DII may form 2 classes for other sports

[Antwan]

A proposal has been submitted to the Board of Control by the DII Committee, endorsed by all DII schools,  that 2 classes be created for basketball, baseball, soccer and softball.  This creates a much more competitive atmosphere for the small schools in DII.

The proposal might be discussed at the special February meeting, but will probably be decided one way or another by the March meeting.

 

If passed, would some DI privates jump?

I recently had a conversation with some folks from D1-1A private schools and they indicated they may jump to DII if the multiplier is voted in by the Board of Control.

Gee...that would be a shame. Isn't that ironic? If they had already done that...there would be no need for any of this debate.

Edited January 15, 2004 by Antwan

[RedUp]

"The problem is with adding the extra teams to Spring Fling. Baseball in particular is somewhat pressed for facilities with 32 teams, let alone 40."

 

The proposal I heard being floated was to split DII in half for these sports and allow 4 from AA and 4 from A to go to state in Basketball, Baseball, Softball and Soccer. That way no additional teams are taken to state (8 go now), no additional TSSAA staff needed, and one more state champ is crowned.

 

On the one hand, another champ seems to water down everyone, but on the other hand, having BA and Kings competing for the same championship is crazy.

 

Haven't heard what they are going to do with bowling.

[ELA]

A proposal has been submitted to the Board of Control by the DII Committee, endorsed by all DII schools,  that 2 classes be created for basketball, baseball, soccer and softball.  This creates a much more competitive atmosphere for the small schools in DII.

The proposal might be discussed at the special February meeting, but will probably be decided one way or another by the March meeting.

 

If passed, would some DI privates jump?

I recently had a conversation with some folks from D1-1A private schools and they indicated they may jump to DII if the multiplier is voted in by the Board of Control.

Gee...that would be a shame. Isn't that ironic? If they had already done that...there would be no need for any of this debate.

Look at it this way. If you were a head coach of an ABC school in D1-1A, would you rather jump up to DI-2A and play against Milan, Huntingdon, etc. or move to DII-1A or 2A? I think that's the sort of debate that may be going on! If I were them, I would look at my travel time to games, then probably switch IF I could talk a few more of my local rivals into going with me!

[Baldcoach]

Which all brings up the interesting question posed on another thread some time ago...if the non-financial aid schools can switch and compete with the current DII crop then what does that do to the financial aid argument?

 

On the other hand, if the financial aid argument is really valid and does give an advantage then why would the non-aid schools want to subject themselves to playing those schools.

 

Those who are anti-private (1aman et al) are in a pickle. If you say the non-aid schools SHOULD be switched you are killing the argument used for DivII in the first place OR you are simply saying that you want them punished for winning by having to play on an unlevel field (your battle cry).

 

Admitting the aid thing was all bogus or that you don't really want level playing fields but punishment...not a happy position for you guys.

 

 

[1AMAN]

I got no problem with the financial aid schools, at least when they were in D1 they played up. BA could have done like the CPA's and Boyd's et al and played at their enrollment and never lost a game, but they played as high as they could and the Riverdales pitched one and got rid of them. As Antwan said, if these private schools would just go ahead and play up we wouldn't be having this debate. And throw the open enrollment publics like the Memphis schools and Maryville in that category as well. Open enrollment is the advantage here. Separate them from the closed enrollment schools and this will all work out.

[Antwan]

A proposal has been submitted to the Board of Control by the DII Committee, endorsed by all DII schools,  that 2 classes be created for basketball, baseball, soccer and softball.  This creates a much more competitive atmosphere for the small schools in DII.

The proposal might be discussed at the special February meeting, but will probably be decided one way or another by the March meeting.

 

If passed, would some DI privates jump?

I recently had a conversation with some folks from D1-1A private schools and they indicated they may jump to DII if the multiplier is voted in by the Board of Control.

Gee...that would be a shame. Isn't that ironic? If they had already done that...there would be no need for any of this debate.

Look at it this way. If you were a head coach of an ABC school in D1-1A, would you rather jump up to DI-2A and play against Milan, Huntingdon, etc. or move to DII-1A or 2A? I think that's the sort of debate that may be going on! If I were them, I would look at my travel time to games, then probably switch IF I could talk a few more of my local rivals into going with me!

ELA...surely you aren't suggesting that the privates would duck the step up in competition. You've got to be kidding...right? All they have to do is work harder and hire better coaches. They could beat Huntingdon and Milan in no time.

Edited January 16, 2004 by Antwan

[Baldcoach]

I got no problem with the financial aid schools, at least when they were in D1 they played up. BA could have done like the CPA's and Boyd's et al and played at their enrollment and never lost a game, but they played as high as they could and the Riverdales pitched one and got rid of them. As Antwan said, if these private schools would just go ahead and play up we wouldn't be having this debate. And throw the open enrollment publics like the Memphis schools and Maryville in that category as well. Open enrollment is the advantage here. Separate them from the closed enrollment schools and this will all work out.

 

And should the dominate public schools play up too? If not then why not as I am thinking that your argument sounds good but is really just private punishing.

[Baldcoach]

Look at it this way. If you were a head coach of an ABC school in D1-1A, would you rather jump up to DI-2A and play against Milan, Huntingdon, etc. or move to DII-1A or 2A? I think that's the sort of debate that may be going on! If I were them, I would look at my travel time to games, then probably switch IF I could talk a few more of my local rivals into going with me!

 

ELA...surely you aren't suggesting that the privates would duck the step up in competition. You've got to be kidding...right? All they have to do is work harder and hire better coaches. They could beat Huntingdon and Milan in no time.

 

Antwan,

 

The schools in DivII 1a are no easier than the schools in DivI 2a. Both have some great teams. Any decision made will not be made based on "ducking competition". You seem to proceed from the assumption that all the 1a privates care about is athletic domination... sad that you attribute such base motives to us. Makes me wonder what your motivations are?

[1AMAN]

 

And should the dominate public schools play up too? If not then why not as I am thinking that your argument sounds good but is really just private punishing.

I said that the open enrollment schools should be moved up as well. You all keep saying So Pitt or whoever in 1A is, so fine, move them up as well. If some closed enrollment school has a good run for several years, so be it, good for them. At least they had to build this 'dynasty' from what they were dealt.

[CSense]

Which all brings up the interesting question posed on another thread some time ago...if the non-financial aid schools can switch and compete with the current DII crop then what does that do to the financial aid argument?

 

On the other hand, if the financial aid argument is really valid and does give an advantage then why would the non-aid schools want to subject themselves to playing those schools.

 

Those who are anti-private (1aman et al) are in a pickle. If you say the non-aid schools SHOULD be switched you are killing the argument used for DivII in the first place OR you are simply saying that you want them punished for winning by having to play on an unlevel field (your battle cry).

 

Admitting the aid thing was all bogus or that you don't really want level playing fields but punishment...not a happy position for you guys.

 

 

With all due respect Baldcoach, there is one other possibility.

 

The DI private schools may already be more similar to DII privates (aid, recruiting), so they are just moving where they should have been all along.

 

You failed to bring that possibility up in your post, though I would help you out there.

[Baldcoach]

 

And should the dominate public schools play up too? If not then why not as I am thinking that your argument sounds good but is really just private punishing.

I said that the open enrollment schools should be moved up as well. You all keep saying So Pitt or whoever in 1A is, so fine, move them up as well. If some closed enrollment school has a good run for several years, so be it, good for them. At least they had to build this 'dynasty' from what they were dealt.

 

Ahh, so any school that is winning should be forced to move up except small rural, closed enrollment publics. I can't say I am surprised...I predicted the witch hunt would go here. Sadly it still won't stop...soon even the small rural publics will be arguing over differences among them because that is the result of the poisonous mindset that is being put forth.

 

"We are the Borg. All differences will be assimilated into our own perfection or destroyed. There will be no negotiations. Lower your shields and prepare for boarding."

 

BTW, everyone "builds their dynasty from what they are dealt". Small privates actually have as small a pool of students to pull from as rural publics. It may be spread over a larger geographic area but it is more diffuse. The area that students come from is not a factor UNLESS you are accusing them of recruiting athletes illegally...is that what you mean by the "what they are dealt" phrase?

[Baldcoach]

With all due respect Baldcoach, there is one other possibility.

 

The DI private schools may already be more similar to DII privates (aid, recruiting), so they are just moving where they should have been all along.

 

You failed to bring that possibility up in your post, though I would help you out there.

 

Thank you Csense. I really do appreciate your candor. At least someone is willing to admit that what ACTUALLY lies behind a lot of the calls for a move is the suspicion that the small privates are already doing illegal things.

 

After all, all good programs cheat to get that way, don't you think? Especially the private schools...ugh...those Christian schools are the lowest down dirtiest no gooders of all! They recruit with no money and of course athletic ability is given first priority over any other thing in the interview process.

 

Why, I was down at a small private the other day (the reigning 1a champs no less) and every one of their Football players was 6'4" and 240 pounds of 4.5 forty time muscle...and that was the backs! You should have seen the linemen!! And of course the girls on the basketball team were all over 6'. In fact, the whole student body pretty much are college athletic material...this school alone has sent 227 students to NCAA 1a schools and has 17 current pro alumni.

 

Or maybe, just maybe I was down there talking to my 5 returning upper class Linebackers, the largest of whom is 170 pounds. Perhaps...don't shoot me, just thinking out loud...just perhaps the privates put athletics way down the list of importance. It is just possible that Spirituality and academics are first. NAAAAAAAHHH! That would mean they are winning fair and square.