Sanders and Davis who really won

[Hodg-E2]

So who really won the match at 145. i know the title was givin to Sanders who i think deserves it but who do ya'll think should get it?

[nywrestler]

Watch the video. This has nothing to do with stalling. Sanders may have looked better wrestling but he was cautioned 3 times. The ref did not remember the 3rd

caution and did not believe the score table. There is no question on this one.

[SPED]

I agree. This is not an opinion question. No one is denying that Sanders is the state champion, but the rules clearly state that on the third caution a point is rewarded which would have given Bond the match. There is nothing to do now, except talk about it.

[Stroke]

understand that caution is not warning

 

you have warnings and penalites for STALLING, this wasnt stalling.

 

you have cautions and penalties for false or incorrect starts, this is what you had.

 

ok, the refs blew it. the scorer had it right.

 

on this board there was some confusion about the franklin coaches in the chair, who was in the chair? why didnt they sit on the scorers table until they were forceably removed?

 

say what you will, but who blew it worse? the refs, the coaches, or the daddy?

 

intriguing.....

 

stroker

[SPED]

Stroke - it was the refs, without a doubt. sure the coaches could've maybe forced it a little more but they wouldn't have had to if the refs hadn't messed up in the first place. not attacking referees just stating that these particular refs messed up this time. and the dad was also only responding to the wrong call...

[Stroke]

without a doubt, the refs blew it first

 

the coaches blew it second,

 

the daddy might have blown it before Christmas.

 

Now who wasnt in the chair?

 

stroke

[rblrstlr]

1. 3 cautions for false start = 1 point should have been awarded - end of match!

 

2. FHS & Mont Central coaches were at score table and never left the mat area.

 

3. Score Keeper (student) recognized that a point should have been awarded.

 

4. Ref would not admit he (or peers) may have made an error. Stated the student must of made a mistake on bout sheet & disregarded the challenge by FHS Coaches. This is the problem!

 

Does the TSSAA really think they are better than the olympics? Was this ref, the head ref for the tournament? Did he consult w/ TSSAA before making his 'final' decision? Did he really understand TSSAA rules?

 

If Carter refuses to recognize both as State Champions - FHS should file a compliant against the official & request change to rules on questioning match scores. TSSAA rules are probably so old, most of them probably don't make sense!

 

If in doubt, buy the TSSAA tape - see for yourself! You might even contact some FHS or Mont Central parent, they may sell you a copy of their tape cheaper.

Edited February 25, 2004 by rblrstlr

[sundancer]

Stroke - Don't think it really matters who was in the chair, as all FHS Coaches went to score table to challenge the score and final outcome.

 

Rbl... - Great post!

 

To all others, both of these young men are great wrestlers and they showed it by going into double overtime. I'd like to say that I'm proud of both of the high schools represented, their wrestling programs and these two young men! You all deserve recognition for a great performance at the 2004 State Tournament.

[CoachDelgado]

Did he really understand TSSAA rules?

 

If Carter refuses to recognize both as State Champions - FHS should file a compliant against the official & request change to rules on questioning match scores.  TSSAA rules are probably so old, most of them probably don't make sense!

 

I have not seen a tape so I will not judge one way or the other on the situation. What I will comment on is the rules you refer to. They are not TSSAA rules. The rules are National Federation rules. TSSAA has a history of not deviating from the rules as written by the NFHS. The idea that "TSSAA rules are so old" is somewhat ridiculous.

Edited February 25, 2004 by CoachDelgado

[coachmasters]

I said it before and I will say it again...If the Franklin Coaches had gone to the table when the 3rd caution happened the match would have ended and the Franklin wrestler would have won. I can guarantee you that if it was a Kenwood wrestler who deserved the point on the 3rd caution you would have had to call the National Guard in to make me leave the table so that a match could continue that should have been over at the point that the 3rd caution was called.

[Bobvark]

Rule book states that as long as the offended wrestler does not leave the mat, the match is not over. Had anyone kept Bond on the mat the argument would have ment something, but since he left the mat, match over no matter how many mistakes were made.

 

Mistake #1 nobody went to the table after 3rd caution (assist. ref, coach or ref)

Mistake #2 Bond left the mat

 

I personally like both wrestlers, and wish them both luck. Now if we could just move on, I don't think this topic is healthy for either boy.

 

I feel bad enough that every time Luke looks at his medal, he thinks did I really win. And every time Bond looks at his medal he thinks what if....

 

Good luck to both boys in the future. Also props to both guys, no chairs were thrown, or clocks kicked during the whole episode.

[wildcat1]

i just want to say the same thing i have said in all other posts about this match.....Davis Lost the match and rightfully so since he did not wrestle his type of match. i have never seen him stall or wait out an opponent so much as he did the whole tournament. Sanders is a decent wrestler but if davis had wrestled to his capability he would have blown him away, but as it turned out he didn't and lost.

 

In my opinion the coaches must not have remembered one of the caution calls either until after the match or they would have went directly to the table then and argued the call and at that point probably would have won the arguement. Since they waited til after the match the ref is not going to change his call. It was davis's match to lose from the beginning and he toyed around to long.