mccallie losing wrestlers?

[mocs2011]

No need to omit. I'm not part of the Baylor coaching staff, but I have consistently heard the same policy. The high school team brings up middle school wrestlers only when there is no viable high school wrestler in the weight class. Baylor has a seperate practice facility and coaching staff for the lower school students. In Mr Duncan's situation 5 years ago, I recall Baylor had returning state place finishers in his weights of choice so he moved on. If you attend the Baylor upper school you can challenge for the weight class of your choice.

 

Glad the topic was brought up, I have been wanting to ask this one for a while. Please define what determines whether a Baylor wrestler is "viable" or "not viable"? Also who at Baylor makes the "viability" decision and based on what criteria? Is this decision made your 8th grade or freshman year? Is it permanent or can you go from "non-viable" to "viable" Its been a tough policy for outsiders to follow in the past.

 

In TJ Hooker's situation, Baylor had a "viable" 9th or 10th grader to wrestle in a spot. However, the next year when Zach Watson came up, there was a 9th grader wrestler at that weight, but that poor guy was deemed "not viable"? "Sorry son, your just not a viable wrestler, so we're bringing up the middle school guy to replace you." Seems kind of like a stigma that would be hard to overcome.

 

This stuff is kind of fun to watch from a comfortable distance.

[cbg]

Glad the topic was brought up, I have been wanting to ask this one for a while. Please define what determines whether a Baylor wrestler is "viable" or "not viable"? Also who at Baylor makes the "viability" decision and based on what criteria? Is this decision made your 8th grade or freshman year? Is it permanent or can you go from "non-viable" to "viable" Its been a tough policy for outsiders to follow in the past.

 

In TJ Hooker's situation, Baylor had a "viable" 9th or 10th grader to wrestle in a spot. However, the next year when Zach Watson came up, there was a 9th grader wrestler at that weight, but that poor guy was deemed "not viable"? "Sorry son, your just not a viable wrestler, so we're bringing up the middle school guy to replace you." Seems kind of like a stigma that would be hard to overcome.

 

This stuff is kind of fun to watch from a comfortable distance.

From your post it sounds like "viable" is a moving target that depends on just how good the high school wrestler may be. Would any part of the decision be based on how much $$$$ someones family donates to the school?

[mocs2011]

From your post it sounds like "viable" is a moving target that depends on just how good the high school wrestler may be. Would any part of the decision be based on how much $$$$ someones family donates to the school?

 

Its a good question. I know when I wrestled against Baylor in high school, the guys always seemed of the "viable" variety because they always seemed pretty good. I probably should have lost weight to catch one of the lower weights that might have previously been deemed "not viable". This assumes of course that viable or non viable is based on talent which may or may not be correct, I guess.

Edited March 8, 2011 by mocs2011

[bewhoyouis]

Glad the topic was brought up, I have been wanting to ask this one for a while. Please define what determines whether a Baylor wrestler is "viable" or "not viable"? Also who at Baylor makes the "viability" decision and based on what criteria? Is this decision made your 8th grade or freshman year? Is it permanent or can you go from "non-viable" to "viable" Its been a tough policy for outsiders to follow in the past.

 

In TJ Hooker's situation, Baylor had a "viable" 9th or 10th grader to wrestle in a spot. However, the next year when Zach Watson came up, there was a 9th grader wrestler at that weight, but that poor guy was deemed "not viable"? "Sorry son, your just not a viable wrestler, so we're bringing up the middle school guy to replace you." Seems kind of like a stigma that would be hard to overcome.

 

This stuff is kind of fun to watch from a comfortable distance.

 

I post very rarely on this board, as I am not as witty as BCB or smart as Raier76, but I am Zach's Dad and I really didn't like the tone of this comment. I will tell you that Jim Morgan's policy for Lower School wrestlers has always been the same. If you knew anything about Jim Morgan you would know that he is a man of character and in no way bent the rules to favor the wrestler you are referring to over TJ. I know that has been claimed over the last few years, but I can assure that was not part of the decision.

 

I can tell you what the "deal" was with Zach, as I was in the meeting with the coaches. He was told that he would have to challenge and that it must be a decisive difference for him to win the starting position. So.. it was not assumed that the other wrestler was not viable, as he had to wrestle 2 challenge matches to win the spot.

 

I think TJ's accomplishment is tremendous and so do the coaches at Baylor. I believe that all things happen for a reason, and it worked out great for TJ at McCallie. Good luck next year at Maryland.

[takedown3]

From your post it sounds like "viable" is a moving target that depends on just how good the high school wrestler may be. Would any part of the decision be based on how much $$$$ someones family donates to the school?

 

Do you really believe that Morgan, Van Deusen and now Nelson ever checked in with the development office when it came time to start wrestlers? You're delusional.

[mocs2011]

I post very rarely on this board, as I am not as witty as BCB or smart as Raier76, but I am Zach's Dad and I really didn't like the tone of this comment. I will tell you that Jim Morgan's policy for Lower School wrestlers has always been the same. If you knew anything about Jim Morgan you would know that he is a man of character and in no way bent the rules to favor the wrestler you are referring to over TJ. I know that has been claimed over the last few years, but I can assure that was not part of the decision.

 

I can tell you what the "deal" was with Zach, as I was in the meeting with the coaches. He was told that he would have to challenge and that it must be a decisive difference for him to win the starting position. So.. it was not assumed that the other wrestler was not viable, as he had to wrestle 2 challenge matches to win the spot.

 

I think TJ's accomplishment is tremendous and so do the coaches at Baylor. I believe that all things happen for a reason, and it worked out great for TJ at McCallie. Good luck next year at Maryland.

 

Nothing bad said or intended towards Zach. He will likely be another five time state champion and is very deserving of his accolades!!!!

 

The earlier post was directed at what seems like a subjective and easily adapted policy. The questions would never have been raised, but what appears to be a Baylor supporter used the term "not viable". I don't like using the term "not viable" or its tone with regards to a high school wrestler. In the end, no program or coach is above being asked questions about their policies and actions especially when they appear inconsistent or wrong.

[T135]

I post very rarely on this board, as I am not as witty as BCB or smart as Raier76, but I am Zach's Dad and I really didn't like the tone of this comment. I will tell you that Jim Morgan's policy for Lower School wrestlers has always been the same. If you knew anything about Jim Morgan you would know that he is a man of character and in no way bent the rules to favor the wrestler you are referring to over TJ. I know that has been claimed over the last few years, but I can assure that was not part of the decision.

 

I can tell you what the "deal" was with Zach, as I was in the meeting with the coaches. He was told that he would have to challenge and that it must be a decisive difference for him to win the starting position. So.. it was not assumed that the other wrestler was not viable, as he had to wrestle 2 challenge matches to win the spot.

 

I think TJ's accomplishment is tremendous and so do the coaches at Baylor. I believe that all things happen for a reason, and it worked out great for TJ at McCallie. Good luck next year at Maryland.

This was TJ's story Baylor had no 103 TJ was not going to make 103 so wanted to challenge for 112 they had a 2xx state champ at 112 so no challenge so to become a 5x state champ we left .Was there a 103 when zacks turn came i don't know . But i can tell you that zack would have been my 103 if ther was 10 kids there. zack works his butt off just like TJ .No hard feelings it worked out fine for us the fit at mccallie was great .Good luck Zack . Tracy Duncan

[RedRobin]

In the end, no program or coach is above being asked questions about their policies and actions especially when they appear inconsistent or wrong.

 

As long as there are no allegations of rulebreaking, I don't see how this is anyone's concern other than those at the school in question. They have a right to run their program any way they want to - from my perspective, they have been doing a mighty fine job of it.

[mocs2011]

As long as there are no allegations of rulebreaking, I don't see how this is anyone's concern other than those at the school in question. They have a right to run their program any way they want to - from my perspective, they have been doing a mighty fine job of it.

 

It was ynotme, a Baylor fan, that was espousing the greatness of the program and someone else corrected them on the open weight class statement. Then ynotme decided to correct them by explaining the school's "viable" wrestler policy. Probably a good thing that up and coming 8th graders and parents with a goal for 5 state championships are aware up front to allow them to head straight to another school, if that's there choice. I was having a little fun with it, but it is good information for 8th graders and others to know...

[mtnrasslin]

It was ynotme, a Baylor fan, that was espousing the greatness of the program and someone else corrected them on the open weight class statement. Then ynotme decided to correct them by explaining the school's "viable" wrestler policy. Probably a good thing that up and coming 8th graders and parents with a goal for 5 state championships are aware up front to allow them to head straight to another school, if that's there choice. I was having a little fun with it, but it is good information for 8th graders and others to know...

Good point. Why would any good 8th grade wrestler want to be part of a first class program with first class coaches and first class facilities that offers the likelihood of being on multiple state championship teams while getting a first class education?

Edited March 11, 2011 by mtnrasslin

[anotherback]

Good point. Why would any good 8th grade wrestler want to be part of a first class program with first class coaches and first class facilities that offers the likelihood of being on multiple state championship teams while getting a first class education?

I'll take a guess and say it must be because of over zealous fans.

[mtnrasslin]

I'll take a guess and say it must be because of over zealous fans.

I think you are right. No good 8th grade wrestler wants to be part of a program that has an energetic multi-generational fan base to support them. Quiet, poorly attended wrestling matches where the kids don't have all that noise to distract them is always the way to go.