was entirely perpendicular to the body at the time the move was stopped and well before then. Besides, the wrestler was not injured on the side where the chicken wing was locked in, his injury appeared to be to his right shoulder. The right should had a half applied that looks like it should have been stopped for potentially dangerous... not sure I have ever seen a half called illegal though I suppose it is possible if you felt that it was flagrant or found some other odd justification. To Powell's credit he immediately went back to referee's position ready to wrestle before being pulled from that match.

 

Realistically that isn't something I can blame on the Baylor staff... that was just an incorrect call on the nature of the hold by the official in my opinion. The Baylor staff was likely doing the right thing at the time by pulling a kid who was not physically able to handle the demands of live competition. He just never should have been out there to begin with.

 

Whether the parent and wrestler wanted to give it a go or not I would question the wisdom and motivation of any staff, my own included, that puts a wrestler on the mat who has not practiced live in nearly 2 months. Let's keep the long-term interest of the athletes (kids) in the forefront as compared to short-term benefits.

[Sommers]

If this was at a lower level of competition (not against #23 in a huge match at state) and we may have a senior wanting a little mat time before his upcoming surgery, I completely understand. We did the exact same thing for our Legrand last year and he surprised many of us, no strategy... it was His choice for Himself (i was surprised he even weighed in, much less ran out on the mat) and he hoped to avoid some bonus points in the duals with no expectation of what eventually happened. I can assure you coach Bray & I would have been shocked if he ever threw in the white towel. To his credit, it sounds like this fine young man (baylor kid) wanted to catch up and avoid a major...... or maybe even Win!!

Edited February 7, 2013 by Sommers

[heresyourstupidsign]

 

 

Actually if you knew ghouse which many in the TN wrestling community do, you would know that its not a "holier" than thou persona, it just the fact that he's a heck of a lot smarter than most of us. He studies the sport as much as anyone I know and when you add it to an extremely bright person its a powerful combination. His rankings are unbiased and meticulously researched and given alot of credibility across the state. His posts are intelligent and well thought through. What have you done?

Let me guess, you are a Cbhs fan? Have you read the posts he has written? He tries to persuade everyone to agree with his opinion by writing eloquently written dissertations that actually say nothing but a nicely worded view of his personal opinion. He actually has the audacity to attack the Baylor coaches integrity when his own team has wrestlers who walk on the mat like its the entrance to UFC fight and then start taunting the opponent right after the referee blows the whistle. Then you have a wrestler who many in the state view as being the dirtiest wrestler in years who constantly appears to be over zealous in his physicality and just got kicked out of a match for it. Let me ask this question. Have you seem any of the Baylor kids act this way? I have never seen it and I can guarantee you they wouldn't tolerate that kind of embarrassing behaviour. So while you are busy casting stones you need to take a step back and look at your own kids and program.

[2blLeg]

Have you read the posts he has written? He tries to persuade everyone to agree with his opinion by writing eloquently written dissertations that actually say nothing but a nicely worded view of his personal opinion.

 

I'm sorry, did I miss something. Is that NOT the point of a debate or arguement? To try and get the other person to see it your way? If it weren't then why argue. Like my wife says to me "you always think you are right", and my canned response. "Of course I do, why would I think I'm wrong and stand here and argue with you about something?" Seriously, if you like him or not, (which those that have grown to know him do), you have got to at least appreciate the fact that he takes time to give a detailed answer. He could simply say "you are a moron, and you are wrong", both of which might be true, but he doesn't insult, nor take offense. Just takes the time to help educate others. And for that, I am thankful.

[heresyourstupidsign]

Further more, why are you still crying and whining about that call? You won the match and its over. No matter how much you type and try to distort the facts the arm bar was completely parallel to the long axis of the body. The Cbhs wrestlers fist was on the top of the Baylor kids shoulder . That's as parallel as it gets. The half had nothing at all to do with the call even if that's what caused the injury. I would love for the 120 lbers parents to post the video for no other reason than to show everyone how much your long winded revelations actually are just a bunch of purple tinted hot air.