Never too early, Coaching Vacancies

[HereComesTheCloser]

On 4/28/2021 at 10:04 AM, WhereYouAt said:

what message does these JCM hires and the packages they are getting send to Coach McNeal and Coach Fuller? 

A friend and I were having this exact conversation just the other day. Let's say the JCM coaches and SS coaches visit the exact same 8th graders prep stars living room in Madison County.

SS can say, you can come here and be a part of an immediate dynasty. Mens program has a 58-2 record in the last two years. 3 out of the last 4 years at the dance in M'boro. (including cancelled covid year)

Womens program using the slow building dynasty approach. Former alumnus Coach McNeal played at SS. Just reached his 200 win milestone. With the new alignment appears to be a direct path for the dance for years to come.

Our programs are steeped in history.

Principal - former Lady Hawk player

Athletic Director - former Lady Hawk player

Mens coach - former Hawk player

Ladies coach - former Hawk player

Combined in '20-'21, our programs were 48-4.

 

All that can be part of the next four years of your life.

Or not.

 

#HawkNation

#HereComesTheCloser

[tradertwo]

On 8/21/2021 at 10:57 AM, HereComesTheCloser said:

A friend and I were having this exact conversation just the other day. Let's say the JCM coaches and SS coaches visit the exact same 8th graders prep stars living room in Madison County.

SS can say, you can come here and be a part of an immediate dynasty. Mens program has a 58-2 record in the last two years. 3 out of the last 4 years at the dance in M'boro. (including cancelled covid year)

Womens program using the slow building dynasty approach. Former alumnus Coach McNeal played at SS. Just reached his 200 win milestone. With the new alignment appears to be a direct path for the dance for years to come.

Our programs are steeped in history.

Principal - former Lady Hawk player

Athletic Director - former Lady Hawk player

Mens coach - former Hawk player

Ladies coach - former Hawk player

Combined in '20-'21, our programs were 48-4.

 

All that can be part of the next four years of your life.

Or not.

 

#HawkNation

#HereComesTheCloser

Very good information, but didn't attempt to answer the question at all. With everything considered that you posted, how does the Director of Schools and BOE justify hiring JCM coaches to a more lucrative, yet less demanding contract than the proven ones at JSS?

[YouAlreadyKnow]

17 hours ago, tradertwo said:

Very good information, but didn't attempt to answer the question at all. With everything considered that you posted, how does the Director of Schools and BOE justify hiring JCM coaches to a more lucrative, yet less demanding contract than the proven ones at JSS?

Most high schools have a pay scale and pay chart so all employees in the district make the same thing while performing the same task. That is crazy. If a coach has more responsibilities then they should get paid more. I'm not saying the other coaches don't deserve more pay because they do but I'm not a fan of every coach in a district making the same thing. Everybody knows some coaches at smaller schools in the same district don't do half the work of other coaches and still get paid the same while having much lower expectations to win. This is a fact all over high school sports.

[tradertwo]

3 hours ago, YouAlreadyKnow said:

Most high schools have a pay scale and pay chart so all employees in the district make the same thing while performing the same task. That is crazy. If a coach has more responsibilities then they should get paid more. I'm not saying the other coaches don't deserve more pay because they do but I'm not a fan of every coach in a district making the same thing. Everybody knows some coaches at smaller schools in the same district don't do half the work of other coaches and still get paid the same while having much lower expectations to win. This is a fact all over high school sports.

If I'm reading this the wrong way I'll apologize ahead of the post, but if I'm not misinterpreting your thoughts, you are wrong. Coaches are (99%) teachers too...some get to include their sport within the framework of their daily schedule and some do not. Some have grounds keeping duties included and some do not. Some have 70 kids and 10 assistant coaches to monitor, and some have 18 and one assistant, but all coaches within the same system deserve to be paid the same as their counterparts within the system. The coaches hired at JCM were hired to coach their sport and nothing else other than facilitate their own sport's feeder system (most coaches would love that), while their counterparts at South Side, North Side, ect...still have classroom duties and a substantially smaller salary. Crazy to think that this isn't fair??? I can't understand what logic would suggest that it is.

[YouAlreadyKnow]

20 hours ago, tradertwo said:

If I'm reading this the wrong way I'll apologize ahead of the post, but if I'm not misinterpreting your thoughts, you are wrong. Coaches are (99%) teachers too...some get to include their sport within the framework of their daily schedule and some do not. Some have grounds keeping duties included and some do not. Some have 70 kids and 10 assistant coaches to monitor, and some have 18 and one assistant, but all coaches within the same system deserve to be paid the same as their counterparts within the system. The coaches hired at JCM were hired to coach their sport and nothing else other than facilitate their own sport's feeder system (most coaches would love that), while their counterparts at South Side, North Side, ect...still have classroom duties and a substantially smaller salary. Crazy to think that this isn't fair??? I can't understand what logic would suggest that it is.

My first post was confusing...

 

The logic is the coach that is doing more work should be paid more. example: If all the coach is doing is running a football program then they should be paid a great sum of money for running a football program. BUT, if a coach is running a football program and teaching classes they should be paid more because they are doing more work. ALSO, if a coach is running a football program at a large school "70 kids, 10 assistants" then they should be paid more than the other coach "18 kids, 1 assistant" This whole idea of financial equity as a result of a title is ridiculous. If I am a baseball coach and do nothing in the summer, nothing in the fall, play 25 games and get beat first round of the playoffs do I deserve the same pay as a coach who plays a full summer schedule, fall workouts and fall schedule, winter workouts, 45 game schedule and makes a deep run in the play offs? No, I don't. Make Sense? 

 

[BelmontRebel]

23 hours ago, tradertwo said:

If I'm reading this the wrong way I'll apologize ahead of the post, but if I'm not misinterpreting your thoughts, you are wrong. Coaches are (99%) teachers too...some get to include their sport within the framework of their daily schedule and some do not. Some have grounds keeping duties included and some do not. Some have 70 kids and 10 assistant coaches to monitor, and some have 18 and one assistant, but all coaches within the same system deserve to be paid the same as their counterparts within the system. The coaches hired at JCM were hired to coach their sport and nothing else other than facilitate their own sport's feeder system (most coaches would love that), while their counterparts at South Side, North Side, ect...still have classroom duties and a substantially smaller salary. Crazy to think that this isn't fair??? I can't understand what logic would suggest that it is.

Most school systems pay their coaches based on the sport and their overall salary.  If basketball is 12% then the coach gets that X the salary added to it.  What a coach does with their time is up to them.  

[YouAlreadyKnow]

23 minutes ago, BelmontRebel said:

Most school systems pay their coaches based on the sport and their overall salary.  If basketball is 12% then the coach gets that X the salary added to it.  What a coach does with their time is up to them.  

and that is a problem.12% of 50K is only 6 grand... awful pay regardless of size of school or coach work ethic. sad

[tradertwo]

13 hours ago, YouAlreadyKnow said:

My first post was confusing...

 

The logic is the coach that is doing more work should be paid more. example: If all the coach is doing is running a football program then they should be paid a great sum of money for running a football program. BUT, if a coach is running a football program and teaching classes they should be paid more because they are doing more work. ALSO, if a coach is running a football program at a large school "70 kids, 10 assistants" then they should be paid more than the other coach "18 kids, 1 assistant" This whole idea of financial equity as a result of a title is ridiculous. If I am a baseball coach and do nothing in the summer, nothing in the fall, play 25 games and get beat first round of the playoffs do I deserve the same pay as a coach who plays a full summer schedule, fall workouts and fall schedule, winter workouts, 45 game schedule and makes a deep run in the play offs? No, I don't. Make Sense? 

 

What a coach chooses to do with their opportunity is up to them. The baseball guy who does nothing in the summer and fall, plays a region schedule only and exits the district tourney in round one loses his job...coach two gets lucrative offers from bigger schools. 

  My question was how do you justify JCM's coaches being paid more to do less? Sort of connected to your point of view of unequal pay within a system, but contrary to your position of being paid more because they do more.

[YouAlreadyKnow]

On 8/27/2021 at 11:12 PM, tradertwo said:

What a coach chooses to do with their opportunity is up to them. The baseball guy who does nothing in the summer and fall, plays a region schedule only and exits the district tourney in round one loses his job...coach two gets lucrative offers from bigger schools. 

  My question was how do you justify JCM's coaches being paid more to do less? Sort of connected to your point of view of unequal pay within a system, but contrary to your position of being paid more because they do more.

I'm not sure what the "Director of Basketball and Football Operations" positions are all about. I don't know if they are doing more work or not. I'm sure they have a ton of responsibility. I would say the other coaches in the district, even though they teach a couple classes, may not have the responsibilities that the directors of operations have in the other schools. 

My point is pay the coaches what they deserve to be paid based on their work not based on the fact that they have a position. I understand it is subjective but so is the hiring process. If they JCM coaches deserve what they are getting then good for them. If the other coaches in the district deserve more then pay them, if they don't then don't pay them.

[pioneer42]

On 8/27/2021 at 11:12 PM, tradertwo said:

What a coach chooses to do with their opportunity is up to them. The baseball guy who does nothing in the summer and fall, plays a region schedule only and exits the district tourney in round one loses his job...coach two gets lucrative offers from bigger schools. 

  My question was how do you justify JCM's coaches being paid more to do less? Sort of connected to your point of view of unequal pay within a system, but contrary to your position of being paid more because they do more.

I wouldn’t trade any coach in the state right now for Wilkins at Gibson County. He deserves to make a bunch. Don’t know what he makes but he has the Nick Saban work ethic and he has total respect from his players. It is 0% luck and 100% hustle. 

Edited August 31, 2021 by pioneer42

[YouAlreadyKnow]

9 minutes ago, pioneer42 said:

I wouldn’t trade any coach in the state right now for Wilkins at Gibson County. He deserves to make a bunch. Don’t know what he makes but he has the Nick Saban work ethic and he has total respect from his players. It is 0% luck and 100% hustle. 

Agree. Will high school ever get to the point to where a coach can negotiate a contract? I sort of feel like that is starting to happen in some districts. But then somebody gets mad because they feel like someone is not being treated equal. Just doesn't make sense to me at all paying everyone the exact same money just because they are the head coach or assistant coach in the same district. Some coaches should be paid more and the Gibson County Coach is one of them. A contract for coaches would also create some stability for programs. Especially those programs that change coaches every other year.  

[pioneer42]

1 hour ago, YouAlreadyKnow said:

Agree. Will high school ever get to the point to where a coach can negotiate a contract? I sort of feel like that is starting to happen in some districts. But then somebody gets mad because they feel like someone is not being treated equal. Just doesn't make sense to me at all paying everyone the exact same money just because they are the head coach or assistant coach in the same district. Some coaches should be paid more and the Gibson County Coach is one of them. A contract for coaches would also create some stability for programs. Especially those programs that change coaches every other year.  

I am not a teacher and have no idea how that works. His assistants work hard too. Do think personally there are more out there that are working on a time clock more than are working for a Gold Ball. The passion for winning and the true love for the sport and working with kids should outweigh the paycheck even though these coaches need to be paid their worth. Gibson County’s girls has coaches that are not looking at the clock or the day and instead are looking to win and develop kids on the court and off the court.