Coaches telling her players that they stink

[observations]

If you think I'm overly concerned about what people think of me on here after reading this post, you are wrong. The people that really know me understand what I'm talking about. The people that want to find something wrong with what I say, they will and do...hence your reply. I understand that we are different and I dare not ask anyone to use the methods I use to raise their kids. To each his/her own. What works for me may not work for you. It's all about the kid. We are all different and that's the beauty of it all. My boys get and have gotten the same type treatment and they are good boys, A students and well mannered.

I'm sure they are good boys, perhaps part of why they are good boys is the tender side of love they experienced from their mother or grandmother, could that be too. You don't take replys well, you think you are being attacked, thats not the case at all. And Coach, remember, unless your kids are in their fifties or sixties, you don't know whether all that tough love was productive or not, you just hope and pray it is. A good parent is very similiar to a good coach, they both know that the learning process for either job never stops, only an ignorant person would think otherwise. And lastly, although we all are different as far as names, locations, etc, we also are very much alike as to fears, trust, love, decisions, etc. The best of everything to your children and all of your family.

[trottercoach]

Again, there is a difference between tough love and degrading, demeaning talk. I can teach my kids about real life just fine without swearing at them or making them feel terrible about themselves. You are right there is a huge amount of profanity in the game. It doesn't make it right, it just makes the offenders sound uneducated. It's also possible to be supportive AND be realistic with your kids. My child is going to play at the next level, but she will do it without feeling the need the bully those that are below her or step on them on the way up. You can call it tough love, I can call it verbal abuse. I expect 100% and am disappointed if we don't get it. Do I need to say "hey you *&^%^ tonight?" Nope, all I have to do is say, "that was disappointing, what are you going to do to fix it?" And let me tell you, it is wayyyyyyyy more effective than any profanity. My children know the real world. They also know about respect and you don't just have the respect because there is a whistle around your neck. You have it because it was earned. Being hard on a child is very different from degrading them. Being the coach and the adult is all that responsible parents want when they entrust their children to the teachers and coaches in this world.

 

 

Again, there is a difference between tough love and degrading, demeaning talk. I can teach my kids about real life just fine without swearing at them or making them feel terrible about themselves. You are right there is a huge amount of profanity in the game. It doesn't make it right, it just makes the offenders sound uneducated. It's also possible to be supportive AND be realistic with your kids. My child is going to play at the next level, but she will do it without feeling the need the bully those that are below her or step on them on the way up. You can call it tough love, I can call it verbal abuse. I expect 100% and am disappointed if we don't get it. Do I need to say "hey you *&^%^ tonight?" Nope, all I have to do is say, "that was disappointing, what are you going to do to fix it?" And let me tell you, it is wayyyyyyyy more effective than any profanity. My children know the real world. They also know about respect and you don't just have the respect because there is a whistle around your neck. You have it because it was earned. Being hard on a child is very different from degrading them. Being the coach and the adult is all that responsible parents want when they entrust their children to the teachers and coaches in this world.

yes but coaches cant promise to take the kids to wal-mart or dairy dream everytime they need them to clean their room(do whats expected of them)

[raiderray]

Best post I have ever made and no one comments on it,tell me do you agree or disagree?

 

 

12, 933 posts, And this is your BEST?

 

 

All that practice got you to this?

[ddaddy]

Just wondering what actions other parents would take if their childs coach told them they stink? I personally think this is very unprofessional. If coaches talk like this in front of our kids, its no wonder the kids talk trash on the floor to each other during a game. Does any one know what TSSAA rules are for this kind of behavior.

 

 

Since you are so upset as to come on to this board and vent surley you had a sit down with the coach. How did the meeting go? Please don't give me the line "I'm afraid that they will take it out on my child." If you think your child has been verberally abused then you owe it to her to talk to the coach. Maybe there is more to the story that you could learn???

[coachgat]

Your perception is wrong if you are implying that I did not grow up with tough love. Tough love is by definition when a parent has to make hard choices concerning their child when the child don't agree or like it. It hardly applies to sports and should not since sports should be a pure choice of any child when they have the ability to weigh all factors involved in playing. As for myself, I grew up with a lot of tough love, so you see, your implication is incorrect. And I bet your daughter plays sports too, I just hope it is a decision made by her for her and not to please anyone else. There is one thing that a three year old understands a little bit and that is what pleases a parent. They quickly learn what to say, how to act, and what to do to please a parent. That is still not the end all of what they truly want sometimes. Only when they see that a parent will be just as pleased if they decide to go another direction will they truly feel free to make their choices. This is not easy to accomplish. As to the size and strength of a three year old, it doesn't matter, they are still a three year old in emotions and maturity.

I have been to coaching clinics and profanity does not make any coach a better coach, its just exposing their inability to use the English language correctly. And you seemed to imply that profanity does not matter if you are a successful coach. In other words, if you are winning, who cares. Profanity makes any coach a failure in setting a proper example to a player, if in no other way then to show the player that they cannot speak properly. Would you want anyone using profanity to your daughter or is there a certain age where it just doesn't matter. I never said you were stupid, just a little overzealous about sports in general. Its a lot different teaching or coaching your own kids than someone else's kids. How do I know, because I've done both, probably longer than you have. You may know all the X and O's in the world, but the thing those girls are gonna remember most that you are coaching is how you treated them, hopefully, with dignity and respect, no matter what the outcome of a ballgame. I'm sure you are a good fellow, just be cautious and go slowly so you will always know that any decision any child makes is their own and not some pressured one they really did not want to make. One other thing, I had no zeal to find something wrong with your earlier post, it just disturbed me. Not trying to upset you, just hope you think about it.

 

 

Let me clarify, I'm not saying that using profanity adds wins or losses to a record. I was saying that I've seen or had both kinds of coaches that were either successful or down right sorry. The reason, other than my relationship with God, that I don't use profanity is to set a good example for my players. Even when I coached football, some of the other coaches used it from time to time but I was always the one that was different. I had some players come to me and say that they really appreciated me being there and not cursing. Don't get me wrong, I have some very colorful words to use to tear into a player when they aren't giving me all they got but profanity isn't my thing.

 

Life is a journey full of trying to figure out what works. The more I live, I realize how so little I knew the day before and how much I have to keep digesting to keep my head above the water. Life is too complex to wake up one day and think you got it all figured out.

[coachgat]

I'm sure they are good boys, perhaps part of why they are good boys is the tender side of love they experienced from their mother or grandmother, could that be too. You don't take replys well, you think you are being attacked, thats not the case at all. And Coach, remember, unless your kids are in their fifties or sixties, you don't know whether all that tough love was productive or not, you just hope and pray it is. A good parent is very similiar to a good coach, they both know that the learning process for either job never stops, only an ignorant person would think otherwise. And lastly, although we all are different as far as names, locations, etc, we also are very much alike as to fears, trust, love, decisions, etc. The best of everything to your children and all of your family.

 

 

Hey, thanks and the best to you and yours too. Why can't they have gotten that love and tenderness from me? lol I can wear different hats! You are right. I can only hope and pray that they remember what was taught and cling to it. If you have been attacked as much as I have on here, you would understand the hands going up to protect the face LOL Great post!

[Pantherbert]

Coachgat, you took the words right out of my mouth. I wouldn't tell one of my players that they stink but I have no problem whatsoever telling if their effort stinks. On profanity, I think it's wrong and I don't use it nor do I want to hear it from my players. Understanding though that as a coach you have yell and raise cane in practice at times. You have to be critical at times. It's a part of the job. What I've been taught as a coach is for every critical thing I say to a player for something they do wrong , I turn around and give high praise for something done right.

 

I love my players and I want them to succeed on the court and much more so in life long after they have left the team. I think any coach on this board would say the same.

Edited January 2, 2007 by Pantherbert

[sportsnutt50]

There are a few coaches that use profanity as a second way of communicating. They do not have the child's best interest in mind; only promoting their name and their future. They become so frustrated with the rate of their success that it doesn't matter how they behave themselves. (Anger Management, Ego problem, Wanta Be's). Shame on the administrators of any school for allowing any of these behaviors at their schools. These coaches get paid to conduct a job; why are they being allowed to act inappropiately; would it be allowed at your place of business?

I recall a ref telling a player at the foul line one night that he doesn't know how you (the player) put up with such.

 

The real coaches get remembered for the example they showed these student athetes in dealing with success when it was good and how to handle adversity when times were not as easy. These are the real lessons of life for many of these kids.

 

For many of these kids, high school maybe all some kids aspire to be. I would hope that the examples and the lessons taught by any coach could be carried over into the real world and not the rememberance of a hot headed and frustrated

coach spewing profanity all over the gym at any bump in the road.

 

[papatiger]

there's a difference in yelling and correcting a player as opposed to humiliating one. there is no room for humiliation. Iknow this is girls basketball but I observed Dickson County's boys coach who dressed down a player toward the end of the game with Waverly for doing something wrong. They were winning by 30. He didn't like what he did and he humiliated him on the sideline verbally abusing him and sat him on the bench. Every minute or so he would look back and dig some more. Then he would turn and give him the death stare. I guarantee if that had been my child, he would have had to pay for the humiliation. He was and is classless.

[bball3555]

I am very sad to say this, but I am glad there are some people out there that feel the same way I do. Scream, yell, stomp all you want to, just don't cuss a child. The coach is supposed to be the adult and should control their emotions. It's for sure the ref's expect the players to on the court.

[philtenn]

For me, this has been an extremely interesting thread with valid points given by both sides of the argument. It really represents the conflict I've had about this subject in my own head between self-esteem of the player and the need to teach the player that they must perform regardless of how well-meaning their intent.

 

To me, the question that hasn't been answered is, what is the purpose of your child playing basketball and is the coach aligned with that purpose?

 

There's a lot involved with the first part of that question but I'm going right to the point so forgive me if I seem to ignore a lot of very important side issues: If, as part of your child's basketball experience, you want them to learn to perform even under unbelievable pressure, then being yelled and screamed at (along with a foundation of positive regard ala coachgat's and others' points) is probably going to have to be part of that experience. The mind and body learns to deal with stress by being put under stress. If someone questions your value as a player even through humiliation, then you (the player) have the opportunity to learn how to fend off your own questions about your own value as a player when, for instance, you're standing at the free throw line in your opponent's gym and everybody and their dogs are screaming all kinds of things at you as you shoot to win the game. Now, for this to work, the coach has to have already developed a trusting relationship with the player and the coach probably needs to demonstrate respect and a positive regard in other ways to his/her players. Many professions such as in the military or law enforcement will use this approach to help their people perform under the worst stress.

 

Both sides on this thread are right and both are wrong, in my opinion. As far as the answer to the particular incident that was introduced in the beginning it depends on why that particular parent wants their child playing basketball. There is no doubt that what occurred was a challenge to the child's self-esteem. How damaging it was depends on the child's psychological hardiness before the yelling and the kind of realtionship the coach had with the child. If the purpose of the child's participation is self-esteem with little regard for performance then there really was no place for the yelling. If it's about performing regardless of what's happening in you and around you, then the yelling/humiliation is not so much an issue and could even turn out to be helpful if handled correctly.

 

Finally, I wonder how often coaches yell at their players as part of some plan or strategy to develop or motivate the player and how often they're yelling because they lost their temper. I think one looks significantly different from the other. Please don't take my comments above to mean that yelling/humiliating players should be done freely. It should be done, if done at all, with some forethought, or otherwise the most appropriate thing to do after the yelling is to apologize. Too many coaches use the idea of yelling to toughen up their players as a way to escape the responsibility for what comes out of their mouths. Using humiliation or doing anything demeaning is a dangerous thing and can backfire as far as wins/losses as well as the well-being of the child. If it is indeed used as part of some kind of program, it should be done with a sense of responsibility and an understanding of all the ramifications.

 

Just my thoughts.

Edited January 5, 2007 by philtenn

[coachgat]

For me, this has been an extremely interesting thread with valid points given by both sides of the argument. It really represents the conflict I've had about this subject in my own head between self-esteem of the player and the need to teach the player that they must perform regardless of how well-meaning their intent.

 

To me, the question that hasn't been answered is, what is the purpose of your child playing basketball and is the coach aligned with that purpose?

 

There's a lot involved with the first part of that question but I'm going right to the point so forgive me if I seem to ignore a lot of very important side issues: If, as part of your child's basketball experience, you want them to learn to perform even under unbelievable pressure, then being yelled and screamed at (along with a foundation of positive regard ala coachgat's and others' points) is probably going to have to be part of that experience. The mind and body learns to deal with stress by being put under stress. If someone questions your value as a player even through humiliation, then you (the player) have the opportunity to learn how to fend off your own questions about your own value as a player when, for instance, you're standing at the free throw line in your opponent's gym and everybody and their dogs are screaming all kinds of things at you as you shoot to win the game. Now, for this to work, the coach has to have already developed a trusting relationship with the player and the coach probably needs to demonstrate respect and a positive regard in other ways to his/her players. Many professions such as in the military or law enforcement will use this approach to help their people perform under the worst stress.

 

Both sides on this thread are right and both are wrong, in my opinion. As far as the answer to the particular incident that was introduced in the beginning it depends on why that particular parent wants their child playing basketball. There is no doubt that what occurred was a challenge to the child's self-esteem. How damaging it was depends on the child's psychological hardiness before the yelling and the kind of realtionship the coach had with the child. If the purpose of the child's participation is self-esteem with little regard for performance then there really was no place for the yelling. If it's about performing regardless of what's happening in you and around you, then the yelling/humiliation is not so much an issue and could even turn out to be helpful if handled correctly.

 

Finally, I wonder how often coaches yell at their players as part of some plan or strategy to develop or motivate the player and how often they're yelling because they lost their temper. I think one looks significantly different from the other. Please don't take my comments above to mean that yelling/humiliating players should be done freely. It should be done, if done at all, with some forethought, or otherwise the most appropriate thing to do after the yelling is to apologize. Too many coaches use the idea of yelling to toughen up their players as a way to escape the responsibility for what comes out of their mouths. Using humiliation or doing anything demeaning is a dangerous thing and can backfire as far as wins/losses as well as the well-being of the child. If it is indeed used as part of some kind of program, it should be done with a sense of responsibility and an understanding of all the ramifications.

 

Just my thoughts.

 

 

As always, great post!