Is this a real rule?

[1moreDBmom]

QUOTE(catsbackr @ May 9 2007 - 01:58 PM) 826455498[/snapback]The reply quoting the Casebook was to answer the question regarding warmup pitches for a new pitcher and why an umpire wouldn't allow another ball on the field to allow the new pitcher to warm up prior to taking his warm up pitches. If a change is going to be made, make the change and let the new pitcher warm up from the mound.

 

As far as a rule regarding, can the first baseman throw grounders to the infield while the new pitcher takes his 8 pitches goes, I don't know if there is a rule or not. I don't have my rule book here at work, but I'll look it up tonight. IMHO, I just think it's unnecesary. And would I allow it? Probably not, unless there was a position change as well as a pitching change and then I still probably wouldn't allow it.

 

 

 

A coach can go to the mound and not pull the pitcher...or wait and pull the pitcher after the pu walks out to tell him "time up" so can a first baseman make tosses to the second baseman for instance until the pu comes out and then the coach say well blue, I can't talk no sense into this lughead of a pitcher of mine so I recon I will just swap him and the first baseman.

 

what the difference in throwing a ball in the air and throwin it on the ground while the coach "visits the pitcher on the mound".. at that point only the coach of the team in the field actually knows whether or not their is going to be a pitching change..assuming of course its his first mound visit that inning.

[turnin two]

Delmonico at UT was the first I ever saw do this when he'd bring Todd Helton off first base to pitch. I never saw an umpire stop it at the college level and I've seen it numerous times throughout the country since.

 

If it doesnt delay the game, (coaches are allow two visits per inning and total of 3 per game before having to change pitchers) I dont see any problem with it. Some kids need a couple extra throws to get loose. Otherwise, do away with bullpens.

[riverdaleman]

i dont have a rule book handy but there are to be no balls on the field during a time out or a new pitcher warming up

[catsbackr]

From the 2007 NFHS Baseball Rules:

 

Rule 10, Section 2 and 3, Article g: Article 2: The umpire-in-chief has sole authority to forfeit a game and has jurisdiction over any rules matters not mentioned in 10-2-1 and not assigned to the field umpire in 10-3. Article 3-g: Make final decision on points not covered by the rules.

 

So, in essence, if the umpire-in-chief does not want to allow another ball on the field while a pitcher warms up, he has the right to disallow it. And on the other hand, if he does want to allow it, he may.

[1moreDBmom]

QUOTE(catsbackr @ May 9 2007 - 08:14 PM) 826455729[/snapback]From the 2007 NFHS Baseball Rules:

 

Rule 10, Section 2 and 3, Article g: Article 2: The umpire-in-chief has sole authority to forfeit a game and has jurisdiction over any rules matters not mentioned in 10-2-1 and not assigned to the field umpire in 10-3. Article 3-g: Make final decision on points not covered by the rules.

 

So, in essence, if the umpire-in-chief does not want to allow another ball on the field while a pitcher warms up, he has the right to disallow it. An on the other hand, if he does want to allow it, he may.

 

 

 

There you go catsbackr.

 

That is the rule put in there to cover the lack of a specific!

 

Bravo. I had forgotton about that until you listed it here.

 

They are right in saying that there is no rule that says specifically that the fielders cannot throw a ball around while a coach is visiting his pitcher on the mound.

 

But here it is plain as day.. if the rules do not spefically say yes or no on a subject the UIC gets to decide.

 

Does not get any clearer then that.

[CUBCADET]

QUOTE(turnin two @ May 9 2007 - 01:31 PM) 826455523[/snapback]Delmonico at UT was the first I ever saw do this when he'd bring Todd Helton off first base to pitch. I never saw an umpire stop it at the college level and I've seen it numerous times throughout the country since.

 

If it doesnt delay the game, (coaches are allow two visits per inning and total of 3 per game before having to change pitchers) I dont see any problem with it. Some kids need a couple extra throws to get loose. Otherwise, do away with bullpens.

 

maybe ought to check on that one there "coach"

The rule is that the manager/coach may make three trips to the mound to the same pitcher in the game,(in the same inning if he wants to) and then he must pull him on the fourth trip. It does not constitute a trip if he pulls the pitcher from the game..This is a very hard to understand and enforce rule. There is NOT a " second visit per inning rule" in high school ball..

Most coaches have a good idea if their pitcher is gonna need relief soon, and usually send the guy ( already in the game) that is going to go to the mound, down to the 'pen to get loose between innings if he is not batting . That way, if the need arises, the reliever can come to the mound in the middle of an inning and only take his 8 allowed throws..I have seen some kids that went down to the 'pen during their teams time at bat, come into the game and only take 4-5 pitches and then look in and tell the ump he's ready...

the pitcher is only supposed to have 8 pitches at the start of the game and then only 5 between innings. If it is cold, most umps will allow more if they have any doubt as to whether the player is warm or not.But really, it makes the game boring and seem to drag on when the umps let the kids take 8-12 pitches between innings...The good ones count the pitches and keep the game moving, which makes it better and less boring sometimes. There is even a speed up rules in place so it doesnt have to take so much time between innings..It is not just to let the pitcher get a little rest from running the bases, it is mainly to let the catcher get his gear back on and be ready to hit the field as soon as last out of inning is over..

[putboobieincoach]

here is another thing that just happened today... during our championship game today, a relief pitcher was warming up so they brought another ball onto the field so the infield could throw it around. of course our coach is gonna say something bout it because it is exactly the same thing as our first baseman throwin the ball back and forth during a mound visit. that just doesnt seen fair to me.

[Gerry Bertier]

Almost every college team does this if they have a reliever playing in the game. The coach comes out talks to the pitcher while the player warms up with someone another fielder playing. Coach goes back into the dugout and after the next batter, the fielder comes into pitch. I have seen this done over a dozen times and the UIC hasn't said a thing about it. Seems like the UIC last night had something up his butt.

[1moreDBmom]

QUOTE(Gerry Bertier @ May 10 2007 - 12:21 AM) 826456134[/snapback]Almost every college team does this if they have a reliever playing in the game. The coach comes out talks to the pitcher while the player warms up with someone another fielder playing. Coach goes back into the dugout and after the next batter, the fielder comes into pitch. I have seen this done over a dozen times and the UIC hasn't said a thing about it. Seems like the UIC last night had something up his butt.

 

 

Tell us you didn't offer to help him pull it out???? He might be a christmas BaaaaHummmBug and still has 12 shiny reindeer up his butt! That could make for a grouchy umpire no doubt!

 

On a good umpire note we had some of the best I have ever seen the last 3 games...no players, coaches or fans getting really nasty over calls. When the calls are good there is just not much you can say. Consistancy from the umpire is usually enough to keep everyone happy in the game.

[catsbackr]

QUOTE(Gerry Bertier @ May 9 2007 - 10:21 PM) 826456134[/snapback]Almost every college team does this if they have a reliever playing in the game. The coach comes out talks to the pitcher while the player warms up with someone another fielder playing. Coach goes back into the dugout and after the next batter, the fielder comes into pitch. I have seen this done over a dozen times and the UIC hasn't said a thing about it. Seems like the UIC last night had something up his butt.

 

I tried to be clear, but maybe I wasn't.

 

I posted the NFHS rule, not the NCAA rule, it is different, somewhat.

 

Basically, read the Fed rule. If the umpire wants to allow it, he can. If he doesn't want to allow it, he can.

 

Pretty simple.

 

What's the big deal?

[shut up and play]

I am pretty sure that I was sitting in on the rules meeting when this same situation was brought up. I know that ondeck posted this a few posts ago as well, but Gene McNeese clear as day said that there was nothing wrong with it. Bottom Line, umpire trying to be seen.

And as far as the rule posted earlier, how many other situations could that rule justify. Everyone knows that rule. When you have umpires who think they are big time and struggle making out or safe calls you will no doubt have an umpire make an ignorant judgment for the sole purpose of being seen and poking his authoritative chest out.

[putboobieincoach]

QUOTE(catsbackr @ May 10 2007 - 07:39 AM) 826456233[/snapback]I tried to be clear, but maybe I wasn't.

 

I posted the NFHS rule, not the NCAA rule, it is different, somewhat.

 

Basically, read the Fed rule. If the umpire wants to allow it, he can. If he doesn't want to allow it, he can.

 

Pretty simple.

 

What's the big deal?

 

but if it is against what his boss said then it is the wrong call!!! and yes it is a big deal if it wasnt a big deal we wouldnt be talkin bout it right now!!!