MBA vs. Trinity

[pecos]

I would assume you are privileged to this information (100%) because you are an EHS admissions faculty, EHS headmaster, EHS Board of Trustee, AD, or you went to the 7 players and families and asked for this info.

Can you divulge how this info was obtained? It is not available to the average Coach T poster.

When it came time to talk to private schools many years ago, there was no 100% given and the application went to a clearing house independent of the school for approval for the 3 schools I talked to. EHS was not one of the schools.

Has this changed or is it different at EHS?

 

Sorry, I didn't make myself clear. These students families paid 100% of the tuition and did not recieve any need based financial aid. I made this statement to refute the insinuation that EHS only wins because all thier athletes are getting 100% of the tuition paid by the school and this is an instance where the opposite was true.

[KWoodroof]

Why do you guys keeep debating this topic? Citing all the codes, etc...just let it go! As long as you win, people will always point fingers. Great coaches just win...period. Coach Flatt, Bowers, Pack, just fill in the blank--those guys will win anywhere. Why? Because they are better than the other coaches. If talent alone made a great team, then I (as a BA supporter) would have bet the house on Memphis Southwind and Kingsbury, 2 teams we played last year. I played in the 70's and 80's. Guys like Tommy Owen, Carlton Flatt, Calvin Short, Nick Coutrous, Wes Elrod, Bill Derrick, Boots Donnelly, etc, just got it done. They were at the top of their profession. I am tired of hearing Private school fans debating and defending their schools and admission practices. If the rules were played with as loosely as many would believe, how quickly would the TSSAA be on the scene? There are great coaches in the public school ranks such as Rankin, Adylette, Quarles, B Price at Signal Mountain, etc. Coach Shadowens at Blackman is a stud of a coach. Guess what, since they win, they are accused of recruiting! To me, it's part of our society's problem--we seem to want to bring down those that are successful to make us feel better. I wish some on this board would quit defending their team's success and just accept it as a by product of a great program.

You're right to an extent, especially in the way you frame it. But from another perspective, these insinuations (they lack the evidence to be accusations) go to the very core of our accomplishments. It says they're illegitimate, that we won through cheating. I tend to take slurs at my integrity very seriously, and looking beyond my little world, I disapprove of meritless aspersions on anyone else's integrity. I'd love to believe that Ensworth staff stayed up late at night trying to find new ways to circumvent the rules. I feel that way because I dislike EHS intensely. (As I've stated previously, I have dreams where vikings sail up the Harpeth and set upon Ensworth, razing everything to the very ground, burning the rubble, burying the ashes, and sowing salt so that nothing ever again grows on that tainted location. And since they have a natatorium now, I dream that the vikings use it as a toilet on their way out. I wake up very happy from this dream.) Still, no one has shown me a scintilla of evidence that they've done anything improper, so I think they deserve defense from reasonable people.

[RedRobin]

There was some material along the lines of what you're seeking. I don't remember enough details to say anything definitive, but I believe Ryan and JP II were at the bottom, which seems consistent with your theory. I'm not sure I'm ready to call it "cause and effect" yet, since the opening of JP II took a chunk of students who probably would have gone to Ryan. Still, you have an interesting idea...not sure how we'd prove either theory.

 

 

I agree that this would be an interesting inquiry, but I am not sure that enough data is available to the public to support any legitimate conclusions. Based upon what little data is available, I am also not sure that comparing the parochials with the other privates straight-up would be legitimate. I know that the Roman Catholic schools are subsidized by their respective Diocese, to various extents. That at least provides partial explanation for the huge discrepancy in tuition between the Catholics and the others; compare JP2 @ $12,075 for non-Catholics, Ryan @ $15,330 for non-Catholics and CBHS @ $9,500 for all students to MBA@ $20,425, Ensworth @ $20,870 and USN @ $18,340. Most of the Catholic schools also offer substantial discounts for families that are practicing Roman Catholics (Ryan, for instance, charges tuition of $10,885 for "Catholics with Parish support", $12,185 for Catholics without Parish support" and $15,330 for "non-Catholics" while JP2 charges $10,600 for "tithing Catholics" and $12,075 for "all others"). Several of these school also offer discounts for families with multiple children attending (I know that Ensworth does not). My point here is only that any legitimate comparison of financial aid would need to take these additional sources of funding and discounts into account.

 

One interesting piece of information that is available on the respective school web sites is that 23% of MBA students receive financial aid while 19.04% of Ensworth HS students receive financial aid. 18% of students at USN (which has an enrollment similar to that of Ensworth but which competes athletically in the smaller-school D2-A classification) receive financial aid.

[RollBigRed]

What would you like me to chirp about? The fact that if you think Ensworth is playing by some different rules then you clearly do not understand the TSSAA rule book? The fact that Ensworth has more players on their team that have attended the school since pre-first grade (a/k/a kindergarten) than does any other school of which I am aware? The fact that in their short history, Ensworth has had as much, if not more, success on the football field as has MBA while having less players recruited to play football at Division 1 schools (which in my mind calls into question your "recruit" theory)? The fact that the winning touchdown pass in last year's championship game was thrown by a kid from Brentwood and caught by a kid from Belle Meade? I really don't understand what you are trying to say or imply, so why don't you either man up and say whatever it is that you think needs to be said or quit taking cheap shots at a program about which you obviously know very little?

This is the point RedRobin, since you appear to be SOS... Stuck on Stupid....Read my lips. I will speak slowly. EHS is buying a football team. Out of your 41 man roster, half (or more) are on financial aid. i.e. paid to play. Also check your facts on CPA and Lipscomb. They have more kids attending their High School than Ensworth lower sends to EHS. Finally, in point of fact, MBA does not have baby sitting...a/k/a K-6. Since when is $22k tuition cheap....oh unless you recruit kids who can't make it out of HS...know any of those Big Bird?.

[RollBigRed]

You are, I am sure, speaking from experience and are of course correct. Thanks for the reminder that these boards exist to discuss the enjoyment we all get from athletic effort and achievement. I look forward to a lot of great action in D2-AA this year!

I am having a blast!!!! Thanks for the enjoyment BigBird.

[KWoodroof]

This is the point RedRobin, since you appear to be SOS... Stuck on Stupid....Read my lips. I will speak slowly. EHS is buying a football team. Out of your 41 man roster, half (or more) are on financial aid. i.e. paid to play. Also check your facts on CPA and Lipscomb. They have more kids attending their High School than Ensworth lower sends to EHS. Finally, in point of fact, MBA does not have baby sitting...a/k/a K-6. Since when is $22k tuition cheap....oh unless you recruit kids who can't make it out of HS...know any of those Big Bird?.

Sadly, I can name one from MBA this season...no point in mentioning the young man's name, but it doesn't take a lot of work to figure it out.

 

You say a lot of stuff, but you offer no proof at all. No source for your figures...nothing.

 

Once upon a time, MBA turned out gentlemen who could disagree without being disagreeable. And when it was necessary to be unpleasant, it was done with a dry humor and wit that also made it amusing. In short, you're making us look bad.

[shakinthefat]

Out of your 41 man roster, half (or more) are on financial aid. i.e. paid to play. Also check your facts on CPA and Lipscomb.

 

Where can I find this information on who gets financial aid, not only Ensworth, but every school being discussed?

Where are these facts?

[doct]

Where can I find this information on who gets financial aid, not only Ensworth, but every school being discussed?

Where are these facts?

Yet another thread hijacked by the obsession over financial aid. The BA and MBA thread (this week's big game for both teams) has not had a post in over a day, while this thread has run out of control over recruiting accusations. For gosh sakes, all DII teams give financial aid. Also, who gets aid is a confidential matter at each school. Move on!

[Custer]

Yet another thread hijacked by the obsession over financial aid. The BA and MBA thread (this week's big game for both teams) has not had a post in over a day, while this thread has run out of control over recruiting accusations. For gosh sakes, all DII teams give financial aid. Also, who gets aid is a confidential matter at each school. Move on!

 

I started this thread, and as you mentioned, it's gone all whack. Maybe a moderator can close this thread before it reaches 20 pages of financial aid arguments?

 

Please post in the MBA/BA thread, one thread I also started

 

Peace

[goodknight]

Yet another thread hijacked by the obsession over financial aid. The BA and MBA thread (this week's big game for both teams) has not had a post in over a day, while this thread has run out of control over recruiting accusations. For gosh sakes, all DII teams give financial aid. Also, who gets aid is a confidential matter at each school. Move on!

 

well said move on.

Edited August 31, 2011 by goodknight

[PHargis]

I started this thread, and as you mentioned, it's gone all whack. Maybe a moderator can close this thread before it reaches 20 pages of financial aid arguments?

 

Please post in the MBA/BA thread, one thread I also started

 

Peace

But yes and see how much pub you got during that time and its not even preadmission time.