Baylor Crown Stolen!

[wristbar]

WrestleSBA,

I just think that it is funny that you mention controversy when there was none. The Memphis following that year was just upset that their stud was beaten.

[gofish]

Does anyone know if the table or ref, when warning the coach, has to let the coach know he has been warned?

[usfjim]

WrestleSBA,

I just think that it is funny that you mention controversy when there was none. The Memphis following that year was just upset that their stud was beaten.

wristbar, if you want to pick a fight, i'm the person (see how i'm politically correct) to pick it with. i was there, know brian, talked with him, etc., etc., and used it as an example of how things can happen when at "someone else's house". you must be prepared for..............dare i say it............injustices............there, i did it.

 

gofish, good question that needs to be answered.

[WrestleSBA]

usfjim,

Thanks for the back-up but I think I am most certianly also in this discussion.

 

Wristbar,

I know Brian and I have talked with him about the match (and also seen the tape on it). I believe it was one of the best matches I have ever seen. However, I do not merely think it was just a case of the "Memphis following" being upset at a stud being beaten. While we do take pride in our successful wrestlers, just as you do, I do think that we are all capable of admitting when there are questionable calls. This happens and it is just part of the sport. That is why I have said more than once in this forum that in areas where that might happen then you just have to make it so that the refs can't affect the outcome, i.e. make it clear who the better wrestler was. Unfortunately I don't think in that particular match either wrestler did this and for that reason there will always be controversy. As someone who considers Brain Hall a friend I would ask that we now drop this issue out of respect for both he and Mr. Dunning. If you wish to argue with me please find something else to do so ( I am sure there is plenty out there ).

[MillsHalf]

usfjim-my understanding of the above question is as follows:

 

If the referee considers the actions of the coach to be unsportsmanlike conduct, no warning is necessary or required. Same goes for flagrant misconduct. The only time a warning is given is for misconduct. These definitions are on the NFHS website/rulebook.

Edited February 10, 2004 by MillsHalf

[usfjim]

usfjim-my understanding of the above question is as follows:

 

If the referee considers the actions of the coach to be unsportsmanlike conduct, no warning is necessary or required. Same goes for flagrant misconduct. The only time a warning is given is for misconduct. These definitions are on the NFHS website/rulebook.

millshalf, can you give me some layman term examples to differentiate between unsportsmanlike conduct, flagrant misconduct and "run of the mill" misconduct?

 

thanks from someone attempting to better understand.

 

also, thanks for the backup, wrestle sba. i'm sure i'll see you this weekend.

[WrestleSBA]

usfjim,

 

You are most deservedly welcome. I hope to see you at Regionals on Friday but I may not make it out until Saturday. Keep an eye out, I will probably be the only one is SBA gear there. I just like to keep up with all the boys here in the West.

[CoachDelgado]

KKW,

Don't know. But isn't that in itself a problem? Why is it that the best refs in the state, J. Simpson, Craft, Elsie, Mara, Vineyard, Heffington, Bowler, etc. are not officiating at the duals? Kenny Alexander, Tim Abel and Danny Gilbert were there. I didn't recognize 4 of the other 5 officials.

[downforthecount]

usfjim, here goes:

flagrant-any action, verbal or physical, that the official deems is bad enough for a participant/coach to be immediately ejected. Ex. coach jumps out of chair is in the middle of the mat screaming "you stupid ###### you blew another call". I guess that's a silly example, but I've never seen a coach ejected for flagrant. Biting by a wrestler is an automatic flagrant.

 

unsportsman-any action, verbal or physical, that the official deems is delaying the orderly progression of the match. Exs by the coach can be riding the official from the coach's chair to the point where the official can't concentrate on the match because of the nonsense coming out of the corner. A more specific ex is a coach yelling "he's stalling ref" very loud, over and over. The coach may even be right. But when the coach starts calling the match it no longer seems that teams are given an equal shot. Coaches standing in their corner with their fist raised indicating the other wrestler is stalling has been considered inciteful (unsporting), and of course any direct verbal attacks get irritable pretty quickly. But, the official should know the difference between a coach yelling "that's a terrible call"-describing the situation, and "you're a terrible ref"-direct attack. All of the above are penalized without warning, with the exception of "that's a terrible call".

 

misconduct-only happens at the table after the coach requests a meeting with the official. Misconduct is questioning judgement, "how can you call that near fall, both shoulders were three inches off the mat". Misconduct is also the coach requesting the conference because he believes the official has misapplied a federation rule. The example comment is misconduct on both accounts. First, the official's judgement is that the defensive wrestler was held in near fall criteria (questioning judgement), and second the rules state near fall criteria is met if both shoulders are held within FOUR inches for two seconds so the rule was not misapplied as the coach claimed. The first incident gets the head coach a warning, the second by any member of the coaching staff gets the head coach a penalty, and the third by any member of the coaching staff gets the head coach removed.

 

This may be more than you asked for, but...

[usfjim]

downforthecount, thanks for the explanation.